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When do the Twins cut bait with Phil Hughes?

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#141 jud6312

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 01:25 PM

 

This would be logical. Lynn is getting a late start, Odorizzi has had health issues, Berrios probably doesn't need to be pushed, and Gibson may not be worth pushing.

I think they can reserve the option to skip someone and that can be a good thing, but if they are using it to justify giving Hughes a chance that his diminished stuff may not warrant, that is a bad thing.

No problem with them skipping or not skipping anyone's starts early in the season ... unless they're skipping Hughes' starts. I'm all in favor of skipping those.

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#142 USAFChief

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 01:31 PM

I have always been sceptical of the idea the Twins would go with a 4 man rotation to start the season.

They haven't in the past, nor have many other teams.

As for Hughes, IMO a starting gig was always going to be his to lose in ST.
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#143 ashburyjohn

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 01:43 PM

The Twins get three of them in a row this season. Ugh.

Kind of like football teams scheduling a patsy for Homecoming? Let's surprise them, this time.

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#144 jkcarew

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 02:15 PM

 

As for Hughes, IMO a starting gig was always going to be his to lose in ST.

This.It's one thing to understand the concept of sunk cost...but you're still going to give a huge investment like that every possible opportunity to turn.I'd imagine the Twins plan on pitching him early either as a 5th starter or long-man, with the idea that if (many here would say when) he implodes, they look at DL options to buy even more time.They'll be absolutely positive and out of all stashing options before they let him go.

 

With regard to the early 4-man rotation, a lot of times it's dependent on the weather.There are more (than normal) off days scheduled early...combine that with the possibility of multiple rain/snow/cold postponements...and sometimes it can get ridiculous.


#145 Mike Sixel

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 02:47 PM

Exactly. This team isn't good enough to just give away Ws. If Mejia is the better pitcher (and he is) then he should have that 5th spot if they're moving back towards a five man rotation.

1.5 months of extra time between MLB starts isn't going to derail his development.


Agreed. On all of that.
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#146 spycake

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 02:52 PM

Odorizzi had back problems early last season. He went to the DL, rested his back, made a rehab stint in the minors and returned healthy and pitched like it to finish the season. His back has not bothered him since August or so, unless it has not been disclosed.


I get that, but again, generic "back problems" seem like the kind of thing that could come back again if he's not careful. Not saying it is critical to have extra rest early in the season, but it couldn't hurt. (Assuming the alternative wasn't more starts for Hughes, of course....)

Edited by spycake, 13 March 2018 - 02:55 PM.


#147 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 03:06 PM

I agree the games matter but do you want to see a guy like Mejia get 20-25 IP in six weeks? For his long term development, you want him pitching every 5-6 days.

And that’s where situations like this get difficult. What matters more, 4-5 games in April and May or the development of a guy you want as a contributor for the next six seasons? I don’t think there’s a wrong answer here, it only depends on perspective and priorities.


Mejia has options. Why can't he go down to AAA between starts to stay on a 5th day schedule?

#148 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 03:45 PM

Mejia has options. Why can't he go down to AAA between starts to stay on a 5th day schedule?

The ten day rule still exists for demotions/call-ups, doesn’t it?

#149 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 03:48 PM

The ten day rule still exists for demotions/call-ups, doesn’t it?

Sure, but if it's less than 10 days between starts, he's not really missing out on much development, is he?

Or, alternate sending down Mejia and Slegers/Jorge. They all give you at least a moderate chance to win, unlike Hughes.

Edited by Mr. Brooks, 13 March 2018 - 03:49 PM.

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#150 Deduno Abides

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 03:55 PM

Total guess: Hildenberger may go to Rochester and Hughes may go to the bullpen if Hildy doesn’t pick it up, especially when Santana returns.

#151 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 05:47 PM

 

Sure, but if it's less than 10 days between starts, he's not really missing out on much development, is he?

It's an okay idea in theory but in practice, it's much harder to line up starts between teams that way.


#152 Vanimal46

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 05:55 PM

Sure, but if it's less than 10 days between starts, he's not really missing out on much development, is he?

Or, alternate sending down Mejia and Slegers/Jorge. They all give you at least a moderate chance to win, unlike Hughes.


Personally I'd rather see that rotation of pitchers over seeing Hughes pitch at all.

I don't believe they're going with a 4 man rotation. Because of financial reasons, Hughes is in the rotation. And we're going to witness at least 5 starts where we pray he gives up less than 4 runs in 5 innings.

Not exactly inspiring for a team I think is an AL Central title contender.
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#153 Riverbrian

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 06:19 PM

I'm crazy but I still feel it's possible that Hughes won't be as good as we want him to be. 

 

Nor... As Bad as we think he will be. 

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#154 jorgenswest

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:22 PM

I don’t think it would be that difficult to plan for Mejia the 5th start role from AAA. In fact it is almost ideal through the first two starts. The space between those is greater than 10 days. Give him a start in AAA, call him up, send him back for another start in AAA and call him up. He is stretched out for his starts. He stays on schedule.

Seems like a good way to utilize options and gain benefit from their depth in starting pitchers.

#155 spycake

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:58 PM

I don’t think it would be that difficult to plan for Mejia the 5th start role from AAA. In fact it is almost ideal through the first two starts. The space between those is greater than 10 days. Give him a start in AAA, call him up, send him back for another start in AAA and call him up. He is stretched out for his starts. He stays on schedule.

Seems like a good way to utilize options and gain benefit from their depth in starting pitchers.


Wouldn't you leave him in major league camp longer, though? No benefit to sending him out now -- he'd be a month removed from facing MLB hitters when he comes back to start under your plan.

#156 jorgenswest

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 08:11 PM

Wouldn't you leave him in major league camp longer, though? No benefit to sending him out now -- he'd be a month removed from facing MLB hitters when he comes back to start under your plan.


It could be a missed opportunity. It is possible that moving him helps get him on schedule for that first April start. I guess if he or Romero line up for that date it stays a possibility.

#157 snepp

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 09:04 PM

 

I'm crazy but I still feel it's possible that Hughes won't be as good as we want him to be. 

 

Nor... As Bad as we think he will be. 

 

I've thought that about our #5 (...and #4...and #3...) starters too often the last few years.

 

 

The burn still lingers. I fully expect a complete disaster from Hughes, and will be pleasantly surprised if it doesn't happen.

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#158 spycake

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 05:31 AM

It is possible that moving him helps get him on schedule for that first April start.

I'm sorry, this still doesn't seem possible to me. That first start is a month away, and they presumably aren't skipping the 5th starter during spring training. Besides, they can and do use MLB players in intrasquad / minor league spring training games, so he could stay in MLB camp even if they wanted to get more innings for both him and Hughes.

Occam's Razor suggests that they have already decided that Hughes is getting the first crack at the 5th starter spot. Nothing else really makes sense at this point, for Mejia and especially Romero.

Edited by spycake, 14 March 2018 - 05:33 AM.


#159 Riverbrian

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 05:37 AM

 

I've thought that about our #5 (...and #4...and #3...) starters too often the last few years.

 

 

The burn still lingers. I fully expect a complete disaster from Hughes, and will be pleasantly surprised if it doesn't happen.

 

I know it does... It clearly worries you... I hope you get some sleep soon.:)

 

narcolepsynightmare-466x278.jpg

 

 

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#160 jud6312

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 06:54 AM

I think we can all hope and pray that something changes in these last few weeks and the FO office realizes that "lost money" is a better alternative than essentially handing 4-5 games over to the opposition while they get "one last look" at Terry Ryan's parting gift to the organization.

 

But the likelihood is that Mejia, Gonsalves, Romero, Jorge, Et. al won't be gracing us with their presence at Target Field until the weather warms up. Barring injuries, of course.

 

The best we can hope for at this point is that "he felt a twinge" shows up in one of the post-game stories following one of Phil's next outings.