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Article: Who's the Fourth Outfielder?

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#21 Seth Stohs

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 02:51 PM

I don't think people realized how injured Granite was last year. If affected everything. His hitting. His defense. Everything. Dude is a player! He obviously doens't have the power o Cave, but he plays far superior defense. Granite is also one of the most professional hitters in the organization, a true leadoff hitter. 

I'm personally glad he is still on the 40-man roster, especially since he still has options remaining. Great depth option. 

 

Reed, I believe, is out of options. His value is that he rakes against lefties, so he makes a lot of sense for a lineup with a couple of lefty outfielders. 

 

They should just have a 28-man roster... ha!

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#22 Seth Stohs

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 02:51 PM

 

Is LaMonte Wade not in consideration? I think he’ll be a better player then those 3 long term.

 

Probably not at Opening Day. But at some point. 

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#23 Danchat

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 03:06 PM

 

I don't think people realized how injured Granite was last year. If affected everything. His hitting. His defense. Everything. Dude is a player! He obviously doens't have the power o Cave, but he plays far superior defense. Granite is also one of the most professional hitters in the organization, a true leadoff hitter. 

I'm personally glad he is still on the 40-man roster, especially since he still has options remaining. Great depth option. 

 

Reed, I believe, is out of options. His value is that he rakes against lefties, so he makes a lot of sense for a lineup with a couple of lefty outfielders. 

 

They should just have a 28-man roster... ha!

I agree that Granite has great range in the outfield, but his "far superior defense" is partially negated by his arm. He has a weak arm and won't be able to throw out runners going to third or home.

 

Plus I think some here might have soured on him due to some of the most head-scratching plays we've ever seen - throwing to first base when the runner was going home and nobody was there at first to catch the ball, and Granite also forgetting to step on first when running out a hit in a playoff game. 

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#24 ChrisKnutson

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 03:41 PM

If he performs well in ST I really think the FO should consider Wade for the 4th OF role even more so than Cave because of his ability to get on-base at a high rate (12.9% in a down year); something our projected lineup really lacks. Besides that, Wade doesn’t even really have any outstanding flaw either, except for maybe his lack of power, although he does seem capable of hitting around 10-15 HR if given enough AB’s.

#25 sweetmusicviola16

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:02 PM

One problem I have with Wade is he did not really prove himself at AAA Rochester. His performance was quite Gordonesque tbh.

 

A problem I have with Cave were the K's. 102 in his 309 PA's is very high. OBP was nothing to write home about either.

 

Granite also with an awful 2018 in AAA. Michael Reed has done little to show that he can be depended on in ML either.

 

I would love to see Astudillo on the roster, I personally favor him over Austin, but I believe his having an option remaining will be his downfall. Please FO Keep Willians. His desire for the game and his personality are things that can't be measured by the analytics. But he has shown he has the talent to compete at the ML level.

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#26 Dman

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:05 PM

OK I think I am starting to better understand why the FO is keeping all the 4th outfielders.I always thought Reed and Granite were redundant but since Reed is a righty he might fit better as a mix and match for Rosario or Kepler who are left handed.

 

The Twins don't want to give up on Granite after an injured\bad season because even if they don't like him long term in the fourth outfielder spot since he has an option, there is worse case, an opportunity for him to build better trade value for next year or best case prove he deserves the 4th outfielder spot.

 

I really like what Cave was able to do last year and I think he proved he belongs in the Majors.That being said I don't know what his lefty, righty splits are but if they are worse than Reed when it comes to lefties and he has option years left I think the Twins might prefer Reed.

 

IMO spring training is going to be important for all three guys.I think whoever looks best defensively and offensively will likely get the job.That being said I think Reed actually has the inside track as he has no options left.If he has a decent spring and proves himself worthy I think he remains on the 25 man to start the season.Should be a fun and interesting competition to watch this spring.

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#27 ScooterDance

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:07 PM

I believe there was a typo in the OP where it said Kepler was going to be our starting RF.

No way he starts over Harper.
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#28 TwinsTakes-RD

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:22 PM

 

I will take Cave.He has the versatility and the bat.I think he stays.Granite will regret 2018 for a long time. 

 

I still think Granite is a better hitter, better on defense & his on-base skills are better. Hopefully, Cave isn't thinking he deserves the spot and knows it's going to be a battle to make the team. Hard to believe he wouldn't know that after he saw the team claim Reed, add Wade to the 40-man and keep Granite on the 40-man.

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#29 Nine of twelve

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:23 PM

I will quibble slightly with the premise of this discussion. Having four outfielders does not necessarily mean that one of them is the fourth outfielder. If four players cover three positions equally each of them will start 75% of the time. I think the way to look at this is to consider the four outfielders as a team within the team. We should have four outfielders who, collectively, provide us with the best variety of options. Among other things, since none of the best candidates is a switch hitter it would be best for two to bat right handed and two left. It would be great if at least three of them have fielding skills that enable them to play center field. And having an emergency fifth outfielder on the roster (Astudillo or possibly Cruz) would be a plus for rare occasions such as heat stroke at Wrigley Field.

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#30 Thrylos

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:41 PM

With both Kepler and Rosario being able to play CF if necessary, I think that Austin will be it.

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#31 Mike Sixel

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:41 PM

People think Granite is a good hitter?

 

https://www.fangraph...343&position=OF

 

He put up a 67 wrc+ in his 40 games in MN in 2017. 

 

Cave put up a 108 in 108 games.

 

It's not even close on offense. 

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#32 TwinsTakes-RD

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:56 PM

 

Is LaMonte Wade not in consideration? I think he’ll be a better player then those 3 long term.

Yes. He's in consideration but I figured he'll end up starting at AAA again since he struggled there a little.

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#33 ashbury

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:56 PM

It's a little frustrating to have all these 4th OF candidates on the 40-man, because they are all essentially 3-tool players but the tools differ from one guy to the next. Individually they each are useful players, and I'm not going to go into detail here about the exact tools as I see them, but ultimately we are clogging our precious roster slots on too many guys with too little upside and too much similarity. If, say, Chase DeJong turns out to be a good pitcher and we lose him because we couldn't decide which 3-tool outfielders to commit to (as spare parts, or as long shots to develop a fourth tool), I'm going to be pretty disappointed. Pick the one you think least of and trade him for the best lottery ticket you can get who is years away from 40-man decisions, or let the market pick the best in terms of what someone is willing to offer (on the theory that the rest are pretty close to as good anyway). But, pick! We really need one fewer.

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#34 TwinsTakes-RD

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 04:59 PM

 

Do they all have options? A fourth who doesn’t have an option is Tyler Austin.

Reed looks intriguing. With two starting lefties in the OF corners, wouldn’t it make more sense to have the bench guy be right handed?

Pretty sure Cave & Granite have 2 options remaining but Reed may be out of options.




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#35 Twins33

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 07:14 PM

Cave probably has earned it, but he has options and I'm intrigued by Reed. Would be nice to find another Cave or possibly/hopefully even better (more walks). Being a RH bat helps too.
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#36 tarheeltwinsfan

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 08:06 PM

 

You are incorrect. :)

Cave is not out of options. 2018 was his first option year, so he has two option years remaining.

Granite has 1 option year remaining.

Reed is out of options (as is Austin).

"Hmmm. You present quite the conundrum."quoting Newman.


#37 rdehring

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 09:32 PM

 

You are incorrect. :)

Cave is not out of options. 2018 was his first option year, so he has two option years remaining.

Granite has 1 option year remaining.

Reed is out of options (as is Austin).

Thanks, wasn't sure where each stood.That may put Reed in the driver's seat if he has a spring anything like his 2018 season.

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#38 dougd

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 10:33 PM

Some numbers from BPro's new offensive metric, Deserved Runs Created + (100 is average). fwiw

AAA, 2018:

Reed 139

Cave 108

Wade 102

Granite 79 (but 114 in 2017)

Astudillo 126

Sano 128

 

For 2018 MLB:

Astudillo 127

Escobar 114

Rosario 113

Kepler 111

Austin 100

Mauer 97

Polanco 97

Cave 90

Schoop 82

Sano 77

Buxton 57

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#39 ahart10

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Posted 03 February 2019 - 11:06 PM

Considering Cave has options he’ll probably start the year in the minors. Austin isn’t really cut out for the job. Granite also has an option. So that leaves Reed. He’s right handed which is nice for balance and is a capable CF, I’ve heard.
Based on last years results I’d have to make Kepler or Buxton the 4th. That’s just me. Or Adam Jones would be a nice pickup, split time with Kepler and show Buxton the ropes.

#40 Penthang

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Posted 04 February 2019 - 05:49 AM

My take is that the front office likes a health Granite because of the elite defense and OBP skills, but he has an option remaining. He will not be the opening day 4th outfielder barring an injury. Cave showed us a lot last year and has the inside track for the job. Reed was an interesting guy on wavers who bats from the right side and my feeling is that they brought him in to get an up close look and to provide some competition for Cave. They will probably try to sneak him through waivers to stash him in AAA if Cave performs as expected in spring training, and if not it will go the other way around.
Personally I’d really like to see Granite and Astudillo as bench players for their strong OBP skills that this roster is otherwise lacking, but I don’t believe that will actually happen.

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