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Front Page: Every Team Wants Zack Wheeler

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#201 howieramone2

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 10:03 AM

 

 

Not really. They still pay the $100M he's worth to them. They just add a $25M Stupidity Tax for not having developed their own Wheeler themselves.

 

Free Agency is all about paying the Stupidity Tax.

Two wrongs don't make a right. If there truly was a Stupidity Tax, by the time it was our favorite teams turn to pay, Twins Daily would be a distant memory.


#202 birdwatcher

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:12 AM

 

Matt Wisler says hi.

 

 

Tyler Duffey says hi too. Both mid-round draft choices who struggled mightily. Maybe he goes the way of Matt Magill. Maybe he goes the way of Tyler Duffey. He's exactly the kind of chance good clubs take if they have any conviction and confidence in scouting and development.

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#203 birdwatcher

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:43 AM

 

My least favorite whiney phrase: "trying hard."

First of all, you don't know they did, even by your own definition.

Second, more importantly, "they tried hard" is a fancy way of describing failure. The end result of trying hard and failing is...failing.

Exactly the same as not trying. Exactly.

And spare me the "lots of FAs dont work out" line, too. Unless you believe Falvine made zero effort to sign Wheeler, because they believe he will fail, that's just post mortem rationalization. If they DID "try hard" then they believe he will be successful.

Not signing Wheeler is a failure. A lost battle in the war.

 

We agree then that the phrase "try hard" should be eliminated from the TD vocabulary. I don't recall defining effort, just have disdain for false, overly harsh, and unfair negative portrayals, of anyone.

 

I accept that you choose to focus exclusively on results. Like 101 wins, right?;)

 

Some of us get enjoyment from theorizing about the decision processes as well. So spare me the "only thing that matters is results", and please refrain from implying that, if a guy like me wants to theorize about what might have been the factors involved in, for example, the Wheeler negotiations, that it's post mortem rationalization on my part. There's a difference between seeking an understanding, having a high tolerance for mistakes, and making excuses.

 

You want to say Falvey failed because he failed to close the deal with Wheeler. I have no objection to that, my friend. I agree in fact. One can acknowledge a failure without being critical. I think we have a friendly disagreement about how much criticism is warranted in the Wheeler case, and as we know, we'll find other similar opportunities in the future,;)

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#204 USAFChief

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:44 AM

 

Yes, the same one that employed Jason Tyner at DH.:rolleyes:

And didn't have Liriano.

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#205 USAFChief

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:48 AM

 

You've defined "impact pitching" too narrowly. You've confused it with buying the most expensive thing on the menu. By the end of the 2020 season, we will be able to look back and see a dozen or more examples of "impact pitching", many of which are not apparent at this moment.

I agree.

 

The problem is, you need to name them before the 2020 season, not after. 

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#206 USAFChief

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:49 AM

 

Not signing Wheeler is a failure. A lost battle in the war.

 

We agree then that the phrase "try hard" should be eliminated from the TD vocabulary. I don't recall defining effort, just have disdain for false, overly harsh, and unfair negative portrayals, of anyone.

 

I accept that you choose to focus exclusively on results. Like 101 wins, right?;)

 

Some of us get enjoyment from theorizing about the decision processes as well. So spare me the "only thing that matters is results", and please refrain from implying that, if a guy like me wants to theorize about what might have been the factors involved in, for example, the Wheeler negotiations, that it's post mortem rationalization on my part. There's a difference between seeking an understanding, having a high tolerance for mistakes, and making excuses.

 

You want to say Falvey failed because he failed to close the deal with Wheeler. I have no objection to that, my friend. I agree in fact. One can acknowledge a failure without being critical. I think we have a friendly disagreement about how much criticism is warranted in the Wheeler case, and as we know, we'll find other similar opportunities in the future,;)

Sadly, we won't have many such disagreements prior to the 2020 season, I fear. ;)

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#207 birdwatcher

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 11:59 AM

 

Sadly, we won't have many such disagreements prior to the 2020 season, I fear. ;)

 

 

Yeah, the FA situation is looking grim. Our pal Mike Sixel may have been right in his concern about rebuilding the rotation for 2020, we'll see.


#208 prouster

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 12:00 PM

 

And didn't have Liriano.

???

 

https://www.baseball...liriafr01.shtml


#209 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 12:03 PM

 

 

He's right. Liriano didn't pitch in the postseason for the Twins until 2009. By this time he had already blown out his arm and had TJ surgery.


#210 spycake

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 12:04 PM

 

The group that got swept in the ALDS didn't have Liriano, as he was injured.


#211 USAFChief

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 12:05 PM

 

In which ALDS did get swept with both Santana and Liriano in the rotation?

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#212 prouster

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 12:45 PM

In which ALDS did get swept with both Santana and Liriano in the rotation?


Right. I forgot 2006 was Liriano’s surgery year.
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#213 Riverbrian

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 02:30 PM

 

Not really. They still pay the $100M he's worth to them. They just add a $25M Stupidity Tax for not having developed their own Wheeler themselves.

 

Free Agency is all about paying the Stupidity Tax.

 

This is the best description of free agency on the planet. 

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#214 Riverbrian

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Posted 05 December 2019 - 02:33 PM

I'm a value guy... I frequently question why you would pay a guy millions if a guy making 600K can produce the same.

However... when it comes to free agency. You can’t approach it with a spreadsheet.

If you want the guy, you got to outbid the other guy.

The guy's agent and the other guys bidding for him may not be aware or care what your spreadsheet says.

Hard lines will force you to sign your 6th choice instead of your 1st choice.
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