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Twins drafting strategy: Old And Busted already?

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#41 Darius

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Posted 10 February 2020 - 01:13 PM

I don’t mind the strategy. It seems to be take toolsy young position players with unlimited upside early, and then target the high-upside young pitchers that fall.

Seems like a pretty good way to get the best of both worlds, rather than one or the other.

Since pitching is a total crap shoot, I’d rather take the hitters and minimize the risk associated with a first round high school pitcher.

It’s ridiculous to bring college pitchers like Strasburg into the conversation. Clearly, if the Twins had a #1 pick and a guy like that was sitting there, they’d take him.

#42 Sconnie

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Posted 10 February 2020 - 08:06 PM

Any drafting strategy that suggests to pick the best athlete over the biggest organizational need is faulty imho...

with 6 years of development and the long history like Plouffe of being drafted a SS and being a productive major leaguer at 3B, I think looking for tools and creating/developing your depth makes a lot of sense, at least when drafting high schoolers.

College players, sure draft for need.

#43 Riverbrian

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Posted 10 February 2020 - 08:18 PM

 

It's not that they won't sign the expensive FA starters, it's that in many cases they're never even given the option to seriously negotiate.Wheeler and Bumgarner wouldn't even listen to offers.From what I understand, Strasburg wanted to stay with the Nats, and was only a free agent because he had an opt out, and was reasonably certain Washington would give him a better deal if they were forced to.Cole brought a sign to his press conference that pretty much confirmed where he wanted to sign (pun intended), aside from which the Twins were never going to offer 9 and $324M, nor were any other teams.That leaves Ryu as the only "expensive FA starter" left, and had we signed him, we surely wouldn't have signed Donaldson.Ryu has 7.3 WAR since 2015, Donaldson has 26.7.

 

Screen-Shot-2019-12-18-at-112534-AM-568f

 

I agree with your post 

 

However, when it comes to the final result. "Can't" as opposed to "Won't" is no consolation and the same result. 

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#44 Cap'n Piranha

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 11:58 AM

 

I agree with your post 

 

However, when it comes to the final result. "Can't" as opposed to "Won't" is no consolation and the same result. 

 

Agreed--whether it's can't or won't, Gerrit Cole still pitches for the Yankees, not the Twins.The distinction matters only on an online forum when the question centers around if Falvine is doing a good job improving the team/organization.I will fault people for not doing what they can, but I will not fault people for not doing what they can't.

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#45 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 01:01 PM

 

You can't predict future needs in baseball. That's why most teams take the best player available. The exception is some teams will only take the best college player.

 

I 100% guarantee that every team will need at least one more starting pitcher than is currently on their roster. 100%.

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It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#46 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 01:02 PM

 

I don’t mind the strategy. It seems to be take toolsy young position players with unlimited upside early, and then target the high-upside young pitchers that fall.

Seems like a pretty good way to get the best of both worlds, rather than one or the other.

Since pitching is a total crap shoot, I’d rather take the hitters and minimize the risk associated with a first round high school pitcher.

It’s ridiculous to bring college pitchers like Strasburg into the conversation. Clearly, if the Twins had a #1 pick and a guy like that was sitting there, they’d take him.

 

then how do you get pitching? Clearly it is harder to sign or trade for than we think......And no, pitching is not a total crapshoot.

It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#47 howieramone2

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 01:26 PM

I 100% guarantee, each and every team's biggest need is not starting pitching.

#48 Cap'n Piranha

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 03:05 PM

 

then how do you get pitching? Clearly it is harder to sign or trade for than we think......And no, pitching is not a total crapshoot.

 

I'd guess something along the lines of 20% availability of payroll, 20% ability to develop prospects, and 60% luck.

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#49 Riverbrian

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 03:20 PM

 

then how do you get pitching? Clearly it is harder to sign or trade for than we think......And no, pitching is not a total crapshoot.

 

As Twins

 

Our best chance is development. Either developing from the ground up or developing via significant improvement from an acquired asset.

 

From those two options... it's going to be development that produces that lights out guy in both scenerios.  

 

I've come to the conclusion we will not sign or trade for someone that is... ready made. 

 

That's why the Perez crap last year and the Bailey (Whatever he is going to be this year) frustrates me so.

 

Mediocre pitchers who are not performing can't stand in the way of developing someone who might perform. 

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#50 gunnarthor

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 03:34 PM

 

Who's "account?" 

 

Yours?

Why are you so pissy? We do this every year. Somebody says the Twins reached and then we have to post all this crap about Jay being drafted appropriately. It's not enough that Jay didn't work, it has to be the Twins were dumb just to draft him. 

 

"Jay spent his college career as a relief pitcher, but he ranked near the top of the draft class because most scouts believe that he has the mix of pitches necessary to become a starting pitcher in the Majors. Kiley McDaniel of Fangraphs rated Jay as the sixth-best prospect in the draft, while Jay rated ninth on the lists of MLB.com (Jim Callis and Jonathan Mayo) and ESPN (Keith Law). Baseball America ranked Jay as the No. 13 prospect in the draft.

 

McDaniel ranked Jay second among all pitchers in this year’s class, writing that he flashes three plus pitches and held his velocity well in multi-inning relief stints. McDaniel feels that Jay could feature three 60-grade (or better) pitches in the future. Law notes that Jay could end up in the middle of a big league rotation and has four pitches, though he figures to be a three-pitch guy in pro ball. MLB.com has Jay’s velocity in the 93-95 mph range and topping out at 98. Callis and Mayo prefer Jay’s slider to his curve. BA clocks Jay’s slider in the low 80s and notes that some scouts have given it “wipeout” designation."

https://www.mlbtrade...-tyler-jay.html

 

Heck, in one mock draft, BA had Jay going #1.

https://www.mlbdaily...super-regionals

 

Fangraphs had him going third

https://blogs.fangra...ock-draft-v2-0/

 

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#51 ewen21

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 05:04 PM

 

As Twins

 

Our best chance is development. Either developing from the ground up or developing via significant improvement from an acquired asset.

 

From those two options... it's going to be development that produces that lights out guy in both scenerios.  

I did not even read the rest.THIS is what the HECK this organization has to do.

 

I am so sick and tired of the free agent pitcher charade year after year.It is beyond stupid to sign guys like Cole or Strasburg.All this squealing and whining about it made my stomach acids flow.How stupid would it be to pony up all that money for a guy like Cole and then turns out to be a dud?A vast majority of the time you don't come close to getting the value for your dollar.

 

Can we raise some damn pitching just once?We have to be among the worst teams in the last twenty seasons with regard to drafting and developing pitchers.We didn't draft Liriano, we went rule 5 for Johan.All we have is Garza and Berrios (throw in Gibson if you want, but big whoop).In twenty years!!!!

 

Enough of this free agent ace garbage.Please let's learn how to draft and develop pitchers so we can have stable of cost controlled young arms.  


#52 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 05:09 PM

 

As Twins

 

Our best chance is development. Either developing from the ground up or developing via significant improvement from an acquired asset.

 

From those two options... it's going to be development that produces that lights out guy in both scenerios.  

 

I've come to the conclusion we will not sign or trade for someone that is... ready made. 

 

That's why the Perez crap last year and the Bailey (Whatever he is going to be this year) frustrates me so.

 

Mediocre pitchers who are not performing can't stand in the way of developing someone who might perform. 

 

That, to me, means you can't keep passing on pitchers until your third or later pick every year......unless you are somehow just better at this than everyone else (which they might be, but so far, we have no evidence one way or the other).

It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#53 old nurse

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 08:10 PM

 

All those names: Burdi, Jay, Cederoth, Reed, Curtiss, Stewart, Eades, Gonsalves, Slegers, Bard, Chargois, Summers, Williams, Boyd and Boer.

None drafted by the current regime

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