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Eduardo Escobar 3B to Red Sox?

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#1 goulik

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 06:07 AM

So the Red Sox are believed to be shopping for a 3B.

https://www.mlbtrade.../boston-red-sox

What if we sent them utility player EE to fill that hole? What could we get back and could we use prospects acquired (I would assume we're not getting controllable MLB ready pitchers) to flip and package with some of our own for one of those young controllable starters from someone else?

#2 Twodogs

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 08:49 AM

But are we confident enough with Polanco for him to man SS for the rest of the year? I think Polanco will probably be better next year when there is less on his plate, but Escobar does provide really nice depth in the middle infield. And I don't think he's be worth very much in return?? The Twins got Max value out of Nunez last year, but he was pretty much a full time starter, and an All Star where I feel Escobar is probably just as good as Nunez, but he has been put in a reserve role this year.

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#3 Oldgoat_MN

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:11 AM

I can't see the Yankees going for this. Esco has more power than Headley, but Headley actually has a higher OBP. Esco has a wRC+ of 95 while Headley has a wRC+ of 93. There is not enough of an upgrade there to entice anything useful from the Yankees.

We only have one third baseman the Yankees are interested in and that would indeed require a huge return.

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#4 Mike Sixel

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:19 AM

 

I can't see the Yankees going for this. Esco has more power than Headley, but Headley actually has a higher OBP. Esco has a wRC+ of 95 while Headley has a wRC+ of 93. There is not enough of an upgrade there to entice anything useful from the Yankees.

We only have one third baseman the Yankees are interested in and that would indeed require a huge return.

 

Yankees, or Red Sox?

 

Either way, I doubt it happens. He's not that good. The Sox should just call up their minor league stud. The Yankees will be buying Machado in 1.5 years, so not sure what they should do here. I am not familiar enough with their minor league system...

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#5 Vanimal46

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:20 AM

 

But are we confident enough with Polanco for him to man SS for the rest of the year? I think Polanco will probably be better next year when there is less on his plate, but Escobar does provide really nice depth in the middle infield. And I don't think he's be worth very much in return?? The Twins got Max value out of Nunez last year, but he was pretty much a full time starter, and an All Star where I feel Escobar is probably just as good as Nunez, but he has been put in a reserve role this year.

 

One thing that Molitor has improved on this year is giving some young players a lot of leash, especially Polanco this year. 

It seems like they no longer trust Escobar's defense at SS anymore, because he's only started 7 games there all season. The last time he started at SS was June 9th. 

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#6 kab21

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 11:19 AM

IMO of the Eduardos - Escobar > Nunez

 

Escobar's future depends on the Twin's secret plans with regards to trading Nick Gordon and their intent on Sano at 3B. If they plan on keeping Gordon and not dangling him as trade bait for a starter then Escobar is a bit redundant (and a pending FA) next season. 

It appears that the Twins are intent on Sano at 3B but Escobar has played 1/2 as many games at 3B  as Sano. That is fairly significant as far as backups go.

The other elephant in the room is Dozier (with regards to Escobar) and if he will be traded. He seems like a difficult option to resign after 2018. All signs point to prime decline years with little upside. That will be kind of a defining moment for Falvey/Levine imo. Escobar is an awesome utility player and could be an okay starter on an affordable extension. I would consider an Escobar extension right now but completely dismiss a Dozier extension. That (Dozier) makes no sense.

 

My concern with trading Escobar now is that the Twins MI depth could look really bad in 2019 assuming Dozier leaves and either Polanco doesn't cut it as a starter or Gordon is traded. Escobar seems like an excellent extension candidate filling the role of super utility guy or adequate starter. 

Yet it would be tempting to add another starter pitching prospect at the level of Mejia/Romero/Gonsalves/Jorge (back end or outside of the top 100 prospects).

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Is 2016 2017 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? 

Looks like we will have to wait another year until a good pitching prospect is actually blocked.


#7 yarnivek1972

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 02:29 PM

IMO of the Eduardos - Escobar > Nunez

Escobar's future depends on the Twin's secret plans with regards to trading Nick Gordon and their intent on Sano at 3B. If they plan on keeping Gordon and not dangling him as trade bait for a starter then Escobar is a bit redundant (and a pending FA) next season.

It appears that the Twins are intent on Sano at 3B but Escobar has played 1/2 as many games at 3B as Sano. That is fairly significant as far as backups go.

The other elephant in the room is Dozier (with regards to Escobar) and if he will be traded. He seems like a difficult option to resign after 2018. All signs point to prime decline years with little upside. That will be kind of a defining moment for Falvey/Levine imo. Escobar is an awesome utility player and could be an okay starter on an affordable extension. I would consider an Escobar extension right now but completely dismiss a Dozier extension. That (Dozier) makes no sense.

My concern with trading Escobar now is that the Twins MI depth could look really bad in 2019 assuming Dozier leaves and either Polanco doesn't cut it as a starter or Gordon is traded. Escobar seems like an excellent extension candidate filling the role of super utility guy or adequate starter.

Yet it would be tempting to add another starter pitching prospect at the level of Mejia/Romero/Gonsalves/Jorge (back end or outside of the top 100 prospects).


I'm not sure I understand the logic of extending Escobar but completely dismissing the idea of extending Dozier. Dozier is clearly the superior offensive threat. Obviously, Escobar provides defensive flexibility, but neither is substantially better than average. As for age, Dozier is only 18 months older. Dozier is proven as a starter. Escobar has shown that his production drops the more he plays.
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#8 DocBauer

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 02:58 PM

If Dozier isn't going to be extended, especially if Gordon WERE moved in trade, is keep Escobar. He just brings a lot of overall value as a quasi-starting utility player. And if some trades are made, we could suddenly need all the MI depth we can get
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#9 jaimedude2

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 03:36 PM

I'm really starting to dislike Polanco at short stop. For that reason alone I would say no trade of Eduardo Escobar. He is too valuable in the roles he fills, in fact he should be starting a few more games  in place of Polanco instead of Sano. Perhaps the Twins could trade Dozier to the Red Sox and get something decent back, he could play 3rd or they could move there second basemen to third and let Dozier settle there.To me this deadline is the time to trade Dozier to somebody else. This might be when Dozier has his highest value trade wise at the non-waiver trade deadline. 

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#10 jun

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 03:37 PM

One thing that Molitor has improved on this year is giving some young players a lot of leash, especially Polanco this year. 

It seems like they no longer trust Escobar's defense at SS anymore, because he's only started 7 games there all season. The last time he started at SS was June 9th.

I think they just want to give Polanco consistent playing time to see if he can handle SS, so far it's not good. I just don't see the reason why they have no faith in Escobar's defense at SS.

#11 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 03:52 PM

I'm not sure I understand the logic of extending Escobar but completely dismissing the idea of extending Dozier. Dozier is clearly the superior offensive threat. Obviously, Escobar provides defensive flexibility, but neither is substantially better than average. As for age, Dozier is only 18 months older. Dozier is proven as a starter. Escobar has shown that his production drops the more he plays.


I don't want to speak for KAB, but I don't think Dozier is interested in an extension. I think he wants a chance to test what he can get on the open market.

#12 yarnivek1972

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:08 PM

I don't want to speak for KAB, but I don't think Dozier is interested in an extension. I think he wants a chance to test what he can get on the open market.


That may have been true after last season, but Dozier is still another year away from FA and his numbers are considerably down. I'm sure his agent is also well aware that power from 2b isn't a rarity right now. There are probably 10-15 2b-men that can match, or at least approach, Dozier's HR output. That's really all Dozier brings to the table. He has never hit for average. His defense is middling. He gets the occasional steal, but again nothing that seperates him from the pack. Point being, high supply = low demand.

#13 Mike Sixel

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:11 PM

the issue with Polanco is he's hitting like Buxton, but fielding like Dozier.....that's not a good combination. He'll never be an ELITE fielder, so he needs to hit. I say keep sending him out there this year, and see what happens.

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I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#14 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:21 PM

That may have been true after last season, but Dozier is still another year away from FA and his numbers are considerably down. I'm sure his agent is also well aware that power from 2b isn't a rarity right now. There are probably 10-15 2b-men that can match, or at least approach, Dozier's HR output. That's really all Dozier brings to the table. He has never hit for average. His defense is middling. He gets the occasional steal, but again nothing that seperates him from the pack. Point being, high supply = low demand.


That's all logical, but pro athletes aren't always self aware about their value. (Remember Lattell Spreewell anyone? )

#15 yarnivek1972

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:23 PM

That's all logical, but pro athletes aren't always self aware about their value. (Remember Lattell Spreewell anyone? )


That's why they hire agents. I'm sure Dozier's agent is well aware of what his value is likely to be at age 31, assuming he maintains close to his career norms.

#16 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:34 PM

That's why they hire agents. I'm sure Dozier's agent is well aware of what his value is likely to be at age 31, assuming he maintains close to his career norms.


Yes, but they are not obligated to listen to their agent.
I assume Spreewell had an agent screaming at him to take the deal.

#17 yarnivek1972

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 04:36 PM

Yes, but they are not obligated to listen to their agent.
I assume Spreewell had an agent screaming at him to take the deal.


Dozier doesn't strike me as that unintelligent.

#18 Sconnie

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 07:53 PM

the issue with Polanco is he's hitting like Buxton, but fielding like Dozier.....that's not a good combination. He'll never be an ELITE fielder, so he needs to hit. I say keep sending him out there this year, and see what happens.

agreed. However, I like Escobar as the check valve. https://en.m.wikiped...iki/Check_valve

He lets you find out what you have in Polanco and Sano, and potentially Gordon without the cherry picker collapsing if the hydraulics fail.

#19 kab21

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Posted 17 July 2017 - 09:20 PM

 

I'm not sure I understand the logic of extending Escobar but completely dismissing the idea of extending Dozier. Dozier is clearly the superior offensive threat. Obviously, Escobar provides defensive flexibility, but neither is substantially better than average. As for age, Dozier is only 18 months older. Dozier is proven as a starter. Escobar has shown that his production drops the more he plays.

The logic is that Escobar might be extended for a third of what Dozier is looking for and has the flexibility to just be a utility IF (outstanding level) or take a starting role (adequately) if needed.

If Dozier was looking for a 3/40-50M deal then that's great but if it is 4-5 years and 18-20M/yr then that sounds like a bad idea for a player that is already 30.

Is 2016 2017 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? 

Looks like we will have to wait another year until a good pitching prospect is actually blocked.