32 replies to this topic

[yarnivek1972]

Sano is not the only problem with the Twins offense, and he is continuously unfairly and maliciously singled out.

Only 3 of the current Twins regulars have wRC+ higher than the league average (Rosario, Escobar, and Kepler). As a matter of fact Sano has higher wRC+ than Morrison, Grossman, Garver and whomever happens to play CF for more than 2 games.

It is not like Sano is hitting .156/.183/.200, with a -3 wRC+ like his fellow former top prospect does...

Grossman and Garver aren’t supposed to be starters. The starting CF is on the DL. And plenty has been said about his lack of productivity. Plenty has been said about Morrison as well. The fill ins are just that. Fill ins.


Sano is hitting about .150 OPS below his career mark. His HR rate is down 1% of his career avg. his K rate is 5 % higher than career avg and BB rate is 3% lower than career rate. This is a player in his 4th season who is supposed to be the cornerstone of the offense. He should be PROgressing not REgressing at this stage of his development.

If he doesn’t develop into an all star caliber hitter rapidly, this franchise will be back at square one offensively by mid 2019.

Unfairly singled out? No. Sano not hitting is simply THAT big of an impact to this team. That’s the price that comes with the hype that this organization has fed us for the last half decade.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Such good news about Joe. Hope he comes back strong. 

 

This is a young team,.  You expect veteran teams to win one run games. Young teams, uh no. But these guys are learning. 

 

The Rupp move wasn't an accident. 

 

I don't believe for a second that Sano is at a cross roads of his career. He is still just a young 25 and coming off an injury. He needs to learn to hit to the opposite field. He is strong enough to hit homers with the push away swing. 

 

Buxton too. Can you imagine how many triples he could hit in a year if he would learn to hit to right field?

 

Boston and New York are younger on offense, why are they winning so many games? Do you have any evidence that young teams don't win as many 1 run games? It isn't really that young of a team. There are zero rookies in the projected starting lineup. There are zero second year players in the projected starting lineup. 

[Thrylos]

 

 

Unfairly singled out? No. Sano not hitting is simply THAT big of an impact to this team. That’s the price that comes with the hype that this organization has fed us for the last half decade.

 

How about Buxton and his hitting?Or there was no hype surrounding the top overall prospect in baseball according to many? You never hear anyone many questioning his abilities and/or motivation, like they do Sano's. 

 

Yes he is singled out, which is status quo for certain people

[RatherBeGolfing]

 

Boston and New York are younger on offense, why are they winning so many games? Do you have any evidence that young teams don't win as many 1 run games? It isn't really that young of a team. There are zero rookies in the projected starting lineup. There are zero second year players in the projected starting lineup. 

 

It's almost as if that's just a go to excuse that carries no weight when applied to this team.

[yarnivek1972]

How about Buxton and his hitting? Or there was no hype surrounding the top overall prospect in baseball according to many? You never hear anyone many questioning his abilities and/or motivation, like they do Sano's.

Yes he is singled out.

1) I believe I mentioned that Buxton’s lack of productivity has been discussed plenty. Not recently because he’s on the DL, which I believe I also mentioned.

2) A big part of Buxton’s impact was always going to be and is always going to be defense. The offensive impact was always expected to be less than Sano’s.

3) Sano was never expected to be a plus defender. Indeed, the hope was for at least close to league average. Therefore, his entire value depends on him hitting.

4) Discuss Sano’s “motivation” with someone else. I’ve never mentioned it and could care less about it. I care about results. His are terrible.

5) As I also mentioned, Sano is “singled out” because his not hitting is THAT big of a deal. Buxton not hitting hurts too. Him being on the DL hurts. But his bat was simply never expected to be anywhere close to impactful as Sano’s. The entire offense is built around Sano. If he can’t be the third or fourth place hitter the Twins need him to be, literally nothing else matters. Because the Twins won’t contend for a title with this core if he isn’t in the middle of it.

[USAFChief]

 

How about Buxton and his hitting?Or there was no hype surrounding the top overall prospect in baseball according to many? You never hear anyone many questioning his abilities and/or motivation, like they do Sano's. 

 

Yes he is singled out, which is status quo for certain people

He could lose some weight, stay on the field, recognize a pitch every now and again, and produce.

 

That'd change the status quo for me.

[mikelink45]

 

Grossman and Garver aren’t supposed to be starters. The starting CF is on the DL. And plenty has been said about his lack of productivity. Plenty has been said about Morrison as well. The fill ins are just that. Fill ins.


Sano is hitting about .150 OPS below his career mark. His HR rate is down 1% of his career avg. his K rate is 5 % higher than career avg and BB rate is 3% lower than career rate. This is a player in his 4th season who is supposed to be the cornerstone of the offense. He should be PROgressing not REgressing at this stage of his development.

If he doesn’t develop into an all star caliber hitter rapidly, this franchise will be back at square one offensively by mid 2019.

Unfairly singled out? No. Sano not hitting is simply THAT big of an impact to this team. That’s the price that comes with the hype that this organization has fed us for the last half decade.

Sano needing to be treated like a Superstar is a symptom of attitude problems that has been discussed here, but no one has an answer and there seems to be a real issue that is being worked around.

Attitude has a big impact - think of Torii Hunter coming back - and it can also be a tremendous burden on the team.Miquel is a big boy in many ways and he has been in the majors long enough to be treated like a major leaguer.  

If his feelings have been hurt, too bad.Confront him, help him grow up.Do something because what we have right now despite any metric you can put up is not good.And if we are pampering him out of fear that he will not like what he hears than we need a veteran who gets in his face.

 

Something has to be done if we really wanthim and the Twins to reach potential.

[Han Joelo]

I think when it comes to "makeup" (not the kind you put on a pig) Sano and Buxton have their own, different issues, but in both cases the effect is the same--lack of production.  In Buxton's case, he overthinks, and Sano might just be the opposite.  Those are very broad generalizations.  I have faith both can become productive players, in time, but I am not counting on either to suddenly start producing--especially because one of them is on the DL currently.  Going out on a speculative limb, and not armed with quotes, it seems like the Twins have emphasized makeup in a lot of their more recent draft picks; and that might be in part a response to what we've seen with the B and S show.

 

I don't want to be seen as overly disparaging of either guy.  Each has seen formidable hurdles pop up in the last year.  I personally don't underestimate the psychological toll that injuries, off-the-field legal issues, and the weight of high expectations can have.  

 

I think the thing that I hope for, that could happen right now, is for Dozier and Morrison to go on a tear (along with the cylinders that are already hitting.). 

Edited by Han Joelo, 11 June 2018 - 11:13 AM.

[mikelink45]

 

How about Buxton and his hitting?Or there was no hype surrounding the top overall prospect in baseball according to many? You never hear anyone many questioning his abilities and/or motivation, like they do Sano's. 

 

Yes he is singled out, which is status quo for certain people

I think there has been a lot written about Buxton.This week in review is not about him because he was not part of it.It is a separate topic.But Sano was part of it and I found it interesting to listen to the radio announcers talk about Sano.The impatience is not just with the fans.He currently has a -0.2 War and this is year four. 

It is not a sophomore slump.He has now accumulated 533 Ks - too many.He has 78 Hrs - not enough for his power.Danny Gladden was showing his frustration with Sano and his rally killing ability.

 

These are the top five batter comparisons from Baseball reference - Michael Conforto (960.5)

Wily Mo Pena (959.5)
Phil Plantier (958.5)
Jesse Barfield (954.6)
Pete Incaviglia (951.9)

 

Not great.Harmon Killebrew is number seven on the list, but remember that Harmon was on the big league team for 5 years with minimum playing because of the bonus rule for signing young players.No minors, just big league bench.The comparison does not hold up - sorry, wish Sano was Harmon. 

[birddog]

Lots of frustration which means we still care, but this is one boring lineup to try and sell tickets. Blame can go to everyone who has made an appearance this season as well as coaches. How can we not look at Buxton and Sano as our biggest disappointments as I know for myself I expected huge numbers from them only to get nothing. I thought Buxton may get 50 steals, but he may not get on base 50 times. I thought Sano would give us huge production in HRs and RBIs, but he has only been huge.

 

Some form of leadership has to step up to put an end to the offensive futility. Dozier has called meetings, but he has to produce on the field to produce results from the clubhouse. Nothing has been mentioned of Morrison's ineptitude. Who would listen to anyone but Rosario and Escobar?

 

Like every hitter this season, Falvine stepped to the plate before the season and swung for the fences. We thought they had delivered two quality starting and relief pitchers, along with a power threat to hit behind Sano allowing him to see better pitches. As it turns out these moves did not bring the results we anticipated, but Falvine can not get gun shy. Leadership has to come from them and they need to bring up Gordon and Wade and let Pettit and Grossman go. We can't expect any trades yet because anyone we want to trade has no trade value--though Lynn is improving his stock lately. We no longer have the luxury of waiting for status quo to change by itself.

[Blackjack]

A lot of frustration posted here but nothing that winning 12 out of 15 wouldn't solve!!!

 

Go Twins!!

[Sconnie]

Lots of frustration which means we still care, but this is one boring lineup to try and sell tickets. Blame can go to everyone who has made an appearance this season as well as coaches. How can we not look at Buxton and Sano as our biggest disappointments as I know for myself I expected huge numbers from them only to get nothing. I thought Buxton may get 50 steals, but he may not get on base 50 times. I thought Sano would give us huge production in HRs and RBIs, but he has only been huge.

Some form of leadership has to step up to put an end to the offensive futility. Dozier has called meetings, but he has to produce on the field to produce results from the clubhouse. Nothing has been mentioned of Morrison's ineptitude. Who would listen to anyone but Rosario and Escobar?

Like every hitter this season, Falvine stepped to the plate before the season and swung for the fences. We thought they had delivered two quality starting and relief pitchers, along with a power threat to hit behind Sano allowing him to see better pitches. As it turns out these moves did not bring the results we anticipated, but Falvine can not get gun shy. Leadership has to come from them and they need to bring up Gordon and Wade and let Pettit and Grossman go. We can't expect any trades yet because anyone we want to trade has no trade value--though Lynn is improving his stock lately. We no longer have the luxury of waiting for status quo to change by itself.

I think the pitching Falvine brought in was exactly as expected. This teams pitching went from worst to middle of the pack, a heroic feat.

Morrison hasn’t quite delivered, but for 1 year 6 mil, no biggie


It’s the players the Twins relied on last year that have not lived up to expectations. Mauer, Dozier, Sano, Polanco and Buxton. I’m not sure how Falvine is the cause of, or have predicted failure/injury with all of those players.

Edited by Sconnie, 11 June 2018 - 01:58 PM.

[VATwinsFan]

If nothing else at least we don't have to shudder and shake our heads when we look at who the Twins' starting pitcher is going to be.