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Article: Photographer Accuses Miguel Sano Of Assault

miguel sano betsy bissen trevor plouffe trevor may
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#41 Twins33

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:08 PM

I am saying this one thing and then shutting down for a while from this site to cool off. But if Nick knew about it and did nothing, that makes him an accompliss and a coward. Like I said earlier i dont know anyone involved but i dont come here to deal with this type of stuff. I come because its a simpler happier place to be....

Are her family and other friends an accomplice too? She told them right away.

If something is told to you, in confidence, you usually keep it to yourself while supporting them. Some circumstances may change that, but I don't think that applies here. It was her story to tell and if she didn't want anyone else to do or say anything about it then that is her right.
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#42 Broker

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:11 PM

This not the right forum for this type of discussion.

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#43 Old Twins Cap

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:18 PM

There will be a thorough investigation, there are witnesses, everyone will get a chance to tell their story.

 

But, for Sano, let's face it, not good.Coming on the heels of his weight issues, this will not paint a pretty picture.Does he have a role on defense with a rod in his leg?Can he hit the low outside curve ball?Can he keep his HUGE personality within a team framework?

 

I can't begin to answer those, other than to say, this is a career-altering type of incident, even if not nearly as severe as Aroldis Chapman's emptying a gun into his garage wall. 

 

If this was a one-time thing, maybe Sano works around it. But, it fits a pattern, not a flattering one, and that will be hard to erase from people's understanding about who he is as a person.

 

All that said, I hate that America has moved into a Scarlet Letter type posture with these accusations.We need to be able to weigh evidence carefully, ask questions and get clarity before condemning either victims or perpetrators. 


#44 howeda7

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:20 PM

I would tend to agree that there's very little productive to be said here. Normally, fans are inclined to want to believe the player in a situation like this. In this case, it may be the opposite. In any event, it's up to the Twins, MLB and the authorities to do, or not do what they see fit.

 

All I would say is that those ripping Nick or others here need to stop and take a breath. If he was told about this a year + after it happened and asked to keep it private, what good could possibly come from telling anyone?

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#45 less cowbell more neau

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:40 PM

 

One other point, pretty shady that the Twins were reportedly offering up Sano in trade talks. If that is the case I have more of a problem with our front office than with Sano.

The story broke today. The Twins FO knew nothing about this until today.

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#46 darin617

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:47 PM

 

The story broke today. The Twins FO knew nothing about this until today.

Sure. I highly doubt they had no knowledge before it went public.


#47 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:54 PM

Sure. I highly doubt they had no knowledge before it went public.

Betsy herself has said the Twins had no knowledge of the situation.
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#48 tobi0040

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 07:59 PM

An accomplice is someone who helps another commit a crime. An example would be a lookout for a robbery. This is not that.

I applaud the folks at Twins Daily for taking a stand here, based on their first hand relationship with the accuser.
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#49 h2oface

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:01 PM

10 PM EST, and still crickets on the Twins official homepage AND the MLB homepage. Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Amazing.


#50 mlhouse

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:01 PM

These allegations need to be carefully examined.And one thing that really needs to be examined overall in our current discourse is are these things "sexual assault"?Clumsy approaches for dates or sex are not sexual assault. Nor is consensual sex given to receive something in return.

 

Not too many years ago Johann Santana was accused of raping a woman and it was a false charge.Luckily for Johann that was kept pretty quiet and the fact is that the woman who did the accusing was a known nut who had consensual sex with him around the clubhouse (my parents live in that development).  

 

It is not rare for women to falsely accuse men of sexual assault or to accuse them of assault when it really isn't. Balancing this is a difficult issue so rushing to conclusions is something we should not do.

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#51 one_eyed_jack

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:20 PM

 

You realize that the police would do nothing about it, right? 

 

 

 

I understand that knowing the accuser must make this situation somewhat emotional for you, but this is irresponsible speculation.What makes you so certain that you know how law enforcement would have reacted if she had gone to them immediately?

 

You realize that the police investigated the allegations against Kirby Puckett and it led to criminal charges filed by Hennepin County, right?  

 

 

 

 


#52 Brandon

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:25 PM

An accomplice also helps the pertetrator get away with the crime. By sitting on the info you are an accomplice. You are helping the person get away with the crime. Its pretty straightforward. Now if Nucj found iut today...probably not much he could do...but 2 years ago ...really? Unless its not a big deal and the girl is embellishing alot....

#53 Thrylos

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:27 PM

 

10 PM EST, and still crickets on the Twins official homepage AND the MLB homepage. Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Amazing.

 

Bit of a legal procedural thing:  

Based on the CBA, ballclubs cannot do anything about such allegations.They cannot even start an investigation.The MLB office is the only one that can do so.And I think that I saw some place (maybe the Twins comment?) that the MLB is investigating.

 

Don't expect announcements soon, unless civil lawsuits are opened in this case (one way or another)

Edited by Thrylos, 28 December 2017 - 09:28 PM.

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#54 biggentleben

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:39 PM

Intriguing that the Twins site this morning before this broke had front and center an article about how pleased the Twins were with Sano's progress this winter so far. No such article anymore on the Twins front page....

Co-Editor at CallToThePen.com, covering Twins, Braves, minor leagues, and all other baseball!

 


#55 DocBauer

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:46 PM

I am truly torn as to whether or not to say anything at all, especially having read some of the posts here, but took a deep breath and decided to comment.

I choose my words very, very carefully.

I love and adore women. And to be very clear, I say that with the utmost warmth and respect, and not in a casual or sexual manner. I have loved and adored women in my life. I am the father of a 27yo daughter who I cherish deeply who, fortunately, has never faced any sort of situation like this reported one. I have known women, family, friends and relationship partners, who have been assaulted and abused in their life. I find it abhorrent!

I do not take these incidents, incidents to others, or reported incidents lightly! And I am speaking ONLY in the abstract on this incident as I have no first hand knowledge of the incident or the people involved.

Many of the women I have known have also refused to come forward due to shame or fear. Some that have "confessed" the incident did so later or much later. To vilify someone who has encountered this, or has learned about it in confidence and not "come forward" to do or say something about it is misguided. Many times the person involved is not ready, frightened, suffering from a sense of "shame" they should not be forced to feel, or simply wants to heal and move on. Sometimes they feel there is no legal recourse available, so their "confession" is made in confidence they hope is respected.

This is in general, through my own knowledge, and not a comment on this specific incident or the people involved. I want to make that clear!

But as a man, a person, a father, friend and partner and as an intelligent human being who is also a sports fan and has seen these incidents present themselves in various forms, I have two comments to make. And I don't make them lightly.

1] Due process should take it's course here first and foremost. This is NOT a cop-out statement. Both in the private sector and public sector we have heard of "mild" and egregious incidents/actions that have taken place. Some were proven true. Some were proven false. Some disappeared in to the gray. We are not judge and jury, nor directly involved. We are only outsiders looking in wondering as to what happened, and what will become of it all.

2] Again, I measure my words carefully here and am NOT speaking directly to this incident or the people involved. In life, and the legal system, there are degrees of mistakes/crimes committed by people. I dare all of us at least know people, whether they be friends, family or acquaintances who have done something wrong, bad or illegal at some point in their life. The moral high ground is sometimes easy to take. But if you personally knew Mr/Ms Smith, and they shoplifted once vs robbing a home or business, how would you weigh the scales? It's a moral dilema and a slippery slope to be sure. Do we vilify the transgressed to the same degree? Probably not, but that is a personal decision to be made. Likewise, in an incident that may be proven true, or false, or one that falls in to the gray, who then do we call villain?

The whole point here is that there is a lot more to contemplate, this situation or any other. I don't have the answer to this particular situation, and none of us do. I believe it will end up in the gray sector of reality, right or wrong. Lives are affected. And that's a shame. It feels as though both parties will be damaged in some way. And that may ultimately be the tragic part of this.

If I had a wish, it would be everyone would "like" my post and this topic would simply end here. It's news, and Twins news, but it's really beyond this forum to debate and decide anything here, IMHO.
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#56 KirbyDome89

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 10:40 PM

 

Are her family and other friends an accomplice too? She told them right away.

If something is told to you, in confidence, you usually keep it to yourself while supporting them. Some circumstances may change that, but I don't think that applies here. It was her story to tell and if she didn't want anyone else to do or say anything about it then that is her right.

Spot on. I'm not sure how or why those she told in confidence have come under fire but the timing of the decision to writeand share the post was 100% hers. 

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#57 Twins33

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 10:48 PM

It is not rare for women to falsely accuse men of sexual assault or to accuse them of assault when it really isn't. Balancing this is a difficult issue so rushing to conclusions is something we should not do.

i don't have the link, but I've seen it posted elsewhere that it's a false 6% of the time. So, I'd say it's pretty rare when it happens. Think of how many thousands upon thousands of cases there are and 95% of them are true.

Seems easier to me to not jump to the "she's lying" accusations (not saying you are, but a whole ton of people are). I've seen people bring up the names of five guys who were falsely accused and because of those five guys it means every woman is lying. There are people saying that. That's wrong.
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#58 Carole Keller

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 10:56 PM

This has been a very difficult discussion, one I have not entered into but very little. It has been heated and emotional, with various ‘sides’ being taken. After some discussion, we have decided to give both threads a little bit of some breathing space and to take a little bit of a break and revisit this tomorrow. Locking this is only temporary and both threads will be opened tomorrow for continued respectful discussion. This discussion has gone back and forth in its relation to Sano to a more general topic, and we’ve heard from several of you in various forms ... PM’s, reports and public opinions ... as to it’s continued pertinence in this forum, so when reopened for discussion, it’s possible this may be moved to a more appropriate forum.

Thank you. I wish you a peaceful good night.
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#59 glunn

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 04:07 AM

I have read this entire thread and the other thread. My sense is that most of the posts have been thoughtful. However, some posters have been disrespectful of other posters. Once the thread is unlocked there is going to be ZERO TOLERANCE of that. If you think that someone's post is stupid, either be respectful in your response or refrain from responding. If you insult the other poster or bicker then you will have your posting privileges suspended.

 

My impression based on reading the thread is that I believe that there is general agreement that Betsy is probably telling the truth. On the other hand, we live in a country where the presumption of innocence is a bedrock principle, and it is important to look for discrepancies in any accuser's story.

 

I suspect that it will be weeks or months until all relevant information becomes public, or maybe it will never become public. In the meantime, the moderators are going to insist that posters be respectful of opposing views. Feel free to argue, but keep it respectful.

 

 

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#60 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 29 December 2017 - 08:09 AM

Okay, so we're going to try this again, everyone. Be on your best behavior, as everyone (ownership and moderators) will be watching this thread closely.

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