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Minor Leaguers and Minimum Wage

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#21 SD Buhr

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:00 AM

The Washington Post reports today that an amendment giving MLB an exemption to labor laws will be attached to the spending bill that needs to pass this week to keep the government open.

 

The amendment has not been on any of the drafts to-date, so the intent obviously was to slip it in at the last minute and hope nobody noticed until it was done.

 

Assuming it passes, the wording will be interesting. If the exemption is ONLY applicable to MLB, it would presumably not help the Saints and other indy-ball teams.

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#22 gunnarthor

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:05 AM

This seems like such a dumb policy for MLB. Baseball isn't as popular as football but they have this opportunity to grab all these young kids away from football because of the health concerns that football is creating. Baseball should want to pay these kids more. 

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#23 Steve Lein

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:16 AM

 

MLB is something else. 

 

 

 

Yeah, don't understand this stuff at all.

 

Why does it have to be that pay has to be doled out or compared in an 'hourly' way?Give them a raise, pay them a salary (that is what they are paid, right?). They can be "exempt" employees right, so this isn't even a worry. 

 

Just give them enough money to live..

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#24 Tomj14

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:20 AM

The question I have is what is the reason for the $115,000 cap.

Doing some estimates it seems the Saints as a team make lots of money and for them that number seems really, really low.

But is that a number the other teams couldn't go above to stay a float?

 

It would seem in that maybe some Revenue sharing would be in order, and they could double that number.

But then again, they could say screw it, shut the down the team and all they employ and invest that money somewhere else.

 

I will say this the Saints communication depart did a better job then most others. Basically saying it isn't that we are cheap it is were can't break the rules and get our shut down.

 

"So … if minimum wage and overtime laws were to impact us, then we may be in a position to not be able to abide by our league bylaws, which would force us not to be able to operate.”


#25 Mike Sixel

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:23 AM

 

The Washington Post reports today that an amendment giving MLB an exemption to labor laws will be attached to the spending bill that needs to pass this week to keep the government open.

 

The amendment has not been on any of the drafts to-date, so the intent obviously was to slip it in at the last minute and hope nobody noticed until it was done.

 

Assuming it passes, the wording will be interesting. If the exemption is ONLY applicable to MLB, it would presumably not help the Saints and other indy-ball teams.

 

As I posted in the other baseball forum, if this passes, I'm done watching or listening to regular season baseball....and might have to stop coming here also. Heck, even if it doesn't pass......they asked for this. Reprehensible behavior. Pure and utter greed, but hey, heavan forbid we pay the minor leaguers real money when the owners are struggling so much just to make their next billion.

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There's always next year, or the next, or maybe by the time I'm Chief's age, I guess....


#26 Tomj14

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 10:35 AM

 

It is very hard to understand the MLB teams logic on this one. The total cost to give all their minor league players $1,000 more per month (currently lower level MILB players are paid $1,000-$1,400 per month based upon level and years in minors) is less than $1M a year. That would cover 175 MILB players for 5 months. Considering the amount of revenue MLB generates I would think they’d come up with $ to make this go away.

MLB players association, IMHO, also deserves a large share of the blame. They could force this to happen in labor negotiations. Again, it’s a pittance in comparison to MLB revenues and salaries. They all played in the minors but seem to have little regard for those who haven’t or won’t make it to MLB.

I agree with your logic, I disagree with your math.

 

I am guessing with practice, games, traveling, meetings, workouts etc.. that a minor league puts in at least 60 hours.

At 15/per hour, the first 40 hours would be 600.

then the next 20 would be another 450, so 1050 a week * 4 = $4200 a month.

Which I believe would double the current average on a whole, it is like 4 times rookie league salary and about $1500 more that AAA depending on service years.

 

I would guess the twins have about 200-250 minor leaguers? So it would be closer to 2.5-3.0 million and that is just me guessing. Of course most teams piss that away on stupid major league contracts.

 


#27 spycake

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 11:35 AM

 

This seems like such a dumb policy for MLB. Baseball isn't as popular as football but they have this opportunity to grab all these young kids away from football because of the health concerns that football is creating. Baseball should want to pay these kids more. 

The best amateurs already get paid. This is more about minor league roster filler. As a rough example, MLB probably doesn't care if minor league rosters are filled with the actual #600-1200 ranked players each draft, or just any 600 guys ranked #600-2000. Especially with increasing numbers of international minor leaguers.


#28 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 12:37 PM

The best amateurs already get paid. This is more about minor league roster filler. As a rough example, MLB probably doesn't care if minor league rosters are filled with the actual #600-1200 ranked players each draft, or just any 600 guys ranked #600-2000. Especially with increasing numbers of international minor leaguers.

There's the rub. There's no shortage of people who want to be minor league baseball players.
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#29 Mike Sixel

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 03:10 PM

just noticed how I spelled heaven.....as heavan.....which is how I am spelling it in the books I'm writing! Fascinating probably only to me....

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#30 Monkeypaws

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 04:22 PM

The whole situation is bass-ackwards.

 

Minor leaguers need the union, not the Major leaguers, i.e. the country club, whose per diems exceed minor league pay, and earn in a year what most folks slave away for until they are 65.

 

I'm gonna puke next time I hear a major leaguer go all Lech Walesa on us and talk about solidarity.

 

The owners are yet more odious, and deserve to lose at every stage, but really, it's millionaires fighting over the crumbs, each of which is a fortune. 

 

I used to see ballgames at the Met for $2. Harmon Killebrew used to sell cars in the off-season. The money in MLB is ridiculous. They are a great depression away from irrelevance.

 


#31 Rosterman

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 05:11 PM

Some ways, it seems strange that TC Bear might make more money than you average minor league player.

 

Of course, he can hit home runs on command.

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#32 Rosterman

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 05:16 PM

 

The whole situation is bass-ackwards.

 

Minor leaguers need the union, not the Major leaguers, i.e. the country club, whose per diems exceed minor league pay, and earn in a year what most folks slave away for until they are 65.

 

I'm gonna puke next time I hear a major leaguer go all Lech Walesa on us and talk about solidarity.

 

The owners are yet more odious, and deserve to lose at every stage, but really, it's millionaires fighting over the crumbs, each of which is a fortune. 

 

I used to see ballgames at the Met for $2. Harmon Killebrew used to sell cars in the off-season. The money in MLB is ridiculous. They are a great depression away from irrelevance.

 Or a major league saying they are thinking about their family and making them comfortable, especially when they enter the free agency days.

 

Of course, ownership makes sure they don't lose money. As player salary rises, everything else in the sport increases, too. If DECENT hot dogs were still a buck and beer 50-cents and seats $2.00, maybe he roster would be full, again, of guys making $35,000-60,000 a year.

 

And, yes, many a player HAD to have a job in the off-season that didn't involve house-hunting, or worry more about life after leaving the game.

 

But playing major league baseball is an elite moment in the profession. Only s many get to do it (think, the Twins have had roughly 800 guys put on the uniform at the major league level over half-a-century). 

 

There are career opportunities, continuing on as coaches and managers and scouts or front office jobs (talk about people underpaid...because of supply and demand). If you do stick it out in the minors, you do see a bit larger payday around year 5-6. Or if you do get a 40-man roster spot. 

 

But it is a profession of temporary employment, high turn around (always someone else looking to take your job).

 

But the owners still sit in their money bins counting the bucks and trying to figure out a way to seem competitive, but then convincing fans that "some win, some lose."

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#33 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 08:16 PM

I agree with your logic, I disagree with your math.

I am guessing with practice, games, traveling, meetings, workouts etc.. that a minor league puts in at least 60 hours.
At 15/per hour, the first 40 hours would be 600.
then the next 20 would be another 450, so 1050 a week * 4 = $4200 a month.
Which I believe would double the current average on a whole, it is like 4 times rookie league salary and about $1500 more that AAA depending on service years.

I would guess the twins have about 200-250 minor leaguers? So it would be closer to 2.5-3.0 million and that is just me guessing. Of course most teams piss that away on stupid major league contracts.


Why are you using $15/hr for your math? The minimum wage is substantially lower than that in nearly every jurisdiction where these players earn their money.

#34 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 08:18 PM

I'm not defending this, not at all.
But, how are apprenticeship type employees governed in other industries? Is it common for those types of employees to be paid less than minimum wage, or is this unprecedented?

#35 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 08:24 PM

I'd also be curious what percentage of milb players currently make less than minimum wage.
What percentage of players in the systems received signing bonuses?
It's probably even less money than some have suggested to ensure that they all clear minimum wage, when you factor in that at least a fair amount of them received a fairly significant signing bonus.

#36 TheLeviathan

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 09:00 PM

And here I thought the state of pay for minor leaguers couldnt get any worse.

MLB has done plenty to annoy me, but this may kill all the doe-eyed love for it I have left.

#37 DocBauer

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Posted 19 March 2018 - 09:26 PM

Reading the one offered quote concerning how to govern and measure hours on the job, forcing a player to go home and not get extra practice time, etc, I grudgingly have to agree. Just a couple for instances: 1] we can all claim travel expenses on taxes for many occupations...this does not apply to milb players. 2] people who work on commission sometimes put in extra hours, perhaps in training or meeting situations, to further themselves but are not always compensated for such.

The solution is pretty simple to me: treat milb ballplayers as salaried employees with a fair earning compensation!

Honestly, considering the vast billions of dollars involved in MLB, I'm not sure the owners would hardly blink at a couple million more spent for payroll on their milb personnel. But to me, this is not on the owners. I mean, even if the Twins wanted a pay raise for their entire system, would they be allowed To? I think it's a worthwhile question.

I put the onus on the player's union. Unless I am greatly mistaken, aren't high round pick "bonus babies" still paid the same minimum wages per month? Or has that also changed? How many players jumped from high school or college straight to the majors in the modern era? Virtually everyone spent at least a year or two in the minors before they made it. But then it's "I got mine, hope you get lucky to get your too"? That's just wrong.

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#38 Major Leauge Ready

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 06:56 AM

 

Reading the one offered quote concerning how to govern and measure hours on the job, forcing a player to go home and not get extra practice time, etc, I grudgingly have to agree. Just a couple for instances: 1] we can all claim travel expenses on taxes for many occupations...this does not apply to milb players. 2] people who work on commission sometimes put in extra hours, perhaps in training or meeting situations, to further themselves but are not always compensated for such.

The solution is pretty simple to me: treat milb ballplayers as salaried employees with a fair earning compensation!

Honestly, considering the vast billions of dollars involved in MLB, I'm not sure the owners would hardly blink at a couple million more spent for payroll on their milb personnel. But to me, this is not on the owners. I mean, even if the Twins wanted a pay raise for their entire system, would they be allowed To? I think it's a worthwhile question.

I put the onus on the player's union. Unless I am greatly mistaken, aren't high round pick "bonus babies" still paid the same minimum wages per month? Or has that also changed? How many players jumped from high school or college straight to the majors in the modern era? Virtually everyone spent at least a year or two in the minors before they made it. But then it's "I got mine, hope you get lucky to get your too"? That's just wrong.

 

Doc, I am impressed You just proved an ability to be objective that is obviously not present in the vast majority here. Salaries have risen astronomically.In other words, the owners have ponied up. The players could have elected to let minor league players participate in this good fortune.However, the people who should be the most sympathetic could have chosen to include MiLB players and they said we will going to keep every penny for ourselves. This group someone ignores this and make the owners out to be 100% at fault. 

 

BTW ... The salaried employee is a very good solution to MiLB players. 

Edited by Major Leauge Ready, 20 March 2018 - 06:58 AM.

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#39 Major Leauge Ready

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 07:00 AM

 

As I posted in the other baseball forum, if this passes, I'm done watching or listening to regular season baseball....and might have to stop coming here also. Heck, even if it doesn't pass......they asked for this. Reprehensible behavior. Pure and utter greed, but hey, heavan forbid we pay the minor leaguers real money when the owners are struggling so much just to make their next billion.

 

So, you are going to quit watching because of the owners greed.Apparently, the players greed is not a problem.It is well-established virtually every player has no loyalty to their fans or teammates one free agency arrives.Not sure I blame them but that's not the point.


#40 Mike Sixel

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Posted 20 March 2018 - 09:35 AM

 

So, you are going to quit watching because of the owners greed.Apparently, the players greed is not a problem.It is well-established virtually every player has no loyalty to their fans or teammates one free agency arrives.Not sure I blame them but that's not the point.

 

Correct, the players' greed does not bother me. Heck, the owners' doesn't either.....it's trying to get laws passed, that basically go against what we have, as a society, agreed is correct. 

 

If you don't have an issue with getting special laws passed to treat one group of humans less than we've agreed to treat others, that's your choice too, just as it is mine.

There's always next year, or the next, or maybe by the time I'm Chief's age, I guess....