Jump to content

Providing independent coverage of the Minnesota Twins.
Subscribe to Twins Daily Email
Photo

Neil Allen Fired

  • Please log in to reply
61 replies to this topic

#41 Vanimal46

Vanimal46

    Minnesota Twins Whine Line Host

  • Members
  • 8,005 posts
  • LocationAustin, TX

Posted 10 October 2017 - 10:27 AM

I believe Frankie Viola was let go by the Mets(I could be wrong). Blyleven seems to be able to get results with the Dutch pitching staff, so he would be a good choice, but do not think he will give up the cushy booth.
Talent level may not be as good as we were lead to believe, so hope the new FO finds good teachers for the pitching staff.


Regardless, why would the Twins want someone from an organization that has ruined almost every single one of their best pitchers?
  • jctwins and beckmt like this

#42 nicksaviking

nicksaviking

    Billy G.O.A.T

  • Twins Mods
  • 10,610 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 10:37 AM

Well if Falvey was going to go country club recruiting at his old stomping grounds, I wouldn't need any convincing that he should start with raiding Cleveland's pitching minds.
  • Vanimal46 and spinowner like this

#43 Sconnie

Sconnie

    From the "right" side of the St Croix

  • Members
  • 3,039 posts
  • LocationNW Wisconsin

Posted 10 October 2017 - 12:03 PM

 

Just throwing it out there why not get Bert Blyleven out of press box into the dugout as the pitching coach he does it anyways for world baseball Classic or another one comes to mind is FrankViola I do believe he is the pitching coach in the minors for the Mets 

because Circle Me Bert has been suspended at least once for not being able to filter himself on live TV as a commentator and blatantly gave the finger to a TV camera, as well as he's been off loaded by the Pirates and Twins for being "disgruntled".

 

In short, if he's an outspoken pain in the booty, he's probably not a good influence on young players.


#44 prouster

prouster

    Cedar Rapids

  • Members
  • 206 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 12:26 PM

 

Sounds like they may have some names already in mind.

  • Sconnie likes this

#45 spinowner

spinowner

    Minnesota Twins

  • Members
  • 3,892 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 01:05 PM

 

Just throwing it out there why not get Bert Blyleven out of press box into the dugout as the pitching coach he does it anyways for world baseball Classic or another one comes to mind is FrankViola I do believe he is the pitching coach in the minors for the Mets 

No.

  • Sconnie and kenbuddha like this

eiπ + 1 = 0


#46 nicksaviking

nicksaviking

    Billy G.O.A.T

  • Twins Mods
  • 10,610 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 01:46 PM


 
Sounds like they may have some names already in mind.


And those names are probably currently still on teams playing baseball.
  • ashburyjohn likes this

#47 jctwins

jctwins

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 314 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 04:15 PM

I like to see so many wishes that we do one more reunion with a name we know, because after all that is the best way to change the culture in this organization....


#48 jimmer

jimmer

    A former AF SNCO who values integrity.

  • Members
  • 8,822 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 04:22 PM

 

Just throwing it out there why not get Bert Blyleven out of press box into the dugout as the pitching coach he does it anyways for world baseball Classic or another one comes to mind is FrankViola I do believe he is the pitching coach in the minors for the Mets 

Oh please no.

  • diehardtwinsfan, Twins33, prouster and 1 other like this

#49 yarnivek1972

yarnivek1972

    Rochester Red Wings

  • Members
  • 2,476 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 05:13 PM

I like to see so many wishes that we do one more reunion with a name we know, because after all that is the best way to change the culture in this organization....


Yes, Carl Willis’ best year as a player was 1991. But he is a highly regarded pitching coach and has been for a long time with 3 different organizations. And, as I mentioned, has produced 4 Cy Young winners under his guidance.

I know your post wasn’t specifically addressed to me, I’m just saying that I think he is extremely qualified and might be available.
  • big dog likes this

#50 bizaff

bizaff

    Junior Member

  • Members
  • 53 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 05:16 PM

I don't think I'm a fan of Bert being pitching coach.

 

I can't remember where I read it but it was something along the lines of you don't want a great pitcher as a pitching coach.If they were great, they often are quite naturally gifted, which you can't really teach.You want someone who had to work incredibly hard to eke out every little advantage they could to remain competitive.Those are the guys that can help and teach.


#51 yarnivek1972

yarnivek1972

    Rochester Red Wings

  • Members
  • 2,476 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 05:22 PM

I don't think I'm a fan of Bert being pitching coach.

I can't remember where I read it but it was something along the lines of you don't want a great pitcher as a pitching coach. If they were great, they often are quite naturally gifted, which you can't really teach. You want someone who had to work incredibly hard to eke out every little advantage they could to remain competitive. Those are the guys that can help and teach.


Like Carl Willis. 😉

#52 old nurse

old nurse

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,982 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 06:00 PM

 

Yes, Carl Willis’ best year as a player was 1991. But he is a highly regarded pitching coach and has been for a long time with 3 different organizations. And, as I mentioned, has produced 4 Cy Young winners under his guidance.

I know your post wasn’t specifically addressed to me, I’m just saying that I think he is extremely qualified and might be available.

Why would the Red Sox not retain him?


#53 drjim

drjim

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 7,977 posts
  • LocationSt. Paul

Posted 10 October 2017 - 06:28 PM

Why would the Red Sox not retain him?


Looks like Farrell is probably out, might clean house completely.
Papers...business papers.

#54 yarnivek1972

yarnivek1972

    Rochester Red Wings

  • Members
  • 2,476 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 07:12 PM

Why would the Red Sox not retain him?


If the Red Sox make a managerial change it is pretty likely that whoever it is will be someone of some standing. In other words, someone with the clout to hand pick much of his staff. That’s the way it is with major market teams. Those are the types of guys they usually pick.

#55 jimmer

jimmer

    A former AF SNCO who values integrity.

  • Members
  • 8,822 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 07:16 PM

Red Sox are ridiculous.They let Francona for no real reason and now Farrell too?Hilarious.

  • spinowner likes this

#56 old nurse

old nurse

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,982 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 09:32 PM

 

Looks like Farrell is probably out, might clean house completely.

Willis was likely Drombosky's hire as pitching coach.


#57 old nurse

old nurse

    Member

  • Members
  • 2,982 posts

Posted 10 October 2017 - 09:32 PM

 

 

If the Red Sox make a managerial change it is pretty likely that whoever it is will be someone of some standing. In other words, someone with the clout to hand pick much of his staff. That’s the way it is with major market teams. Those are the types of guys they usually pick.

Yup, Drombosky will let the person he hires tell him what to do


#58 spycake

spycake

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 11,776 posts

Posted 11 October 2017 - 08:59 AM

 

Willis was likely Drombosky's hire as pitching coach.

Willis was named Red Sox pitching coach while Dombrowski was still employed by the Tigers (May 2015).

 

Dombrowski didn't move to the Red Sox until August 2015.


#59 Parker Hageman

Parker Hageman

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 2,526 posts

Posted 11 October 2017 - 09:23 AM

The more I think about it, the more I don't think this front office will grab an established name.

 

When they fired Tom Brunansky, there was a lot of speculation on known commodities but, in the end, they went with a somewhat unknown James Rowson. They seem to like the guy behind the guy. 

 

As I mentioned on Twitter, Ruben Niebla is a name to look out for. He's the Indians MiLB pitching coordinator and, from what I've been told, he's the guy who has been helping create all the pitchers the Indians have been churning out from their system -- more so than Mickey Callaway. There are plenty of other names like that out there. Jim Brower might be another to consider. He's the Cubs' MiLB pitching coordinator. These are two guys who I have been told are "rock stars" when it comes to developing pitching. There's plenty more out there as well. 

 

If the Twins/Falvey wants to implement new ideas/methods into the pitching system, I would imagine they would want to get someone who is at the cusp of the innovation rather than recycling someone like Willis, et al. 

  • snepp, 70charger, Sconnie and 1 other like this

"You spend a good piece of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time." -- Jim Bouton, "Ball Four"


#60 Parker Hageman

Parker Hageman

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 2,526 posts

Posted 11 October 2017 - 09:26 AM

This is kind of a postmortem on Neil Allen but this is a portion of an interview I had with him in spring training. The article was never finished because I wasn't granted access to Falvey during that time to talk overall pitching philosophy, but that's neither here nor there. Anyway, if you are interested in some of Allen's thoughts from this past March, here they are:

 

Your guys were able to get to 2-strikes a lot last year but were unable to turn those into strikeouts. How do you get guys to get that third strike in those situations?

 

What you gotta do is you gotta be able to work the four quadrants of the plate with your fastball. You gotta be able to go up-and-in, down-and-away, up-and-in, down-and-away. You gotta make hitters uncomfortable. We didn’t pitch inside to both sides of the plate effectively the way we should have last year. We got ahead, we didn’t finish. But then again we didn’t send that message during that AB to get guys uncomfortable. So therefore guys went into swing mode than we would have liked them to be and that’s the reason the results the way it was.

 

How do you instill that in pitchers coming up through the system?

 

At the lower levels, you should be able to throw your four-seam fastball to both sides of the plate. That’s the focus, that’s where you should be. When you get to High-A ball you’re starting to find yourself a breaking ball, whether it be slider, curveball, whatever it may be. You start mastering your changeup so when you get to Double-A level -- which I call that the men’s league because that’s the turning point in the minor leagues, and you got better hitters and guys been playing for two or three years -- that’s when you start putting it all together a little bit. Now we see what kind of breaking ball we got, we see how we elevate, how we get people off the plate. You got to keep people honest, you can’t let them hang over the plate. You’ve got to pitch inside, you’ve got to elevate and change eye levels, so when you go back into the zone, they are going to think about it. If you are capable of having a good fastball plan to get strike one, you can double up in the twice knowing you can come back throwing your pitches for strikes.

 

You have a lot of guys coming into camp with new routines, like Ryan O’Rourke and the weighted balls, and new mechanics, like Kyle Gibson, how do you as a pitching coach work with that?

 

First of all, you let them be themselves the first couple of weeks, in BP sessions, the first few games, and you watch them. Let them build off the confidence that they are feeling with their new mechanics, new arm slots, whatever it may be. And let’s see how we work out. Don’t take that away, don’t criticize it, don’t critique it until let them go out and get some results on their own. Then you start talking about it. Just to come out and say I don’t like that or I don’t like this, that’s wrong. Let them show you what they’ve been working on then feed off of it later on in camp. We’re getting to the point now we’ve got the potential to say, it’s been two or three weeks now, where you start seeing what a guy is capable of doing and then you try to give him some advice or pointers that you think might benefit him, but don’t take away his hopes and dreams of everything he’s been working on all winter. Let’s see the results first before we start critiquing.

 

What do you have to do this year to be better as a staff?

 

We’ve got to pitch inside. We’ve got to pitch inside to both plates and be effective to both sides of the plate because the staff, like you just said, we can throw strikes. We did an OK job of getting ahead but we got to improve on that even. But once we get ahead we got to establish the innerhalf of the plate and get people off the ball.

 
  • Sconnie likes this

"You spend a good piece of your life gripping a baseball and in the end it turns out that it was the other way around all the time." -- Jim Bouton, "Ball Four"