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Wolfson: More Twins Firings

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#1 Seth Stohs

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:29 PM

According to KSTP and 1500espn's Darren "Doogie" Wolfson, the firings at One Twins Way are not being limited to on-field personnel.

[COLOR=#333333]Not only did the [/COLOR]#MNTwins[COLOR=#333333] fire VP Marketing Patrick Klinger, but told they also let go marketing maven Heidi Sammon. She ran TwinsFest.[/COLOR]


I would think this would be surprising as the Twins have had some terrific marketing efforts for years.

#2 Winston Smith

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:22 PM

They seem to be going after the people that have the least to do with the poor team on the field.

May all our prospects be All Stars and the beer be free.


#3 mike wants wins

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:27 PM

Well, this is surprising. Any changes in scouts yet?

#4 YourHouseIsMyHouse

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:29 PM

They seem to be going after the people that have the least to do with the poor team on the field.


Best comment I've seen in a while. Agree 100%. Maybe the declining attendance and therefore worse marketing is a result of the terrible team?

#5 LaBombo

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:29 PM

I would think this would be surprising as the Twins have had some terrific marketing efforts for years.


Agreed. That seemed to be one of the most consistent strengths of the franchise. When a steep decline in attendance exactly corresponds to a steep decline in on-field performance, marketing is the last thing I'd be worried about.

#6 Jim Crikket

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:33 PM

These would seem to fall under the direction of someone other than Terry Ryan, so I question what they would have to do with improving performance on the field. One would hope that Dave St. Peter and the other brass are smart enough to know that when the product on the field sucks for a couple of years, it's probably not the Marketing team's fault if ticket demand falls dramatically. At the same time, it could be argued that almost anyone can run a successful marketing organization when times are good. The test of abilities comes when times get tougher. There are independent marketing firms that specialize in dealing with "tough times" and I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins "outsource" more (if not all) of their marketing function going forward.
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
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#7 LaBombo

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:38 PM

These would seem to fall under the direction of someone other than Terry Ryan, so I question what they would have to do with improving performance on the field. One would hope that Dave St. Peter and the other brass are smart enough to know that when the product on the field sucks for a couple of years, it's probably not the Marketing team's fault if ticket demand falls dramatically. At the same time, it could be argued that almost anyone can run a successful marketing organization when times are good. The test of abilities comes when times get tougher. There are independent marketing firms that specialize in dealing with "tough times" and I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins "outsource" more (if not all) of their marketing function going forward.


My point was that obviously a crappy product is harder to sell, and I'd expend most of my energy improving the product rather than the marketing. If the Twins need to revamp their marketing strategy with a "tough times" outside firm, that would tell me all I need to know about how they view their chances of contending next year, and quite a bit about the year after.

#8 nicksaviking

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 01:58 PM

Anyone who can't parley the marketability of Jeff Gray and Esmerling Vasquez into a sellout crowd needs to be canned in my opinion.

Get to know 'em!

#9 Jim Crikket

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:00 PM

And my point is that improving one doesn't necessarily preclude you from also improving the other. Terry Ryan's focus is on improving the product on the field. Another part of the organization is responsible for marketing. If the product on the field does improve, that will help sell tickets. While that makes marketing easier, it isn't the only factor that sells tickets.

My own take, based on the limited exposure I had to the Twins marketing efforts, is that they produced some clever TV and radio spots, but I'm not sure they alone would cause many people to consider going to games (and I thought some of them were downright amateurish). I have no idea how well the marketing folks worked with local businesses to generate additional revenues or performed any other aspect of their jobs. Apparently, someone thought it could be done better.

For the Twins to be successful financially, they need both the "product development" and "marketing" sides of the house to do their jobs well.
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
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[COLOR=#b22222]~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~[/COLOR]

#10 twinsnorth49

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:06 PM

Wow, there sure is a lot of stretching going on here. Just because they let a couple of people go in the Marketing dept. means they are expending most of their energy in that direction, as opposed to the team on the field? Can you walk and chew gum at the same time? Besides, Crikket is right, this has nothing to do with Ryan.

I don't quite get how changing marketing personnel is an indication of how a team feels about it's chances in the near future.

#11 MWLFan

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:29 PM

First-What stat works here for a marketing Guy. WAR or VORP? Do we need to break out the Win Shares for various VP's?

Second- There are a myraid of reasons for a person let go besides performance. Speculation is for us uniformed is pointless. (But it can be fun if you are not the one being let go.)

#12 Winston Smith

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:32 PM

Likely they just didn't mention the 2014 All Star game being played at Target Field, get seating priority by renewing your season tickets now, enough times!
They really should have an ad on this site for the 2014 All Star game played at Target Field with ticket priority if you renew or purchase season tickets.
Utter failure on their part.

May all our prospects be All Stars and the beer be free.


#13 PseudoSABR

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:35 PM

As Jim insinuated, I also doubt TR had anything to do with this firing and wasn't consulted for it. Any connection made between front office firings and the business side of the Twins is specious at best. That people use this as a sounding board for "The Twins don't know what they're doing! See!" routine is all too typical.

Edited by PseudoSABR, 25 October 2012 - 02:41 PM.


#14 glanzer

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:36 PM

This news is a shame. I had a nice experience with Mr. Klinger a few years back when he sent me the mp3 to the Hormel Weiner Winner song to use at my wedding dance.

#15 johnnydakota

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:02 PM

These would seem to fall under the direction of someone other than Terry Ryan, so I question what they would have to do with improving performance on the field. One would hope that Dave St. Peter and the other brass are smart enough to know that when the product on the field sucks for a couple of years, it's probably not the Marketing team's fault if ticket demand falls dramatically. At the same time, it could be argued that almost anyone can run a successful marketing organization when times are good. The test of abilities comes when times get tougher. There are independent marketing firms that specialize in dealing with "tough times" and I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins "outsource" more (if not all) of their marketing function going forward.


wouldnt that apply for a pitching coach and manager as well?

#16 mike wants wins

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:05 PM

frankly, I have not been a fan of the commercials, so I hope they fire their ad agency also....

#17 Jim Crikket

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:21 PM

These would seem to fall under the direction of someone other than Terry Ryan, so I question what they would have to do with improving performance on the field. One would hope that Dave St. Peter and the other brass are smart enough to know that when the product on the field sucks for a couple of years, it's probably not the Marketing team's fault if ticket demand falls dramatically. At the same time, it could be argued that almost anyone can run a successful marketing organization when times are good. The test of abilities comes when times get tougher. There are independent marketing firms that specialize in dealing with "tough times" and I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins "outsource" more (if not all) of their marketing function going forward.


wouldnt that apply for a pitching coach and manager as well?


Well, I've never heard of any third party that provides managers and pitching coaches to teams wishing to outsource those responsibilities, but it might be an interesting business to get in to... you hire all of the guys who just seem to get recycled from one team to another and sell their services out to teams that can just send them back to you in exchange for someone else when they aren't working out. Interesting idea.

But on the off chance that you're actually asking if the "test of abilities comes when times get tougher" also applies to managers and pitching coaches, the answer is "absolutely." But again, evaluating performance of managers/pitching coaches and Marketing staff have nothing whatsoever to do with one another and it's highly unlikely that the same person(s) is/are even doing the evaluating.
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
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#18 spideyo

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:47 PM

Well dammit! I just had a long talk with Heidi a few weeks ago and it looked like she was interested in hiring me to join her department.

#19 70charger

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:49 PM

This news is a shame. I had a nice experience with Mr. Klinger a few years back when he sent me the mp3 to the Hormel Weiner Winner song to use at my wedding dance.


Ha! ....Wait, what?

Oh, the innuendo.

#20 Seth Stohs

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 03:56 PM

These would seem to fall under the direction of someone other than Terry Ryan, so I question what they would have to do with improving performance on the field. One would hope that Dave St. Peter and the other brass are smart enough to know that when the product on the field sucks for a couple of years, it's probably not the Marketing team's fault if ticket demand falls dramatically. At the same time, it could be argued that almost anyone can run a successful marketing organization when times are good. The test of abilities comes when times get tougher. There are independent marketing firms that specialize in dealing with "tough times" and I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins "outsource" more (if not all) of their marketing function going forward.


You are correct... this would be out of the realm for Ryan's doing.

#21 Parker Hageman

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 04:21 PM

This news is a shame. I had a nice experience with Mr. Klinger a few years back when he sent me the mp3 to the Hormel Weiner Winner song to use at my wedding dance.


As someone who is getting married next year, I demand you send me this .mp3.

#22 mike wants wins

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 04:41 PM

Congrats Parker. Marriage is awesome.
Lighten up Francis....

#23 twinsnorth49

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 05:29 PM

Congrats Parker. Marriage is awesome.



See, now that's the problem with internet chat, I can't possibly tell if you're joking and I'm frightened you're not.

#24 Twins Twerp

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 05:56 PM

Are we talking about a sex scandal in the Marketing Department of the Minnesota Twins?

#25 twinsnorth49

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 06:05 PM

Well, Spideyo did say that Ms. Sammon was interested in him, perhaps you're on to something here.

#26 JB_Iowa

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 08:01 PM

Well, this wasn't what I expected to read (or hoped to read) when I opened this thread.

Just hoping that they demote Dave St. Peter back to marketing and get a new President.

#27 Rosterman

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 09:01 PM

What was wrong with the Twins commercials?
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#28 LaBombo

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 09:49 PM

And my point is that improving one doesn't necessarily preclude you from also improving the other. Terry Ryan's focus is on improving the product on the field. Another part of the organization is responsible for marketing. If the product on the field does improve, that will help sell tickets. While that makes marketing easier, it isn't the only factor that sells tickets.

My own take, based on the limited exposure I had to the Twins marketing efforts, is that they produced some clever TV and radio spots, but I'm not sure they alone would cause many people to consider going to games (and I thought some of them were downright amateurish). I have no idea how well the marketing folks worked with local businesses to generate additional revenues or performed any other aspect of their jobs. Apparently, someone thought it could be done better.

For the Twins to be successful financially, they need both the "product development" and "marketing" sides of the house to do their jobs well.


Guess I missed the part where I mentioned Terry Ryan. Maybe you can show me. And your belief that the realization by St. Peter that the marketing was substandard just happened to coincide with a steep plunge in attendance and train wreck performance on the field is suspect at best.

#29 gilesferrell

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 11:51 PM

Wow. I would never have thought the marketing folks got the ax too. I thought their commercials were still top notch this past season.
"They are the team Minnesota deserves, not the one they need right now."

#30 PseudoSABR

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 12:43 AM

Wait. We're endorsing marriage now? Wtf guys.