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Article: Week in Review: Breaking Even

miguel sano taylor rogers trevor may jake odorizzi nick gordon
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#21 ashbury

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 12:43 PM

slapped in the face with the wet mop of success

I searched teh Intarwebs far and wide, and found no other instances of this phrase. Congratulations! You might have a viable Bulwer-Lytton entry on your hands!

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It is amazing how many eggs one can break without making a decent omelet.


#22 Nine of twelve

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 12:48 PM

 

56 wins, 33 losses going into the All Star break. Who predicted that? Not me, that's for sure. We had all become so accustomed to a losing team that even when we saw this stacked lineup in April, we assumed that all kinds of things would go wrong:

 

Schoop would not hit, play mediocre 2B.

Pineda would be terrible, probably blow out his elbow again.

Gonzo would look mediocre, nowhere near as good as Escobar.

Cruz would be a total has-been, spend most of his time on the IL.

Adrianza would field okay, but not hit his weight.

Buxton would struggle, stub a toe, miss half the season, then whiff at every outside curve.

Castro would struggle with the repaired knee, miss half the season on the IL, not hit a lick.

Garver would let every other pitch get by him, but hit pretty good.

Polanco would regress.

Sano would arrive in training camp 60 pounds overweight, then get hurt (almost true).

Cron would be a flash in the pan and an average first baseman.

Willians Astudillo would look like us, and play like us. Chubby people can't play...right??

Kepler would whiff and whiff, and look at best average in RF.

Rosario would be the only star, a single s'more on a dumpster fire.

Berrios would look average.

Gibson would pitch a couple good games, then implode.

Jake Cave would wind up playing CF most of the year, look pleasantly average.

Odorizzi would have another mediocre year. ERA about 4.5

Luis Arraez? Yeah, right. And I will stumble over a ten-pound emerald.

Martin Perez? Soft-tossing lefty with nothing special except control issues.

Devin Smeltzer? Never heard of him. Another slow-tossing lefty? Mercy!

Ryan Harper? Boom, boom, boom to his feeble curves and sub-90 heat. That was my prediction.

Tyler Duffey would get DFA'd. Head case with no effective pitches.

Blake Parker? More tics than Nathan, half the talent. Walk walk, boom boom boom.

Trevor May would have more walks and home runs than strike outs.

Magill and Morin? Did the FO give up on the season before the season? People said that.

Not sure I should mention Mejia, who has lived up to all our pessimism so far.

Taylor Rogers looked good last year, thus he would look bad this year.

Zach Littell would never make it, can't throw over 90.

Hildenberger would be the only reliable arm in the pen, but it wouldn't matter.
Kohl Stewart would look like a complete flop.

Lewis Thorpe would throw hard, but look like a nervous rookie.

Baldelli would be a nice guy tending a daycare full of spoiled and angry children.

 

Instead, we were slapped in the face with the wet mop of success, knocked off our feet, landing on the throne of first place in the American League. Somebody shoved a crown on our heads, and we were like, "Wait, what??" 

 

This is not to say the Twins have not suffered any problems this season. However, at some point, nearly every man on that list has played like an All Star. To the core of my being, shocked I was. Talked like Yoda I did. 

 

Now, as together we stand at the grim precipice of success, looking out over the terrifying prospect of a winning season, we must gather all our pessimism and hurl negation upon this vile aberration! No way, bruh! This ain't happenin'! We're the Minnesota Twinkies, man! We gotta real pretty ballpark, but that's where I draw the line! I like the Philly cheese steak, and the Goose Island is great, but I will not stand here and suffer through the false hope of a good looking baseball team!

 

Who's with me? We're all moving to Detroit, to cheer for Gardy and the Tigers! Yaaaaaaaa....

I liked this except for one small but significant thing. Goose Island is OK and all that, but they are a subsidiary of Annheuser-Busch. There are many very tasty local beers and ales available at Target Field and I always try to patronize the local brewmasters.

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#23 Nick Nelson

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 06:43 PM

 

I liked this except for one small but significant thing. Goose Island is OK and all that, but they are a subsidiary of Annheuser-Busch. There are many very tasty local beers and ales available at Target Field and I always try to patronize the local brewmasters.

The craft beer stand by Gate 34 is a haven. 

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#24 Kelly Vance

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 07:35 PM

Good piece Nick

 

Has anybody else thought Taylor Rogers could be a 1-2 starter?

No need to trade for a SP. Just give him a shot. Sign 2 relievers and move him to SP and Perez to the pen. He might be a 20 game winner next year.

Think about Berrios, Rogers, Odo as our big 3 in the playoffs.

They'll never do it... but should think about it.

 

As for my random comments on stuff Nick raised.

 

Sano's success started when he stopped trying to pull everything. Same story Buck.

Keps is not a leadoff hitter. He is a great #6.Buck needs to get that job now that he has shown he can stick.

 

3 years ago many of us said, "Let the kids play." They ain't bad. Youth is good. 

 

Several years ago when he left Boston I wanted the Twins to sign Francona. They'd have had to show Gardy the gate a year early, but we could have avoided that whole Molitor thing. Tito will have his team ready, injuries notwithstanding. He isn't going to concede anything. I think the Twins have their work cut out for them.

 

Bring it on. Its nice to be in a pennant race again. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


#25 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 08:06 PM

Good piece Nick

Has anybody else thought Taylor Rogers could be a 1-2 starter?


No need to trade for a SP. Just give him a shot. Sign 2 relievers and move him to SP and Perez to the pen. He might be a 20 game winner next year.
Think about Berrios, Rogers, Odo as our big 3 in the playoffs.
They'll never do it... but should think about it.

As for my random comments on stuff Nick raised.

Sano's success started when he stopped trying to pull everything. Same story Buck.
Keps is not a leadoff hitter. He is a great #6. Buck needs to get that job now that he has shown he can stick.

3 years ago many of us said, "Let the kids play." They ain't bad. Youth is good.

Several years ago when he left Boston I wanted the Twins to sign Francona. They'd have had to show Gardy the gate a year early, but we could have avoided that whole Molitor thing. Tito will have his team ready, injuries notwithstanding. He isn't going to concede anything. I think the Twins have their work cut out for them.

Bring it on. Its nice to be in a pennant race again.


Rogers never developed a third pitch, that's why he was moved to the pen. That ship has sailed.

#26 jimbo92107

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 11:25 PM

 

I searched teh Intarwebs far and wide, and found no other instances of this phrase. Congratulations! You might have a viable Bulwer-Lytton entry on your hands!

I shall scour my closets and drawers for further objects of metaphorical usage. Why just yesterday I found a thimble. I suppose it could drive home a point or two... Hat tip to the writers of The Tick, of course. The rolled up newspaper of justice makes a satisfying whack on the rear end of misbehavior. 

 

The toughest ones are still the Yogi-isms.

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The door opened. A woman screamed. Someday, my mom would learn to knock.


#27 Kelly Vance

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 11:26 PM

I don't accept that at all.He gets people out in high leverage situations and many thought he should be an all star. And you you say he isn't good enough to be a starter?  


#28 jimbo92107

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 11:28 PM

 

I liked this except for one small but significant thing. Goose Island is OK and all that, but they are a subsidiary of Annheuser-Busch. There are many very tasty local beers and ales available at Target Field and I always try to patronize the local brewmasters.

You are right, of course. Local brews shall take precedence. Notice that the Big Boys are trying to imitate the look of local brews. They fooled me, the blighters!

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The door opened. A woman screamed. Someday, my mom would learn to knock.


#29 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 05:32 AM

I don't accept that at all. He gets people out in high leverage situations and many thought he should be an all star. And you you say he isn't good enough to be a starter?


I don't believe I ever said he is or isn't good enough. I don't know. I'm saying we'll never find out because he never developed a third pitch, so it'll never happen.
It's not because the Twins aren't bold enough to try, no team would. If you can point me in the direction of some successful two pitch starters I'm open to change my mind.

#30 Kelly Vance

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 10:19 AM

Well, I hear you. But saying a pitcher only has two pitches is kind of like telling someone what their ceiling is. Don't most pitchers throw a change up, slider, curve and fastball, to varying degrees of success?Don't most pitchers have a fastball, curve and change coming out of high school? 

Aren't the slider and cutter just a slight variation off the 2 seam fastball? A little more torque and different release. 

 

Maybe the reason he relies on his best pitches is because he often comes into a game in a high leverage situation. No room for error. Stretch him out as a starter and he will have more opportunity to throw waste pitches and face batters with bases empty.

 

It is just an idea. 

 

 

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#31 USAFChief

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 10:24 AM

 

Well, I hear you. But saying a pitcher only has two pitches is kind of like telling someone what their ceiling is. Don't most pitchers throw a change up, slider, curve and fastball, to varying degrees of success?Don't most pitchers have a fastball, curve and change coming out of high school? 

Aren't the slider and cutter just a slight variation off the 2 seam fastball? A little more torque and different release. 

 

Maybe the reason he relies on his best pitches is because he often comes into a game in a high leverage situation. No room for error. Stretch him out as a starter and he will have more opportunity to throw waste pitches and face batters with bases empty.

 

It is just an idea. 

You're aware, aren't you, that Rogers spent the majority of his minor league career as a (fairly nondescript) starter? And was moved intentionally to a relief role?

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#32 KFEY93

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 10:34 AM

 

56 wins, 33 losses going into the All Star break. Who predicted that? Not me, that's for sure. We had all become so accustomed to a losing team that even when we saw this stacked lineup in April, we assumed that all kinds of things would go wrong:

 

Schoop would not hit, play mediocre 2B.

Pineda would be terrible, probably blow out his elbow again.

Gonzo would look mediocre, nowhere near as good as Escobar.

Cruz would be a total has-been, spend most of his time on the IL.

Adrianza would field okay, but not hit his weight.

Buxton would struggle, stub a toe, miss half the season, then whiff at every outside curve.

Castro would struggle with the repaired knee, miss half the season on the IL, not hit a lick.

Garver would let every other pitch get by him, but hit pretty good.

Polanco would regress.

Sano would arrive in training camp 60 pounds overweight, then get hurt (almost true).

Cron would be a flash in the pan and an average first baseman.

Willians Astudillo would look like us, and play like us. Chubby people can't play...right??

Kepler would whiff and whiff, and look at best average in RF.

Rosario would be the only star, a single s'more on a dumpster fire.

Berrios would look average.

Gibson would pitch a couple good games, then implode.

Jake Cave would wind up playing CF most of the year, look pleasantly average.

Odorizzi would have another mediocre year. ERA about 4.5

Luis Arraez? Yeah, right. And I will stumble over a ten-pound emerald.

Martin Perez? Soft-tossing lefty with nothing special except control issues.

Devin Smeltzer? Never heard of him. Another slow-tossing lefty? Mercy!

Ryan Harper? Boom, boom, boom to his feeble curves and sub-90 heat. That was my prediction.

Tyler Duffey would get DFA'd. Head case with no effective pitches.

Blake Parker? More tics than Nathan, half the talent. Walk walk, boom boom boom.

Trevor May would have more walks and home runs than strike outs.

Magill and Morin? Did the FO give up on the season before the season? People said that.

Not sure I should mention Mejia, who has lived up to all our pessimism so far.

Taylor Rogers looked good last year, thus he would look bad this year.

Zach Littell would never make it, can't throw over 90.

Hildenberger would be the only reliable arm in the pen, but it wouldn't matter.
Kohl Stewart would look like a complete flop.

Lewis Thorpe would throw hard, but look like a nervous rookie.

Baldelli would be a nice guy tending a daycare full of spoiled and angry children.

 

Instead, we were slapped in the face with the wet mop of success, knocked off our feet, landing on the throne of first place in the American League. Somebody shoved a crown on our heads, and we were like, "Wait, what??" 

 

This is not to say the Twins have not suffered any problems this season. However, at some point, nearly every man on that list has played like an All Star. To the core of my being, shocked I was. Talked like Yoda I did. 

 

Now, as together we stand at the grim precipice of success, looking out over the terrifying prospect of a winning season, we must gather all our pessimism and hurl negation upon this vile aberration! No way, bruh! This ain't happenin'! We're the Minnesota Twinkies, man! We gotta real pretty ballpark, but that's where I draw the line! I like the Philly cheese steak, and the Goose Island is great, but I will not stand here and suffer through the false hope of a good looking baseball team!

 

Who's with me? We're all moving to Detroit, to cheer for Gardy and the Tigers! Yaaaaaaaa....

TL:DR


#33 Kelly Vance

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 10:46 AM

 

You're aware, aren't you, that Rogers spent the majority of his minor league career as a (fairly nondescript) starter? And was moved intentionally to a relief role?

Sure. And I don't think that you can really say that he hasn't learned anything since then. He is a much better pitcher now than he was then. A lot of that is confidence and command.

 

Almost every MLB pitcher started as a starter. Every major leaguer was the stud pitcher of his high school or college team. Starter #1.But the transition between starter and reliever is more fluid than people realize.Santana started in the BP. So did Frankie.Dennie Eckersly started off as a starter. He was a pretty good starter. But he was a great reliever. We don't see transitions from BP to starter as much. It is outside the box thinking. 

 

Rogers' best weapon is his ability to hit spots and use pin point control (which means that he can hit the mitt most of the time). That translates well into a starter role. The question is, will it hold up the third time through the order?

 

I got to thinking about this when I considered the relative cost of adding a SP versus a couple BP arms.You can get two solid BP arms for less than what you pay for a stud starter. So if you can get a guy already on the team and under contract to be a starter, why not try it? Spend the money for two better BP arms. 

 

I think Rogers has shown that he can dominate batters. But the FO has to compare whether he is more useful pitching 3 times a week for one or two innings versus every 5 days for 6 innings. 

Edited by Kelly Vance, 09 July 2019 - 10:52 AM.


#34 jkcarew

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 11:55 AM

Reports of the demise of the Cleveland Indians were premature. They have the exact same record at the break that they had last year...when they went on to win 91 games.But IMO, the relevant target still should not be Cleveland...the Twins are still in a position to be able to win the division by going something like 38-35 in the second half. The target/objective should be being relevant in a post-season series against the likes of NYY, Astros, a hot Red Sox club, etc. 

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#35 jimbo92107

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 11:40 PM

 

TL:DR

TB:MYC

The door opened. A woman screamed. Someday, my mom would learn to knock.


#36 ashbury

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 11:23 AM

TB:MYC

??:HUH

It is amazing how many eggs one can break without making a decent omelet.


#37 yarnivek1972

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 01:33 PM

Sure. And I don't think that you can really say that he hasn't learned anything since then. He is a much better pitcher now than he was then. A lot of that is confidence and command.

Almost every MLB pitcher started as a starter. Every major leaguer was the stud pitcher of his high school or college team. Starter #1. But the transition between starter and reliever is more fluid than people realize. Santana started in the BP. So did Frankie. Dennie Eckersly started off as a starter. He was a pretty good starter. But he was a great reliever. We don't see transitions from BP to starter as much. It is outside the box thinking.

Rogers' best weapon is his ability to hit spots and use pin point control (which means that he can hit the mitt most of the time). That translates well into a starter role. The question is, will it hold up the third time through the order?

I got to thinking about this when I considered the relative cost of adding a SP versus a couple BP arms. You can get two solid BP arms for less than what you pay for a stud starter. So if you can get a guy already on the team and under contract to be a starter, why not try it? Spend the money for two better BP arms.

I think Rogers has shown that he can dominate batters. But the FO has to compare whether he is more useful pitching 3 times a week for one or two innings versus every 5 days for 6 innings.


I think one can positively say that since reaching the majors he hasn’t developed a third pitch.

#38 Nine of twelve

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 05:38 PM

 

The craft beer stand by Gate 34 is a haven. 

It is great. There are also several places with a wide selection of cans as well as smaller taps around the stadium.


#39 Nine of twelve

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 05:42 PM

 

You are right, of course. Local brews shall take precedence. Notice that the Big Boys are trying to imitate the look of local brews. They fooled me, the blighters!

Goose Island started life as an independent brewery but was bought out a few years ago.


#40 jimbo92107

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 08:02 PM

 

??:HUH

Too Bad, Missed Your Chance.

All the cool kids are saying it!

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The door opened. A woman screamed. Someday, my mom would learn to knock.




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