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Article: MIN 4, KC 2: Comeback Complete

jorge polanco kyle gibson joe mauer matt belisle robbie grossman
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#61 Tom Froemming

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 11:42 AM

Here's the deal with Gibson ...

 

Opponent's OPS w/2 Outs

Career through the 1st half of '17: .735

2nd half of '17: .552

 

There are some other things going on, but his ability to finish off innings of late has been huge.

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#62 yarnivek1972

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 01:30 PM

If I did my math correct, since May 28th, Gibson's ERA is 4.29 in 18 starts.
1 game with 7 runs allowed
1 game with 6 runs allowed
1 game with 4 runs allowed
6 games with 3 runs allowed
5 games with 2 runs allowed
3 games with 1 runs allowed
1 game with 0 runs allowed

I will take that from my 5th starter every year.


Gibson isn't the 5th starter. He would currently be slotted ahead of Slegers and eventually Mejia.

Two things bother/concern me. Yeah, it's nice that Gibson has been pitching well the last few weeks. Better than him pitching poorly. But the teams he has faced of late are some of the worst offenses in baseball. Of course, he's been known to pitch poorly in those situations too. That he is not is a positive.

The other is consistency. Or the lack thereof. One expects Mejia and Berrios to be inconsistent. That's part of being 23-24 with limited MLB experience. Gibson is neither young or inexperienced. At this point in his career he should be able to consistently hit his spots and have command of his pitches. But he doesn't. I just don't see him worthy of any kind of long term investment based on the results to date. As for 2018, I'll get back to you after the season.
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#63 LA VIkes Fan

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 01:50 PM

I think a lot of the difference is between the ears. Gibson is a guy who haddifficulty for a very long time recovering from adversity. It seemed like there were many gameswhere he would be going along just fine and then give up a walkon a borderline pitch, or give up a couple of hits, or someone would make an erroror he would give up a bloop hit, or something like that, and then would just completely collapse and wind up giving up a three or four run inning. That's why I've always been in favor of jettisoning him after the season. These last few starts he is shown a much better mental makeup and pitched better in difficult situations. He would be worth keeping if that's real and will continue. It seems to me that that's the decision that has to be made.

Edited by LA VIkes Fan, 08 September 2017 - 01:51 PM.


#64 Dantes929

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 07:15 PM

 

Yeah! This!

 

No sacrifice bunting to 2B ever (exception: the pitcher is batting and you can't pinch hit for some reason).

 

Bunt runners to 3B with guy on 2B and no out can be fine with a weak hitter in the early innings and by most hitters in the late innings when you just need 1 run.

Lets not pretend there is no value to getting a guy to second especially when you don't do it and  the 2nd guy bats into a double play.  Guy on second with 1 out is way different than no one on and two outs. I mean that is the main reason for doing it.  I agree its not a good percentage play though.The fact that most pro teams don't field bunts much better than high school teams is offset by the fact that pro hitters are no better than high schoolers at actually getting the bunt down. 

Don't Sweat the Small Stuff ... and it's all small stuff.


#65 yarnivek1972

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 08:33 PM

Lets not pretend there is no value to getting a guy to second especially when you don't do it and the 2nd guy bats into a double play. Guy on second with 1 out is way different than no one on and two outs. I mean that is the main reason for doing it. I agree its not a good percentage play though. The fact that most pro teams don't field bunts much better than high school teams is offset by the fact that pro hitters are no better than high schoolers at actually getting the bunt down.


1) You don't ask your # 3 hitter to bunt. He's usually your BEST hitter. Right now, I'd say that is definitely what Polanco is.

2) You don't play for a tie on the road. You play for the win.

#66 Dantes929

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Posted 08 September 2017 - 09:55 PM

 

1) You don't ask your # 3 hitter to bunt. He's usually your BEST hitter. Right now, I'd say that is definitely what Polanco is.

2) You don't play for a tie on the road. You play for the win.

Not arguing that particular instance.   Not even arguing for sacrificing a guy to second in general since I did say I agree that it is not a high percentage play.    Just saying there are some advantages to doing it, ie scoring position and staying out of double play, which is why it has been done for a century. Advanced stats now say don't do it. I doubt the stats are that lopsided but over time small percentages make a difference.

Don't Sweat the Small Stuff ... and it's all small stuff.


#67 Original Whizzinator

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Posted 09 September 2017 - 09:42 AM

Agreed on everything above this but not this. By most accounts, he's kind of a pain. He's difficult for coaches to work with and has rubbed teammates the wrong way in the past. Also, just look at the guy. He looks like someone you wouldn't really like (I know that's terrible, but we all make judgments like that.)


C'mon this is nonsense. The old saying there is someone for everyone holds true. We would all have baseball in common but from the comments it is apparent we have a wide variety of types here that love baseball. Everyone would probably agree that Gibson appears a bit pinched at times but we would all also gain new respect for a guy who gets knocked down hard like he has this year if he bounces back. I'd he does start having fun out there and develops some toughness I'll be on board. This is a fun group and it may just loosen ole Gibby up a little.

#68 Tomj14

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 09:13 AM

 

Gibson isn't the 5th starter. He would currently be slotted ahead of Slegers and eventually Mejia.

Two things bother/concern me. Yeah, it's nice that Gibson has been pitching well the last few weeks. Better than him pitching poorly. But the teams he has faced of late are some of the worst offenses in baseball. Of course, he's been known to pitch poorly in those situations too. That he is not is a positive.

The other is consistency. Or the lack thereof. One expects Mejia and Berrios to be inconsistent. That's part of being 23-24 with limited MLB experience. Gibson is neither young or inexperienced. At this point in his career he should be able to consistently hit his spots and have command of his pitches. But he doesn't. I just don't see him worthy of any kind of long term investment based on the results to date. As for 2018, I'll get back to you after the season.

I am not sure how Gibson is to blame that the twins only have 2 pitchers better than him.

Gibson hasn't been pitching well for the last few weeks, he has been pitching well since the end of May (which is the last few months, not weeks)

I don't think anybody has said invest in him long term, but he is only 30 and right now there aren't too many free agents to be that I want to spend big money on. I wouldn't pencil him in for the 2018 rotation either, but while he is inconsistent at times I rather him in the 5th spot then any one of are minor league prospects at least starting 18.

 


#69 yarnivek1972

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 12:26 PM

 

I am not sure how Gibson is to blame that the twins only have 2 pitchers better than him.

Gibson hasn't been pitching well for the last few weeks, he has been pitching well since the end of May (which is the last few months, not weeks)

I don't think anybody has said invest in him long term, but he is only 30 and right now there aren't too many free agents to be that I want to spend big money on. I wouldn't pencil him in for the 2018 rotation either, but while he is inconsistent at times I rather him in the 5th spot then any one of are minor league prospects at least starting 18.

 

I am going to reply to this in the Gibson thread since the post is about him specifically and not the game in general.




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