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Twins' AA 3B Sean Miller suspended for 50 games

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#1 Thrylos

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Posted 07 July 2018 - 07:25 PM

For second positive drug of abuse test.Details here.

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#2 Nine of twelve

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 09:25 AM

No details were release on which drug was used, but this brings up an issue that will become more of a problem over the course of the next few years. Marijuana is currently on the MLB banned substances list as a drug of abuse. Alcohol is also a drug of abuse but is not on that list. In many states marijuana is the legal equivalent of alcohol and the number of states with such laws will be increasing. Should a player be put at risk for suspension for use of a legal, non-performance-enhancing, recreational drug? I'm not going to advocate for either side of that question here, and for now it's part of the CAB, but I'm sure this is a topic that will be revisited in the near future in CAB negotiations.

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#3 beckmt

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 09:50 AM

 

No details were release on which drug was used, but this brings up an issue that will become more of a problem over the course of the next few years. Marijuana is currently on the MLB banned substances list as a drug of abuse. Alcohol is also a drug of abuse but is not on that list. In many states marijuana is the legal equivalent of alcohol and the number of states with such laws will be increasing. Should a player be put at risk for suspension for use of a legal, non-performance-enhancing, recreational drug? I'm not going to advocate for either side of that question here, and for now it's part of the CAB, but I'm sure this is a topic that will be revisited in the near future in CAB negotiations.

While I do not quite believe this, alcohol can cause long term damage, but outside of hangovers and showing up not in condition to play, does not affect the ballplayer.Marijuana's usage has side effects not yet known, and how much this affects intellect and reflexes is not known.I know the groups I travel in frown on drug use, alcohol not so much unless it is effecting the results or play of the persons involved.


#4 Mike Sixel

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 11:23 AM

While I do not quite believe this, alcohol can cause long term damage, but outside of hangovers and showing up not in condition to play, does not affect the ballplayer. Marijuana's usage has side effects not yet known, and how much this affects intellect and reflexes is not known. I know the groups I travel in frown on drug use, alcohol not so much unless it is effecting the results or play of the persons involved.


That's from generations of being told alcohol is ok, and marijuana is not. I think that was the point of the past you quoted.... That alcohol is bad for you too...

It's too bad this happened. If it it is marijuana, it's a silly rule, imo.
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I remain hopeful on Buxton and Sano.....but I'd not bet the franchise on them.


#5 beckmt

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 03:59 AM

 

That's from generations of being told alcohol is ok, and marijuana is not. I think that was the point of the past you quoted.... That alcohol is bad for you too...

It's too bad this happened. If it it is marijuana, it's a silly rule, imo.

It is somewhat, but I come from the highest level of intellectual sports.Anything you take can cause a problem, but I know sometimes you wonder seeing some of what goes on, if a top flight player is on something. That can cost you a lot of money.


#6 laloesch

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 08:30 AM

 

That's from generations of being told alcohol is ok, and marijuana is not. I think that was the point of the past you quoted.... That alcohol is bad for you too...

It's too bad this happened. If it it is marijuana, it's a silly rule, imo.

 

I agree but be careful, a lot is not known yet about it even now.Today's forms of marijuana are much much more potent and higher THC content then stuff from the 60's and 70's.Marijuana also may have other unintended long term consequences beyond slowed intellect such as chromosomal damage and long term infertility for chronic users.

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#7 Shaitan

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 08:39 AM

 

No details were release on which drug was used, but this brings up an issue that will become more of a problem over the course of the next few years. Marijuana is currently on the MLB banned substances list as a drug of abuse. Alcohol is also a drug of abuse but is not on that list. In many states marijuana is the legal equivalent of alcohol and the number of states with such laws will be increasing. Should a player be put at risk for suspension for use of a legal, non-performance-enhancing, recreational drug? I'm not going to advocate for either side of that question here, and for now it's part of the CAB, but I'm sure this is a topic that will be revisited in the near future in CAB negotiations.

Employers (or a CBA) set their own conditions. For example, employers in CO can and do terminate employees for use of marijuana. Just because something is legal, doesn't make it okay in all walks of life.

 

Now how do I personally feel about en employer's right to check my bodily fluids? That's a whole different topic that doesn't apply to a TwinsDaily discussion.

 

At it's core, employers do have the right to make this decision. I'm curious how it will play out over the next decade. An employer also has the right to punish you for a hangover, if they can prove that's the cause. Essentially it would be under poor performance and/or missed work.

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#8 Mike Sixel

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 10:25 AM

 

I agree but be careful, a lot is not known yet about it even now.Today's forms of marijuana are much much more potent and higher THC content then stuff from the 60's and 70's.Marijuana also may have other unintended long term consequences beyond slowed intellect such as chromosomal damage and long term infertility for chronic users.

 

Oh, I agree....I just don't think we should be suspending players for this....

I remain hopeful on Buxton and Sano.....but I'd not bet the franchise on them.


#9 laloesch

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:23 PM

 

Oh, I agree....I just don't think we should be suspending players for this....

 

MEH,I kinda disagree.I agree that it's not a performance enhancing substance but if a player was showing up high all the time to play ball i think the club should have the right to suspend that player for violations because it impairs judgement.I believe that what you do on your own time is your own business but at work / on the field unacceptable.Kinda like showing drunk and trying to play baseball.  

Edited by laloesch, 09 July 2018 - 01:28 PM.

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#10 Mike Sixel

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:30 PM

 

MEH,I kinda disagree.I agree that it's not a performance enhancing substance but if a player was showing up high all the time to play ball i think the club should have the right to suspend that player for violations because it impairs judgement.I believe that what you do on your own time is your own business but at work / on the field unacceptable.Kinda like showing drunk and trying to play baseball.  

 

High all the time is not the same as testing positive. Of course if you are high all the time you shouldn't be working. But that is 100% not the same thing at all as what most of these are....

 

There is zero evidence he ever showed up high, as far as we know.

 

Occasionally smoking pot when you aren't working shouldn't, imo, get you suspended. Showing up high for work should get you at LEAST suspended, if not more.

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I remain hopeful on Buxton and Sano.....but I'd not bet the franchise on them.


#11 nicksaviking

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:33 PM

 

Oh, I agree....I just don't think we should be suspending players for this....

 

I agree, but the league still does so I don't have a ton of sympathy for guys getting busted. If my dream job told me I couldn't eat Lucky Charms I'd grumble about it to my co-workers, say it's complete BS and rally the rest of the employees to tell the powers that be that they need to change that rule.

 

And I'd still stay 100 feet from the cereal aisle when I go shopping.

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#12 Mike Sixel

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:34 PM

 

I agree, but the league still does so I don't have a ton of sympathy for guys getting busted. If my dream job told me I couldn't eat Lucky Charms I'd grumble about it to my co-workers, say it's complete BS and rally the rest of the employees to tell the powers that be that they need to change that rule.

 

And I'd still stay 100 feet from the cereal aisle when I go shopping.

 

Agreed on this also. He knows the rules.....

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I remain hopeful on Buxton and Sano.....but I'd not bet the franchise on them.


#13 jokin

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 01:35 PM

 

High all the time is not the same as testing positive.

 

Speaking of the positive side.... this does open up a 3B promotion opportunity for that certain prospect down in A ball, Miguel Sano...!

Edited by jokin, 09 July 2018 - 01:36 PM.

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#14 laloesch

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 03:19 PM

 

High all the time is not the same as testing positive. Of course if you are high all the time you shouldn't be working. But that is 100% not the same thing at all as what most of these are....

 

There is zero evidence he ever showed up high, as far as we know.

 

Occasionally smoking pot when you aren't working shouldn't, imo, get you suspended. Showing up high for work should get you at LEAST suspended, if not more.

 

I never said Sean Miller (i assume you are talking about him) showed up high. The discussion began diverging into hypothetical scenarios beginning in post #2. I also never said that "high all the time is the same as testing positive," which would be an absurd assumption. Testing positive is when you get caught nothing more. I'm not sure how you came up with that correlation.

 

The rest i agree with you. What he or she does (again we are speaking in the hypothetical) on their own time is there own business but showing up to work high well that's on you and i think the employer should have the discretion to suspend the individual for violating team policy showing up to work high on a Psychoactive drug, which anyone that has ever smoked the good stuff knows is the case.  

Edited by laloesch, 09 July 2018 - 03:21 PM.

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#15 ashburyjohn

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 05:38 PM

I agree, but the league still does so I don't have a ton of sympathy for guys getting busted. If my dream job told me I couldn't eat Lucky Charms I'd grumble about it to my co-workers, say it's complete BS and rally the rest of the employees to tell the powers that be that they need to change that rule.

 

And I'd still stay 100 feet from the cereal aisle when I go shopping.

Bad example. That's a deal-breaker. They're magically delicious.

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#16 h2oface

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Posted 09 July 2018 - 06:19 PM

 

While I do not quite believe this, alcohol can cause long term damage, but outside of hangovers and showing up not in condition to play, does not affect the ballplayer.Marijuana's usage has side effects not yet known, and how much this affects intellect and reflexes is not known.I know the groups I travel in frown on drug use, alcohol not so much unless it is effecting the results or play of the persons involved.

 

The don't call it Medical Marijuana for no reason. Unknown? Seriously? How about the uses that are positive? And the CBD's. It is all about education and not keeping oneself ignorant. Of course it should not be banned and it should be and will soon be legalzed in the whole country. It is 2018. Alcohol is so much worse, and drinkers are forever in denial of that. Alcohol is the killer. It is literally poison in small (or large depending upon the drunk) doses.

 

And then there was Doc Ellis. I guess some things not expected to be, are PEDs.

Edited by h2oface, 09 July 2018 - 06:29 PM.