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Front Page: Twins Game Recap (9/12): Twins Drop Series to Nationals, Cleveland 3.5 Back

kyle gibson jonathan schoop nelson cruz mitch garver
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#41 Original Whizzinator

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 11:39 AM

I agree that Stewart should only be used in a blow out and should be moved off the forty one way or another after the season. If he makes it back to the organization again I would only let him back on the forty if he seriously earned it. Overall this has been the most fun Twins season in a long time and the rest of this year is going to be a ride! Go Twins!
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#42 h2oface

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 01:04 PM

 

Well, the 6th run was charged to Gibson and scored on a passed ball by Garver -- so maybe if the bullpen *and* catching holds, it would have been a 6-5 win. Otherwise, if just the bullpen, a 6-6 tie -- just like in Japan!

 

Call it my own advanced stat. Inherited runners scored I credit to the pitcher who came in to relieve and didn't. They were on the mound. It is an outdated custom to charge the pitcher that has left the game, in my opinion, especially with two outs. Plus, the target was low, and on the ground as he threw it, and Stashak completely blew the pitch, and missed the target by 4 feet. Sure, Garver should have still caught it, and it is an unearned run, but Stashak also loafed to the cover the plate, and if he was there, there could have been a play at the plate. But you are right, it was charged to Gibson, as if he made the play happen. 

 

Plus, there is no guarantee that the Nats would have used the same relievers that the Twins scored on. More for your refute. My point remains.... the relief choices were from Rochester, and a sad state of affairs, and another game seemingly given up on too soon, and now in a penant race that one cannot afford to give any game away for player development.


#43 h2oface

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 01:11 PM

 

....I will add one thing about Pineda - I do not want him back, talk about letting down your team.Such terrible timing and devastating impact. 

 

Pineda, as a team player, could have informed the FO and Baldelli about what was going on. Maybe he did. But it seems as everyone found out except Pineda and his agent just before the suspension, and after his last start. As these things go, he probably knew this was the final outcome before the trade deadline, too. That makes his choices and behavior exhibit even more a lack of being a good teammate and ultimately more selfish. Informed, the FO maybe would have been encouraged to actually do something about our starting pitching depth, you know..... since they are so awesome and innovative.

Edited by h2oface, 13 September 2019 - 01:14 PM.

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#44 yarnivek1972

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 01:13 PM

Call it my own advanced stat. Inherited runners scored I credit to the pitcher who came in to relieve and didn't. They were on the mound. It is an outdated custom to charge the pitcher that has left the game, in my opinion, especially with two outs. Plus, the target was low, and on the ground as he threw it, and Stashak completely blew the pitch, and missed the target by 4 feet. Sure, Garver should have still caught it, and it is an unearned run, but Stashak also loafed to the cover the plate, and if he was there, there could have been a play at the plate. But you are right, it was charged to Gibson, as if he made the play happen.

Plus, there is no guarantee that the Nats would have used the same relievers that the Twins scored on. More for your refute. My point remains.... the relief choices were from Rochester, and a sad state of affairs, and another game seemingly given up on too soon, and now in a penant race that one cannot afford to give any game away for player development.


I realize that you later emphasized “with two outs” but I certainly don’t think it is fair to “charge” them to the reliever. What about a guy who comes into bases loaded, no outs?Say he induces a first pitch run scoring double play and then gets a strike out. I think any team takes that outcome. Is it really fair to “charge” him with that run?

That’s what the IR/IS stats are for.
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#45 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 01:25 PM

I was at the game last night. Gibson was not sharp at all. He was hit hard, everything off the bat was a rocket. His pace in the game is also painfully slow and doesn't attack hitters. 

 

Flat out, we need some of our guys to get healthy. The lineup they had out there last night had 2-3 automatic outs in it and with our starting pitching being what it is, we can't have that. 


#46 Mike Sixel

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 02:11 PM

Or maybe it’s just too early for these guys - remember how we rushed Hicks and Buxton to the majors before they were ready? I would have called up Rooker, he should be healthy now.


We do know LaMarre isn't good, but he's here. We don't know with those two. That's the point, always choosing the least risk.

It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#47 h2oface

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 02:18 PM

 

I realize that you later emphasized “with two outs” but I certainly don’t think it is fair to “charge” them to the reliever. What about a guy who comes into bases loaded, no outs?Say he induces a first pitch run scoring double play and then gets a strike out. I think any team takes that outcome. Is it really fair to “charge” him with that run?

That’s what the IR/IS stats are for.

 

Yup. I would look at that different, and say no in my mind. 2 outs is the key. Not asking much, really, of the reliever. Just come in and relieve. Get a single out. Pitch a single clean at bat. Do your job. How about not throwing the ball 4 feet away from the target? I have a whole percentage applied idea that include situations with runners on which base and outs at time of entering game....to reflect on and improve ERA. Also the pitcher getting unearned runs when he let's his own runners in by throwing the ball away and makng his own throwing error on a pick off or just trying to throw out a runner. IR/IS is just a raw number, and it should be incorporated into ERA to better reflect what happened, I think. So many don't consider it, and don't include it, like this time, when they say the run was credited to...... of course it was as the system stands, but there was a huge contributing factor. Anyway..... for another thread. The main point was the choice of relief, mostly, and not trying to be that competitive too early in the game, and using the Rochester staff..... that Gibson did not let the run score, even though he allowed the runner on base was the aside that seems to be of more interest to argue about.


#48 Platoon

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 03:08 PM

Well, the 6th run was charged to Gibson and scored on a passed ball by Garver -- so maybe if the bullpen *and* catching holds, it would have been a 6-5 win. Otherwise, if just the bullpen, a 6-6 tie -- just like in Japan!

The amount of baseballs that make it to the backstop for this team is starting to get beyond acceptable. Whether passed, WP, or whoever the catcher is.
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#49 spycake

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 03:25 PM

The amount of baseballs that make it to the backstop for this team is starting to get beyond acceptable. Whether passed, WP, or whoever the catcher is.

download (2).jpeg
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#50 ashbury

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Posted 13 September 2019 - 05:34 PM

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"Acceptable" being also a charitable description of my imaging skilz.

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