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#2501 USMCTwin

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 08:06 AM

It was a stand alone statement. It was simpy my stance on the Democratic Party as it is today. A number of posters gave their own interpretation of the Republican Party and I figured the door was open for me since no one felt the need to measure tone there. I don't see where the tone of my post was any more severe or accusatory as the some of the ones I saw. The bar had been set. I think AOC and Omar are borderline psychotic and if they both left congress today I'd love it. Omar is the one who couldn't understand why the US Army and Al Quiada are viewed differently by the American public. AOC is a freshman who is now going after her own party leader Nancy Pelosi. This business about "The Squad" is a joke. Is there no room for anyone to rip these jackasses? It's just a one way street, I suppose. Had I trashed the Republicans with even stronger words I never would have been called out. I don't know your story and you don't know mine (unless you've been lurking for the last four months). If you don't like my tone, but agree with what I'm saying in your heart of hearts, what are we actually talking about here? If you think these two freshman congresswomen are exceptional and worthy of praise then go on and give me your analysis. I'll read it

I'm on vacation right now and quite frankly I'm not as motivated to carry on with you guys like I was starting in March all the way into early June. I'm having too much fun right now to roll in the mud here. I'll be back in September. Wait for it


I understand you felt the tone was already set, but escalating wasn’t going to help your cause. In my experience when we soften our tone it causes others who disagree normally to soften theirs as well. Then discussions can happen. If we escalate you get the kind of responses you did.

I’m not a MN local (but I am here for the game tonight!) so I don’t see as much of the Omar stuff as you all do. If that statement regarding the military and al Qaeda is accurate then call her out on that and rightfully so. But to just say they are psychopathic there is nothing for people to discuss. It just comes off as an insult. I have been lurking/rarely posting for well over a couple of years. It’s one of the places I frequent to get a liberal slant to help keep me in balance. :)

I certainly was not trying to attack you or put you down. I am just trying to help have a discussion that doesn’t result to rolling in the mud. Enjoy your vacation! I always find it refreshing to use it as a reset from social media as well. Be well!
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#2502 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 09:23 AM

Thanks for your response. Much the same as you I seek opposing views to challenge my positions. On Ilhan Omar and AOC there isn't anything that could reverse my opinion at this point. Being that criticisms here are openly given in great volume I feel obliged to do the same. When I do I'm always reminded that I'm not wanted and I'm OK with that
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#2503 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 09:25 AM

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013.Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class. At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.

Edited by PseudoSABR, 19 July 2019 - 09:31 AM.


#2504 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 09:30 AM

 

 

 When I do I'm always reminded that I'm not wanted and I'm OK with that

You are welcome, but when you misconstrue facts, and vilify others, even public figures, without evidence you are going to get called out on it.Getting called out on sloppiness and hatefulness doesn't mean you're not welcome.Those who have done the same (being hateful and sloppy, not simply expressing a negative opinion) about the Republican party get called out too.

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#2505 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 11:06 AM

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013.

Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class. At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.


I never said she diminished the military in any way, but her comments on the professor talking about Al Qaeda were made when she was in college. She was born in 1982 which means she wondered this close to the time 9/11 occurred. To wonder why Al Qaeda and the US Military illicited different feelings is shamefully ignorant. Maybe you don't feel that way but a rather large majority of Americans felt the same way about Al Qaeda as her professor.
So nothing is misconstrued about what she said:
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=tkIgHFXvGSw

#2506 Vanimal46

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 11:55 AM

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

https://www.outkickt...bag-of-mail-74/

#2507 Badsmerf

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:03 PM

How can you watch that and not understand what she is trying to convey? The hypocrisy some people have about their own identities is staggering...

It is pretty obvious, she is taking about how these groups are used as examples in western culture to illicit fear for all Muslims. It isn't directly spoken, but implied. If you get something else out of that video, I hope you're never on a jury while I'm on trial.
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#2508 howeda7

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:04 PM

 

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013.Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class. At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.

If the right want to criticize "the Squad" politics that's fine. I don't agree with most of their political positions either. But instead they just pull quotes out of context and claim they're America hating radicals. There's no point in even in engaging the discussion. They're 4 members on the far left of one party. They don't have any real power. The GOP just needs a boogey-man and they're an easy target.

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#2509 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:26 PM

 

I never said she diminished the military in any way, but her comments on the professor talking about Al Qaeda were made when she was in college. She was born in 1982 which means she wondered this close to the time 9/11 occurred. To wonder why Al Qaeda and the US Military illicited different feelings is shamefully ignorant. Maybe you don't feel that way but a rather large majority of Americans felt the same way about Al Qaeda as her professor.
So nothing is misconstrued about what she said:
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=tkIgHFXvGSw

Thank you for the link. 

 

Not only does the youtube title miscontrue what she said and meant, you continue to do so. Did you watch the whole video? She's talking about something very complex--just after the 2:00 minute mark she makes the point that when terrorist commits a heinous act we investigate the whole community, but when a white person commits mass murder we investigate just that person and not the community at large. Her laughter is about the irony in the disparate treatment.

 

And she wasn't even talking about "reactions," she was talking about how the professor (and people generally) emphasize proper nouns when speaking about Islam and terrorism and mass murder.

 

I also don't believe this was filmed when she was in college; I'll believe the AP over that it was filmed in 2013. 

Edited by PseudoSABR, 19 July 2019 - 12:27 PM.


#2510 Badsmerf

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:29 PM

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

https://www.outkickt...bag-of-mail-74/


I agree with some points, disagree with others.

I do think people should be willing to stand up to being called racist... however I think these same people should be willing to listen and have conversations about it with willing participants. Sometimes an offensive statement was unintentional, sometimes it is an overreaction, but just standing up to calls of racism is arrogant and helps nothing.

Also, he states people whom criticize our country should spend a year overseas. The "america is so much better than Venezuela" argument is nothing less than ****ing stupid. How about spend a year in Germany? Or Sweden? Spend time in another wealthy nation with a high standard of living. I would argue, the ability to criticize our government is more fundamental than any other trait our country has.

This is only one instance of the countless we now have of Trump blowing dog whistles and stoking hate. He is who he is. There are tons of ways he could tweet his message to be more calculated and effective. That isn't week he is. He is a disgruntled bigot that isn't worth the time we give him.
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#2511 Vanimal46

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:43 PM

I agree with some points, disagree with others.

I do think people should be willing to stand up to being called racist... however I think these same people should be willing to listen and have conversations about it with willing participants. Sometimes an offensive statement was unintentional, sometimes it is an overreaction, but just standing up to calls of racism is arrogant and helps nothing.

Also, he states people whom criticize our country should spend a year overseas. The "america is so much better than Venezuela" argument is nothing less than ****ing stupid. How about spend a year in Germany? Or Sweden? Spend time in another wealthy nation with a high standard of living. I would argue, the ability to criticize our government is more fundamental than any other trait our country has.

This is only one instance of the countless we now have of Trump blowing dog whistles and stoking hate. He is who he is. There are tons of ways he could tweet his message to be more calculated and effective. That isn't week he is. He is a disgruntled bigot that isn't worth the time we give him.


All of this is fair. I agree with Clay's points that:

- Republicans should be fighting identity politics with ideas, not their own version of identity politics. It's valid to challenge the ideas of the 4 congresswomen he called out. But his communication is so piss poor, especially on Twitter, that caused the outrage.

- We should be thankful to be born and living in the US. For all of the country's faults and past history, this is still a great place to build a life.
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#2512 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 12:47 PM

 

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

https://www.outkickt...bag-of-mail-74/

Pretty thoughtful, but I just have to call BS on this one quote from him:

That’s the part of Trump’s rhetoric that I agree with, in an era when everyone wants to focus on what America does imperfectly, Trump, rightly in my opinion, believes America is truly great

I've heard this sentiment from too many. Didn't Trump run on Making America Great Again, which implies that America isn't great.And what has really changed since he's been elected beyond lower taxes and an unsettling immigration policy?The right's sanctimony about patriotism drives me up the wall. 

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#2513 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 02:49 PM

Thank you for the link. 
 

 
And she wasn't even talking about "reactions," she was talking about how the professor (and people generally) emphasize proper nouns when speaking about Islam and terrorism and mass murder.
 
I also don't believe this was filmed when she was in college; I'll believe the AP over that it was filmed in 2013.


In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.

As far as when this occurred I was not talking about the interview. Clearly that wasn't going to happen when she was a college student. I was (and she was) talking about when she was in college. She was 19 for the first semester of 2000 and that is when 9-11 happened. You have a habit of completely misunderstanding what's being said and then reinventing it. Please stop that or maybe instead ask for clarification.

#2514 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 04:08 PM

 

In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.

Her explanation of what she was trying to say is irrelevant to what was said? So you're going to take her words out of context and twist them to mean something disparaging and then get offended by that? Okay then.

 

Surely, if she was supporter of Al Qaeda or wanted to diminish people's reactions to 9-11, there would be tons of evidence of this, and not clips from one video interview.

 

Do you think, one remote interview in 2013, warrants the talk from the president and his followers that she "should go back"? 

 

Also this

She graduated from North Dakota State University[19] with bachelor's degrees in political science and international studies in 2011

 

Who is doing the reinventing? I don't think it's me.

 

 

Edited by PseudoSABR, 19 July 2019 - 04:13 PM.


#2515 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 04:55 PM

In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.
As far as when this occurred I was not talking about the interview. Clearly that wasn't going to happen when she was a college student. I was (and she was) talking about when she was in college. She was 19 for the first semester of 2000 and that is when 9-11 happened. You have a habit of completely misunderstanding what's being said and then reinventing it. Please stop that or maybe instead ask for clarification.

Can you clarify when 9-11 happened, again?

#2516 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 04:55 PM

She didn't take college courses AT ALL until she was in her mid 20s? That is minutiae in this discussion. Who really cares? Although this bit of information makes me wonder even more about her academic background. She graduated high school in 2000 and it took her 11 years to earn a batchelors degree. Not impressive.

As far as "context" goes I got all I need. Her explanation is nonsense to me. I need to go no further than the fact that she can't conceptualize her professor saying Al Qaeda the way he did as compared to how he says The Army. She also chuckled and smiled quite bit while talking about it.

#2517 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 04:57 PM

Can you clarify when 9-11 happened, again?


2001. Forgive me for confusing it with the year my dad passed away.
It's a thing for me. Maybe I'm not over it yet.
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#2518 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 05:02 PM

2001. Forgive me for confusing it with the year my dad passed away.
It's a thing for me. Maybe I'm not over it yet.

I can respect that.

#2519 ewen21

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 05:30 PM

Not trying to be melodramatic. I've actually made this mistake a lot

#2520 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 July 2019 - 07:32 PM

 

She didn't take college courses AT ALL until she was in her mid 20s? That is minutiae in this discussion. Who really cares? Although this bit of information makes me wonder even more about her academic background. She graduated high school in 2000 and it took her 11 years to earn a batchelors degree. Not impressive.

Who knows what the reasons were that she waited to get her degree.It's especially impressive for any one to go back to school as a non-traditional student and earn their degrees.That you minimize her education demonstrates your out-sized bias here, and as such, it's pointless to discuss this further with you.