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Article: Buxton’s Back: Was No Rehab a Mistake?

byron buxton ryan lamarre paul molitor
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#21 Puckett34

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 08:47 AM

 

Am I the only one that took his comment as sarcasm?

Noooooooooooo.

 

 

I did. Tone gets lost in forums though.

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#22 Dave The Dastardly

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 08:56 AM

 

A .324 hitter that had been hitting .181 in limited at bats since the walk off in Puerto Rico on April 18th. It's not like the Twins just sent down Lou Gehrig because Wally Pipp was back from injury. They sent down a player with prior to this season had two big league hits to his name at age 29.

 

Now, should have Lamarre been starting more instead of Grossman in the outfield, yes. But I'm kind of "meh" about him being sent down.

Your last paragraph is exactly my point, but without my sarcasm. Nice sarcastic dig about the Gehrig/Pipp comparison though.

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#23 mikelink45

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 09:02 AM

 

He's barely had 1,000 PAs and less than two seasons worth of games in the majors and he's only 24.Sure there's reason for concern and he's got to stay on the field, but it's too early to panic yet. 

 

If this team is to take that next step though, Buxton and Sano have to figure things out and stay on the field. 

 

I do think it was a mistake to not send him on a rehab stint.He wasn't hitting before he got hurt.A short rehab stint, a couple of games, would be a decent way for him to settle in with the bat and get back up to speed.His defense is badly needed, but given how bad this division, there's no need to rush him back.  

I understand the team need for Buxton and Sano to come through, but 24 or not, a talent like Buxton should be able to hit at least 250, but he continually has long stretches where he flails and looks lost at the plate.24 is young, but as he was coming up he was compared to Trout and others who have flourished at 24 and younger.Chris Bryant, Carlos Correa, Martinez, Harper, Machado... there is a long list so I am not impressed by his age.Given his potential I am concerned that we need to see a learning curve start soon. 

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#24 stringer bell

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 09:19 AM

43 at-bats for the season. Dozier has endured a dry spell of in excess of 50 at-bats (before yesterday). Yes, Buxton might struggle the first series or two after being out nearly a month, but his defense should make up for most of that.

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#25 wsnydes

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 09:21 AM

 

I understand the team need for Buxton and Sano to come through, but 24 or not, a talent like Buxton should be able to hit at least 250, but he continually has long stretches where he flails and looks lost at the plate.24 is young, but as he was coming up he was compared to Trout and others who have flourished at 24 and younger.Chris Bryant, Carlos Correa, Martinez, Harper, Machado... there is a long list so I am not impressed by his age.Given his potential I am concerned that we need to see a learning curve start soon. 

My only point with the age is that he has time to figure it out.Sure, there's a long list of young players that took off immediately.Not everyone does.Everyone has their own learning curve.Comparing anyone to generational greats and then expecting them to live up to it is setting yourself up for disappointment.Frankly, it's unfair to the player.The vast majority of players never even sniff that level talent. There's an even longer list of players that have enormous potential and never realize it.That's what makes the generational greats so rare.  

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#26 jkcarew

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:05 AM

My feeling would be that Buxton seems to start out about 2 for 50 with 25 K's in any scenario...might as well get it out of the way as fast as possible.Have to just give him the at-bats even though it's horrifically painful to watch.

 

We're in year year 4 with both Buxton and Sano, and due to injuries and uneven performance, we're still in "need to find out" mode with both.Frustrating.

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#27 twins1095

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:06 AM

 

 

 

I understand the team need for Buxton and Sano to come through, but 24 or not, a talent like Buxton should be able to hit at least 250, but he continually has long stretches where he flails and looks lost at the plate.24 is young, but as he was coming up he was compared to Trout and others who have flourished at 24 and younger.Chris Bryant, Carlos Correa, Martinez, Harper, Machado... there is a long list so I am not impressed by his age.Given his potential I am concerned that we need to see a learning curve start soon. 

 

Did Buxton not hit .253 last year?Since when did becoming Kris Bryant, Bryce Harper, or Mike Trout be come the barometer of an impactful player.  

 

Buxton struggles to make consistent contact and is probably always going to struggle to do so.Further, injuries have pretty consistently kept him from being able to really get in a rhythm playing long stretches of games healthily--which obviously isn't a positive.Buxton had a similar type slump in his first 50-80 ABs last year and hit pretty close to .270 for the remaining 90% of the season.  

 

Buxton's gonna be a streaky hitter who struggles to hit for a high average, strikes out a lot, and because of this go through periods where he slumps hard.That doesn't mean that over a full 162 game season he isn't going to be a productive player.His speed and feel for base-running and his ability to drive balls and find gaps when he does make contact mean that he makes a bunch of positive plays too.  

 

His 162 game pace last year put him at 80 runs, 17 2Bs, 7 3Bs, 19 HRs, 60 RBIs, 35 SBs.I use the 162 game pace to just show his impact on a per game basis in a similar way to how the NBA lists player stats as 25 points per game/8 assists per game/etc. and players are judged that way even if they only play 65 games.(Not discounting that health is a concern)Those numbers were largely from hitting near the bottom of the order too.  

 

Is that Mike Trout?No, but that level of offensive production combined with the value his defense brings to a team put him somewhere between a top 15 and top 25 player in terms of WAR for position players. 

 

I'll take a guy with that kind of impact even with his limitations and the fact that he isn't "Mike Trout or Bryce Harper". 

__________________________________________________________________________________

 

I'm pretty excited we have a guy, who's only 24, on the team that can impact the game at that high of a level in his own way. 


#28 tarheeltwinsfan

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:16 AM

Welcome back Buck!


#29 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:43 AM

No one is asking he be Mike Trout. Why do people always use this as some kind of excuse for how bad a hitter he has been so far?

As for rehab, I agree. A week or two in Rochester isn't going to change how he hits after that, imo.

Edited by Mike Sixel, 11 May 2018 - 10:44 AM.

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#30 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 10:56 AM

 

Did Buxton not hit .253 last year?Since when did becoming Kris Bryant, Bryce Harper, or Mike Trout be come the barometer of an impactful player.  

 

Buxton struggles to make consistent contact and is probably always going to struggle to do so.Further, injuries have pretty consistently kept him from being able to really get in a rhythm playing long stretches of games healthily--which obviously isn't a positive.Buxton had a similar type slump in his first 50-80 ABs last year and hit pretty close to .270 for the remaining 90% of the season.  

 

Buxton's gonna be a streaky hitter who struggles to hit for a high average, strikes out a lot, and because of this go through periods where he slumps hard.That doesn't mean that over a full 162 game season he isn't going to be a productive player.His speed and feel for base-running and his ability to drive balls and find gaps when he does make contact mean that he makes a bunch of positive plays too.  

 

His 162 game pace last year put him at 80 runs, 17 2Bs, 7 3Bs, 19 HRs, 60 RBIs, 35 SBs.I use the 162 game pace to just show his impact on a per game basis in a similar way to how the NBA lists player stats as 25 points per game/8 assists per game/etc. and players are judged that way even if they only play 65 games.(Not discounting that health is a concern)Those numbers were largely from hitting near the bottom of the order too.  

 

Is that Mike Trout?No, but that level of offensive production combined with the value his defense brings to a team put him somewhere between a top 15 and top 25 player in terms of WAR for position players. 

 

I'll take a guy with that kind of impact even with his limitations and the fact that he isn't "Mike Trout or Bryce Harper". 

__________________________________________________________________________________

 

I'm pretty excited we have a guy, who's only 24, on the team that can impact the game at that high of a level in his own way. 

 

I think some of us would have been quite happy if Buxton had started out hitting .250 with a lot less Ks...

 

That's the problem. He's reverted right back to Bad Buxton. 


#31 Doomtints

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 11:13 AM

No rehab? A mistake?

 

Buxton is needed for his defense.  

 

Putting him on a rehab assignment in the first place was a mistake. Work on his swing in the minors after an injury? Who cares! Get him up here. The Twins missed his defense mightily in his absence.

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#32 twinssporto

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 11:26 AM

I think some of these rehab assignments are ridiculous.  I can understand missing well over a month of baseball games but for a guy out 10 days even three weeks, get him back in the game.  We are starting to see more players coming off the DL and going right back to work with their major league team.  

 

Buxton is unusual in the fact his defensive skills are so much better than an average outfielder.  I'd rather see him playing right away than sitting in AAA.  I can't stomach another game with Grossman patrolling the outfield.   

Edited by twinssporto, 11 May 2018 - 11:28 AM.

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#33 Riverbrian

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 12:29 PM

His CF defensive abilities are elite. Best in the league and apparently didn't need rehab time to return to that level. 

 

Until his offense comes around... bat him 9th and let him go get the baseballs. It'll all come out in the wash. 

 

 

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#34 mikelink45

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 12:52 PM

 

My only point with the age is that he has time to figure it out.Sure, there's a long list of young players that took off immediately.Not everyone does.Everyone has their own learning curve.Comparing anyone to generational greats and then expecting them to live up to it is setting yourself up for disappointment.Frankly, it's unfair to the player.The vast majority of players never even sniff that level talent. There's an even longer list of players that have enormous potential and never realize it.That's what makes the generational greats so rare.  

I understand and your points are good.I just do not want to use age as a factor.The pub he got when he first was signed made him seem like a Trout or Griffey and they jumped right in.Buxton is an interesting case and I wonder what coach or changes will be needed to turn the corner for him. 

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#35 mikelink45

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 12:57 PM

 

Did Buxton not hit .253 last year?Since when did becoming Kris Bryant, Bryce Harper, or Mike Trout be come the barometer of an impactful player.  

 

Buxton struggles to make consistent contact and is probably always going to struggle to do so.Further, injuries have pretty consistently kept him from being able to really get in a rhythm playing long stretches of games healthily--which obviously isn't a positive.Buxton had a similar type slump in his first 50-80 ABs last year and hit pretty close to .270 for the remaining 90% of the season.  

 

Buxton's gonna be a streaky hitter who struggles to hit for a high average, strikes out a lot, and because of this go through periods where he slumps hard.That doesn't mean that over a full 162 game season he isn't going to be a productive player.His speed and feel for base-running and his ability to drive balls and find gaps when he does make contact mean that he makes a bunch of positive plays too.  

 

His 162 game pace last year put him at 80 runs, 17 2Bs, 7 3Bs, 19 HRs, 60 RBIs, 35 SBs.I use the 162 game pace to just show his impact on a per game basis in a similar way to how the NBA lists player stats as 25 points per game/8 assists per game/etc. and players are judged that way even if they only play 65 games.(Not discounting that health is a concern)Those numbers were largely from hitting near the bottom of the order too.  

 

Is that Mike Trout?No, but that level of offensive production combined with the value his defense brings to a team put him somewhere between a top 15 and top 25 player in terms of WAR for position players. 

 

I'll take a guy with that kind of impact even with his limitations and the fact that he isn't "Mike Trout or Bryce Harper". 

__________________________________________________________________________________

 

I'm pretty excited we have a guy, who's only 24, on the team that can impact the game at that high of a level in his own way. 

I am not saying that Buxton is not going to be a good player, but he has more potential than good.I just do not want age to be the starting point for debate because I only listed a few of the many players in the majors that are succeeding at high level at his age and they are not just Trout and Harper.Yes he did bat 253 last year and 209 225 and 186 in the other three.We need some consistency from him.Is it too much to expect a player with his ability to start rising to higher levels?  

 

 


#36 wsnydes

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 01:16 PM

 

I understand and your points are good.I just do not want to use age as a factor.The pub he got when he first was signed made him seem like a Trout or Griffey and they jumped right in.Buxton is an interesting case and I wonder what coach or changes will be needed to turn the corner for him. 

I think the disconnect between our stances is that you're trying to use comps to generational stars.My point is that these comparisons are unfair and unreasonable in the first place.Some guys can do it, some can't.It's not an age thing, it's a comparison thing.

 

I'm discouraged that he's not performing too.I have high hopes for him still.Experience is more important than age in the first place.I do expect more out of him than what he's showing.Same goes for Sano.I just don't expect them to be Mike Trout or Ken Griffey, Jr.Comparisons are meaningless, but fact of the matter is that hey both need to hit better.Plain and simple.I think we can both agree on that!:)

Edited by wsnydes, 11 May 2018 - 01:26 PM.

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#37 Steve Lein

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 01:50 PM

I wouldn't have put him on a rehab assignment in the first place, so that was mistake number one. 

 

Probably would have put him on one now after what happened on the first one, so they're doubling up in my opinion.

Scouting Report: Power: 30, Hitting: 50, Arm: 60, Defense: 45, Speed: 45. "Line drive swing and shows good contact and on-base abilities. Double's power at his peak. Strong arm from 2B or the OF, stiff hands. Not a fast runner, but above average instincts on the bases. Skinny body doesn't look the part, but will sneak up on you. ACL surgery sapped much of his athleticism." (Probably)

#38 ewen21

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 02:33 PM

 

Let's chill on racking Buxton for now. He's played all of 11 games before last night. For context, before last night Brian Dozier was sporting a .418 OPS in his past 16 games. Guys get hot and get cold, let's not jump to conclusions just yet.

I didn't see where anyone was ripping him.

 

I get what you are saying about slumps, but Buxton is a sub .700 OPS for his career right now.People are concerned (and rightly so) about his propensity for injuries and his unreliable bat.  


#39 Broker

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Posted 11 May 2018 - 07:36 PM

I know Buxton counts for an extra out or two over the other guys playing center. However it's not like the other guys miss everything hit their way. Unfortunately Buxton can't seem to hit. When he comes to the plate I just assume there will be another out on the scoreboard. Great defense is fine but the team needs offense too. In this game you have to score more runs than the other team. Buxton isn't contributing to scoring any runs.

#40 glunn

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Posted 12 May 2018 - 01:00 AM

 

Rehab probably wouldn't have hurt but I still expect #9 batter production out of him.IMO, he should legitimately try to bunt for base hits twice a game until the rest comes around I thought it helped him get on track last year and it can help him this year. Its such a great weapon for him and I haven't even seen him try it this year.

I was at the game on Thursday night and the Angels' third baseman was playing him deep. Any decent bunt towards third base would have been an easy single. Instead Buxton flailed and failed.




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