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Article: Twins Manager Paul Molitor Fired

paul molitor derek falvey thad levine jim pohlad
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#241 mazeville

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 07:45 AM

 

Argueable, Molitor may have managed better this year than last year. With the huge dissapointment of Buxton, Sano, Dozier, Polanco and Morrison and the unloading of assets during the year, losing only 7 more games than the year before was not unexpected in my eyes. Molitor may have had a better year than the front office!

 

I completely agree with this. This team lost five starters on the opening day roster for most of the year. Guys like Lance Lynn and Logan Morrison were huge disappointments, as was Addison Reed. There must be some other issues behind the scenes to convince leadership that this was the necessary action because it certainly wasn't day-day managing. This team outperformed expectations given all of these injuries and other problems.

 

That said, you wonder how much Molitor is to blame for problems with Buxton and Sano. And if you think there are issues with how the coaching staff relates to those young players, and you have some young guys coming up, then maybe you make a change. 

 

I also bring up the performance of Ryan Pressly after his departure. He was absolutely dominant with the Astros. You have to wonder why the Twins couldn't get him to do that while he was here. 

 

So I'm not saying there aren't questions with coach-player relationships. But it's still hard to look at that record and the Twins' players for much of the season and not think he did a good job. 

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#242 bighat

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 07:55 AM

 

And now they are not hamstrung by the Pohlad decree that they couldn't fire Molitor, now they own the manager selection too.

 

That "but you can't replace Molitor" clause was one of the biggest bush league moves in the history of sports ownership. You can't hire a new president and then tell him "but you can't make changes" - well, what's the point then? I think the spotlight is finally turned on and Falvine now has their time to show what they can do. Ridiculous that we had to wait 2 years for the show to start.

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#243 Wyorev

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 08:11 AM

I have been pretty frustrated with the bullpen stuff for a while.
I have this question about MLB teams in general:
Is the overuse of a reliever or the reliance on the hot hand simply the manager’s fault? What say does the bullpen coach have?
If one guy is being overused or under utilized, does the bullpen coach just complain to his wife when he goes home?
I have never looked, but do most other teams have a similar distribution among their relievers? Do most teams have a distribution that is much more even on their staff? Is our critique of Molitor based on an ideal that doesn’t exist?
Also - re: Molitor staying with the Twins. Anyone who is going to be an MLB manager has enough ego strength to deal with a person of integrity like Paul Molitor sticking around with the Twins and continuing to bring his talents to bear.
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#244 bighat

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 08:13 AM

 

If ever there was a year when September records and statistics can be ignored completely...this would be it regarding the Twins.The Twins need to overhaul in a fairly major way.The manager should be just the first step.

 

Agreed. A few have said that Molitor did a good job winning 78 games with this ramshackle squad. But don't be fooled - those last few series were gift-wrapped and featured clubs with 100+ loss records who were treating the games like a scrimmage. The 2018 Twins lost when they needed to win, and went on 7-game losing streaks when they absolutely needed to get hot. Nothing went right for this team and it was an extremely disappointing year.

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#245 Shaitan

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 08:20 AM

 

Re: New manager... Six of the nine coaches are FO hires. This leads me to believe that they will hire an inexperienced manager, where they can choose which coaches stay with the team. Or they hire from the inside, like Shelton. Just a guess. 

 

If the FO goes with an inexperienced manager, does that mean they are looking to 2020 and later to compete? If so, Gibson and either Kepler or Rosario may be on the trade block before the 2019 season. My suspicion began with the Pressly trade.He had another year left and had already made strides with the Twins. Another wild-ass guess but it kind of fits together. 

 

And thanks to Paul Molitor for his tenure with the Twins. Best wishes moving forward.

Agreed.

 

This front office seems to want more control. I think they go with a first-time or relatively unexperienced MLB manager (though perhaps experienced coach) who is willing to take "top-down" instruction. A Showalter, Scosia, etc will want to call all the shots.


#246 wsnydes

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 08:21 AM

While admittedly I never liked the hiring in the first place, i was willing to give him a chance and I do think that he actually improved in some areas as he gained experience. He wasn't fired because of this season alone however. While things like the bullpen management, general attitude towards the younger players and playing his veteran favorites more irritated me, there were limitations to what he had to work with. That said, I don't think he took advantage of opportunities to rest his bullpen horses. But what has always bothered me most about Molitor's teams is their inability to play fundamental baseball. They consistently beat themselves. I can live with losing because they other team is better, but if you consistently beat yourself like this team has under Molitor's watch then that has to go back to the manager. The fact that this problem never drastically improved is a worthy of a firing on it's own in my opinion. Those types of mistakes are correctable and they never were.

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#247 djvang

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 09:12 AM

 

Wally Backman.

 

The worse the season is going the more entertaining it will be.

 

We'll be praying for losses just to see some meltdowns.

Sano and Buxton having been busts so far got me thinking about Steve Gasser and Brian Baumgarner, two minor league pitching phenoms from the mid 80's that the Twins wouldn't trade for anyone.They never made the majors and eventually were traded to the Mets for .........Wally Backman.

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#248 USAFChief

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 09:21 AM

While admittedly I never liked the hiring in the first place, i was willing to give him a chance and I do think that he actually improved in some areas as he gained experience. He wasn't fired because of this season alone however. While things like the bullpen management, general attitude towards the younger players and playing his veteran favorites more irritated me, there were limitations to what he had to work with. That said, I don't think he took advantage of opportunities to rest his bullpen horses. But what has always bothered me most about Molitor's teams is their inability to play fundamental baseball. They consistently beat themselves. I can live with losing because they other team is better, but if you consistently beat yourself like this team has under Molitor's watch then that has to go back to the manager. The fact that this problem never drastically improved is a worthy of a firing on it's own in my opinion. Those types of mistakes are correctable and they never were.


Concur 100 percent.

The Twins gave Molitor limited talent, and that’s not his fault.

But the team, under him, played some miserably bad baseball, unrelated to talent. It doesn’t take talent to throw to the right base, run the bases properly, know how many outs there are, etc etc etc.

And for my money, that sort of stuff IS ultimately his fault.

Add in the poor pitching management and this was an easy call, IMO.

In the interests of full disclosure I’m not in the “managers don’t make much difference” camp. I think they make a great deal of difference. Why would baseball be hugely different than any other group endeavor?
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#249 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 09:27 AM

 

Well,we all thought Dougie Baseball should've been the pick before, or in the mix later.

No, "we" didn't. Some did. I think Mientkiewicz would be a horrible pick as manager given the direction baseball has gone over the past two decades.

 

Someone in this thread referenced more quotes why that's the case. He doesn't value analytics in an age when analytics should be a part of almost every conversation regarding a player.

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#250 nicksaviking

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 09:38 AM

 

Re: New manager... Six of the nine coaches are FO hires. This leads me to believe that they will hire an inexperienced manager, where they can choose which coaches stay with the team. Or they hire from the inside, like Shelton. Just a guess. 

 

If the FO goes with an inexperienced manager, does that mean they are looking to 2020 and later to compete? If so, Gibson and either Kepler or Rosario may be on the trade block before the 2019 season. My suspicion began with the Pressly trade.He had another year left and had already made strides with the Twins. Another wild-ass guess but it kind of fits together. 

 

And thanks to Paul Molitor for his tenure with the Twins. Best wishes moving forward.

 

I wouldn't think so, new managers are quite often a catalyst for a quick turnaround. I couldn't say why, it's perhaps intangible, but it happens very frequently, including with Molitor. 

 

I was in favor of a new manager if for no other reason than to kick-start this club (but there were other reasons also).

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#251 LA VIkes Fan

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 10:11 AM

 

While admittedly I never liked the hiring in the first place, i was willing to give him a chance and I do think that he actually improved in some areas as he gained experience. He wasn't fired because of this season alone however. While things like the bullpen management, general attitude towards the younger players and playing his veteran favorites more irritated me, there were limitations to what he had to work with. That said, I don't think he took advantage of opportunities to rest his bullpen horses. But what has always bothered me most about Molitor's teams is their inability to play fundamental baseball. They consistently beat themselves. I can live with losing because they other team is better, but if you consistently beat yourself like this team has under Molitor's watch then that has to go back to the manager. The fact that this problem never drastically improved is a worthy of a firing on it's own in my opinion. Those types of mistakes are correctable and they never were.

Agree here. The Twins record in 1 run games was terible because they were fundamentally unsound. At least some of that is on the manager. Add in the poor bullpen management and it just seemed like Molitor was in a little over his head. 

 

Th Strib writers are all bemoaning the move. I understand and respect loyalty. It's a very positive quality. Having said that, performance matters. The Twins did not perform well under Molitor with the exception of a 6 week stretch last year that snuck them into the playoffs with a record that usually gets you to 7th or so in the AL.They didn't move runners over well, have productive outs, get in guys from second with no outs or from third with one out, etc., and the record suffered. I don't know if changing the manager will change that but I think we do know that keeping the same manager will not change that. 

 

Paul Molitor is a good guy who knows baseball. He is not a good manager. Hopefully he will find a role that better utilizes his talents. This move had to be made. 

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#252 Moosa105

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 10:46 AM

Twins should target Ryan Garko as a candidate

#253 ashbury

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 11:30 AM

My thoughts on managers/supervisors and MOTIVATION.

 

Thirty years ago when I was in the Navy...

"A boss says, Go. A leader says, Let's Go."

 

OTOH I don't think 68-year old Connie Mack was out there doing wind sprints with the boys when his 1931 A's won the pennant. (Or maybe he did, and that's why his teams in his 80s did poorly.)

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So, in conclusion, what was your question again?


#254 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 11:43 AM

 

Really - Lynn, Morrison and Castro performed as advertised? 

 

Well, kind of. They are all C level guys to begin with. And they gave you C-D level production. These are the types of moves the Twins need to quit making. 


#255 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 11:44 AM

I don't care one way or another that Molitor was fired. I think he probably got the axe because all of our young players this year didn't do so well. Sans Eddie Rosario anyway. 

 

We all had to know also, that he is not Falvine's GUY and that they have probably been waiting to get rid of him and would have done so last year had they not made the playoffs/manager of the year, etc. 

 

 

 


#256 Vanimal46

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:00 PM

We all had to know also, that he is not Falvine's GUY and that they have probably been waiting to get rid of him and would have done so last year had they not made the playoffs/manager of the year, etc.


No doubt about it. That's their prerogative to do so. This firing feels different IMO. At the time when Gardy was fired I think we were all tired of him and ready to move on. There are some who were ready to move on from Molitor too, but I bet if we polled casual fans they would view this as a head scratcher...

It can be argued he did better this year than last year given the circumstances... Regardless, we're all living in Falvine's World now. Hope they find what they're looking for to turn around this organization quickly.
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#257 nicksaviking

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 12:42 PM

 

"A boss says, Go. A leader says, Let's Go."

 

OTOH I don't think 68-year old Connie Mack was out there doing wind sprints with the boys when his 1931 A's won the pennant. (Or maybe he did, and that's why his teams in his 80s did poorly.)

 

No way. You know how bad a classic early century wool suit is going to smell after doing wind sprints? He would have been paying his dry cleaner more than any of his players.

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#258 Moosa105

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 01:38 PM

https://mlb.nbcsport...o-be-a-manager/
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#259 USAFChief

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 01:43 PM

No way. You know how bad a classic early century wool suit is going to smell after doing wind sprints?


Yes.
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#260 Battle ur tail off

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Posted 03 October 2018 - 02:08 PM

 

 

Sign me up. A winner. That's what Thome was. Not sure if he would be good or not, but he's a great guy and would sure be interesting and probably put butts in the seats. 




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