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Article: Twins Must Get Creative To Lure Darvish

yu darvish
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#41 rdehring

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 12:44 PM

CNBC just had a report on the new tax law effect on professional athletes.They stated that two current deductions will no longer be allowed under the law: 1) Agent fees paid by the player will no longer be a deductible expense; and 2) Fines levied by the league will not be deductible.Guess Gardy better stay in games in Detroit!

 

Imagine agents could get around their fee by figuring out a way to have the teams pay them directly.  

 

 


#42 Mike Sixel

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 12:58 PM

 

I would be very hesitant to offer a 4, 5, or even 6 year deal. I would rather overpay on a 2 or 3 year deal that may or may not include a player option. Something like 2/66 with a player option for 3rd year, making it a 3/99 contract. 

 

I really like Darvish and would love getting him, but he is no spring chicken anymore. 

 

Why would he sign a three year deal?

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#43 drivlikejehu

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 01:11 PM

The Twins have an enormous amount of payroll space, even for their limited budget, after 2018. I would offer Darvish a contract that included a significant signing bonus to be paid out in 2019 and 2020 . . . that would prevent his contract from being too burdensome as the Twins' young players get more costly.

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#44 Deduno Abides

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 01:17 PM

I have no idea how to gauge the frequency, to discuss this more meaningfully. Anecdotal evidence won't suffice, and baseball-reference.com fails to keep proper stats. :) I'll stand by my take, for now.


Well, you’d hear about them, if they existed, at least most of them. Further, based on personal experience with a great athlete with a great foundation, ones you do hear about often don’t do much. It’s actually hard work to have a good foundation.

Regardless, I will agree with you that a foundation may be the reason some athletes want more money. However, beyond that supposition, usually it’s simply the money. Therefore, I too will stand by my take - after an annual salary of, say, $20M, you’d think someone would differentiate his choices on factors other than money, but it unfortunately does not seem to happen that much.

#45 cmoss84

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 01:54 PM

 

Why would he sign a three year deal?

He probably won't. But if he does, it might be because he is being offered far more/year in the 3 year deal...like 33 vs. 22-25. Especially if the 3rd year is a player option-he could still have time for one more "large" contract.

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#46 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 02:26 PM

I am pretty sure every millionaire has contributed more to schools, parks and police then I or most people have.
Joe Mauer made 23 million last year, 2.3 went to a agent, which leaves him around 20, lets say he figures out how to write off a couple of million on that and the final number is 18. Half of that would be taxed in MN, around 900K, another 700K to other states and 7 plus million to the feds. (just in income) I have no hard feeling against them trying to reduce that burden.


No agent in mlb makes 10% commission. Most are around 2-3%, Scott Boras made the most (#'s from 2013) at 4.7%.

#47 snap4birds

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 03:27 PM

 

It is seldom that anyone ever mentions taxes when talking about signing players.Yet, they are and can be a major factor in these discussions.May not be for the player, but certainly his advisors.

 

I understand that players file tax returns in all markets in which they play.But half their games are at home, thus, half their income is taxed in the State of their home team.So that's a negative for Minnesota versus lots of teams...although not the teams from places like New York or California.And that hit will be bigger now that it appears State and local tax deductions are going to be limited.After all, $27,000,000 at almost ten percent is a lot of money...especially when your Federal deduction looks to be limited to $10k.  

 

Will this be a negative for the Twins?Or can they get creative and find a way to help their pitch?

Ladies and Gentlemen, I present your South Dakota Twins, starring Yu Darvish!Maybe set up a rotation where he only pitches home games, or in other states that have low income taxes.....

 

I think this is a fairly new phenomenon, prior to maybe 10 years ago pro athletes just paid their income tax where they played.Now it has to be pretty complicated.If a pitcher never faces the Tigers, does he not have to file in Michigan, or does he have to prorate his earnings out to the percentage of games his team played against the Tigers?  


#48 nytwinsfan

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 03:56 PM

Uggh:

 


#49 Carole Keller

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 04:57 PM

Mod note: Please stick to the topic at hand and let's not take the tax tangent any further. You are welcome to start your own thread in the sports bar about athletes and their pay and their taxes in the Sports Bar if you want to discuss that issue further. Thanks.

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#50 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:00 PM

 

Uggh:

 

So.... Cubs exploring free agent market? Heyman for the win! :)

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#51 nytwinsfan

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:02 PM

 

So.... Cubs exploring free agent market? Heyman for the win! :)

I mean, it is a bit more specific than that. If you look at the tweet he linked, they are literally flying to Texas to meet with him in person.


#52 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 05:33 PM

Well, that's a little different. I think the Twins still have the advantage. (though would still prefer a trade for a guy like Cole than tie up 100MM for the next half decade)

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#53 h2oface

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 07:00 PM

This from Bollinger:

 

"Levine said the Twins will continue to be patient yet aggressive in their pursuit of a front-line starting pitcher to join Ervin Santana and Jose Berrios. The Twins have yet to make an offer to Darvish, but he's not expected to make a decision anytime soon.

"The top end of the market tends to be more patient, because it's not like interest is going to evaporate," Levine said. "I think there are two tiers, with Darvish and Arrieta linked and then Lynn and Cobb linked. Time will tell how much they impact one another."

 

I just don't get how not making an offer is aggressive, at all. Seems that is just the opposite of being aggressive. One can't make a decision on it or accept an offer that is not made! If you want something, you make an offer. Before it is too late. Change it if it is rejected. But if you want Darvish..... make an offer!

Edited by h2oface, 18 December 2017 - 07:14 PM.

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#54 Riverbrian

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 07:12 PM

I imagine that the free agent signing dance has a certain timeline to it that will go at it's own pace. I'm not going to worry because I'm sure Falvey and Lavine have the phone number of his agent. 

 

However... At this point... I'd prefer if Falvey and Lavine find out exactly where Yu Lives and then buy the homes on either side of him.

 

Falvey moves into one and Lavine moves into the other. Exchange recipes... host block parties and give sage advice over the fence. 

 

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#55 Brandon

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Posted 18 December 2017 - 10:22 PM

Also take into account the culture, Jaoenese value relationships alot in business.

#56 jharaldson

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 12:02 PM

The Twins are going to get a 1 time cash infusion in Q1 of 2018 of between $50-$68 million due to the sale of BAMtech by MLB. 

 

http://mlb.nbcsports...ale-of-bamtech/

 

An innovative way to take advantage of this would be to offer Darvish a 5 year/$140 million contract but make $60 million a signing bonus.The signing bonus would be taxed at Texas rates so he saves money plus he can invest that money and make it grow for him instead of waiting for it. It would also be good for the Twins because the yearly rate on that contract would go from $28 million to $16 million and give them more flexibility in the future.  

Edited by jharaldson, 19 December 2017 - 12:03 PM.

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#57 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 12:22 PM

The Twins are going to get a 1 time cash infusion in Q1 of 2018 of between $50-$68 million due to the sale of BAMtech by MLB.

http://mlb.nbcsports...ale-of-bamtech/

An innovative way to take advantage of this would be to offer Darvish a 5 year/$140 million contract but make $60 million a signing bonus. The signing bonus would be taxed at Texas rates so he saves money plus he can invest that money and make it grow for him instead of waiting for it. It would also be good for the Twins because the yearly rate on that contract would go from $28 million to $16 million and give them more flexibility in the future.


The Twins max out payroll at just over 50% of revenue, so the bonus would have to be $30 million, not 60.
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#58 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 12:23 PM

Besides, he's going to get a lot more than $140 million, IMO.

#59 Mike Sixel

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 12:30 PM

 

The Twins are going to get a 1 time cash infusion in Q1 of 2018 of between $50-$68 million due to the sale of BAMtech by MLB. 

 

http://mlb.nbcsports...ale-of-bamtech/

 

An innovative way to take advantage of this would be to offer Darvish a 5 year/$140 million contract but make $60 million a signing bonus.The signing bonus would be taxed at Texas rates so he saves money plus he can invest that money and make it grow for him instead of waiting for it. It would also be good for the Twins because the yearly rate on that contract would go from $28 million to $16 million and give them more flexibility in the future.  

 

Not sure the taxes work that way, but even if they do, I can't see the Twins or anyone giving out a signing bonus like that. 

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#60 jharaldson

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 01:59 PM

 

The Twins max out payroll at just over 50% of revenue, so the bonus would have to be $30 million, not 60.

 

The Twins made that statement in the past about their yearly revenue.They haven't had a similar 1-time payout since 1998 when the Diamondbacks and the Rays came into the league and everyone got $10 million.I would argue that unless they have a significant 1-time capital project (minor league facilities, international facilities, IT infrastructure, etc...) that there is not a valid reason for them to apply the 50% rule to this money and it should be available for this purpose.




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