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#21 Monkeypaws

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 10:20 AM

Are there any front offices that haven't yet embraced advanced stats?

Because Eddie's baseball card stats, the kind I grew up on, are outstanding:

32 HR, 109 RBI, .500 slugging.

 

I do think it would create a hole in the lineup to get rid of him; it's already pretty heavy on right handed batters, and he routinely delivers big hits. Oh, and the swagger is real.

 

 

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#22 JLease

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 10:28 AM

 

I'm still scratching my head wondering what Beane saw in Grossman.

 

he takes walks and he's cheap. Can play both corner OF spots at need, DH, and can hit in any spot in the order without complaint. I wouldn't want to start a Grossman, but there have been years where we sure could have used him as a 4th OF. The upside is limited, but the floor is pretty good.

 

I agree with Seth; you don't deal rosario just to deal him, especially because it risks your depth if Rooker/Kirilloff/Larnach isn't ready to seize the opportunity. Wade & Cave are decent enough players...who are best suited to be 4th OFs, I think. We don't know for sure how much wade can really hit in MLB and if he can't he won't be as effective drawing walks. Cave looks like he might be better than Rosario with his more patient approach, but he also might get exposed with more ABs.

 

I think there might be some good partners out there, but I'm not exactly in "trade him now" mode. Unless we add another guy to the roster who seems like he might be a little crazy. You only should have 1 of those. :P

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#23 KGB

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 10:41 AM

 

I'm still scratching my head wondering what Beane saw in Grossman.

He saw a Gold Grove Finalist 


#24 Hrbowski

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 11:28 AM

LaMonte Wade is categorically not a superior defender to Rosario.

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#25 birdwatcher

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 11:31 AM

I'm feeling a hint of deja vu. Last off-season, I distinctly remember more than a few opinions that Kepler was who we thought he was, and therefore should be dangled out there for whatever pitching help he might be able to muster, but hey, lower your expectations, people. He won't get us much. A common justification was that Cave might be the better player.

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#26 Mike Sixel

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 01:15 PM

 

I'm feeling a hint of deja vu. Last off-season, I distinctly remember more than a few opinions that Kepler was who we thought he was, and therefore should be dangled out there for whatever pitching help he might be able to muster, but hey, lower your expectations, people. He won't get us much. A common justification was that Cave might be the better player.

 

Kepler was cheaper and younger......so I'm not sure how it's the same.

 

I doubt they deal Eddie, but the OP was realistic, thanks,

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It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#27 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 02:27 PM

You don't trade starting players off of your team when you are contending unless it brings back someone that helps you win now. If Rosario is traded, it MUST be for someone they can plug into the rotation or the back end of the bullpen. If that takes other prospects to do so, fine. If not, then go ahead and just write his name down on your lineup card for next season. 

 

Just silly the amount of people that seem to want to be rid of this guy and would be willing to give him up for not much return. Crazy IMO. Don't worry, your dream minor league outfielders will be here hitting .215 soon enough. 

Edited by Battle ur tail off, 01 November 2019 - 02:27 PM.

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#28 LA VIkes Fan

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 02:31 PM

 

I'm feeling a hint of deja vu. Last off-season, I distinctly remember more than a few opinions that Kepler was who we thought he was, and therefore should be dangled out there for whatever pitching help he might be able to muster, but hey, lower your expectations, people. He won't get us much. A common justification was that Cave might be the better player.

I do too and I was one of those people. I was wrong about Kepler and I think many here are wrong about Rosario. I think Rosario is worth keeping unless he can bring good pitching and I don't think he can at this point. I might move him from 4th to 6th in the order, but I'd like to see him playing 150 games for the Twins next year. We do not have anyone as good or better.

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#29 birdwatcher

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 08:18 PM

 

Kepler was cheaper and younger......so I'm not sure how it's the same.

 

I doubt they deal Eddie, but the OP was realistic, thanks,

 

 

The three things that are the same are thoughts that we're pretty much seeing the best we're going to see of the player, that Cave is an upgrade, and that the player won't fetch much of a solution to our pitching needs.

 

The OP doesn't express this opinion. A few others have however.

 

You're probably right that it's not exactly the same. Kepler is turning out to be special. 

Edited by birdwatcher, 01 November 2019 - 08:20 PM.


#30 DocBauer

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 09:25 PM

Eddie is a very talented and productive ballplayer. Eddie will only be 28yr old in 2020 unless I am mistaken. Eddie could be a STAR for the next 3-5yrs if he just matures a little bit more and learns a little more discipline through experience. Eddie could be gone by 2021, maybe, by Kirilloff, Larnach, Rooker, if things play right. Unless he is part of a package to bring a front line SP, his value is staying with the Twins for 2020. We will see after next season what happens. We could see someone blow the doors off next season and make him expendable.
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#31 Jham

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 07:34 AM

The focus of these discussions always seems to fall 1 consideration short. We look at Rosie and what we need, and what he would return, and how we could replace him. That's a reasonable start. But we really need to know hom much more AK et al would return to considered trading anyone.

The consensus seems to be that he won't draw a ton of interest. (I disagree but more below). The analysis can take 1 more step and ask if the replacement pieces could draw a better return. If Rosie only returned a bottom of ther rotation salary dump but Kiriloff gets us the controllable midrotation piece we need we should think about it. Trading Rosie's 2 years to save enough money to pay a good pitcher maybe 1 more year doesn't seem realistic. Trading a prospect for a better return and potentially cash relief seems like a better option if it played out that way.

I think Rosie's value is undersold. Teams are trying to avoid long expensive deals for less than elite talent. The idea is to go big on superstars and finance over a long contract. Then go either: 1) cheap and controllable, or 2) expensive but short term. The Twins built a 102 win division winner using contracts like Rosie's. Basically a 1 year deal with a 2nd year option. Even though the AAV is around $9mil, the guaranteed commitment is low and easily shed. Teams like the Twins who want strong production from veteran players in their prime look at the short contract as a plus. Budget minded contenders are in play. But so are big spenders who are always looking to make incremental improvements (the same way we're talking voluntarily making incremental downgrades). Teams that operate near the luxury tax level but need to dip down below every few seasons to reset the clock could also find Rosario's contract beneficial.

Rosario was a vote in candidate for the all star team. He struggled in the 2nd half while battling injuries. If Buck and Kep stay healthy, I think he hits the IL for awhile and continues hitting. Unlike those 2, Rosie stayed out there. I think our view of his season is skewed by his poor 2nd half which makes his above average numbers feel average and his average numbers feel dismal.
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#32 Kato87

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 12:51 PM

 

I get narrowing down the list, but I think there’s a few good possibilities in here:
NYY, BOS, HOU, LAD, ATL, CHC, WAS, PHI, NYM, STL, COL

I agree especially NYY and BOS... NYY Gardner is FA, Hicks' injury history, BOS has a goal to be below luxury tax; On MLB.com rumors mentioned BOS salary dumping.Betts, Bradley, Martinez and Price possibly being traded.I would have interested in Price 3yrs/96m remaining.At minimum both teams have both OF and DH needs.Not sure what other pieces would be needed for Price. 


#33 ewen21

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 05:10 PM

 

"Jake Cave and LaMonte Wade, Jr. have both proven capable of filling in until a prospect arrives."

 

Can you please explain what Wade has done to be considered a capable fill in with all of his 56 major league at bats?

Not sure what the big attraction about Wade is.He is a AAAA player in my estimation

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#34 twinfan

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 09:06 PM

The Twins need to see who returns from their starters first. What is wrong with Dyson? He was damaged goods but can be an effective reliever. Gallo is an all or nothing guy that isn't worth much so I can see Texas moving him or Rosario (if they get him) to DH. Oakland and Arizona seem to be the best possible places after Texas. However, I would not trade him. We don't even know how our offense will look next year and it cannot equal this year. So Eddie had a slightly less year while others had a better year. I see both going in opposite directions- Eddie improving while others (like Garver) slipping. I just didn't like Eddie's approach against the Yankees since it looked like he was swinging wildly. Maybe he was feeling too much pressure.  


#35 darin617

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Posted 02 November 2019 - 11:20 PM

 

Will be curious to see if the new ballpark in Arlington plays the same as the 2019 one. I would think it would be very similar. Joey Gallo played CF for them a lot this season. And, while Rosario isn't a great defensive outfielder, not sure he wouldn't be a better defensive OF than Gallo (though not sure he would be either).  

 

I think he stays. I don't think that the Twins should just trade him just to trade him. They should get a solid #3 starter for him, a reliable guy and maybe a prospect, or a couple of good prospects for him. Otherwise, just accept the HR and the hot steaks along with the wild moments and the frustrating ABs. 

Absolutely no way the Twins could get a #3 starter for him. Teams can always find players cheap to come in and hit 25+ hr's (more if they keep juiced ball) for well under 5M a year. Maybe the best thing for Eddie would be a change of scenery and hopefully he could buy into what a hitting coach could help him with plate discipline. He also needs to improve on his defense BIG TIME. 




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