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Quintana to the Cubs

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#21 gunnarthor

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 10:40 AM

 

In less than 2 years the Sox have put together an enviable group of SP prospects and rebuilt a farm system. The Twins haven't been able to put together even a mediocre amount of pitching talent in 6+ years....SAD

 

Oh, and are we still convinced that pitching isn't overpriced at the deadline?

Eh, I know people need to rip on the Twins but Berrios was a damn good prospect. I think he should at least count as mediocre.  I do like your Trump-like "... SAD" thing though.

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#22 Mike Sixel

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 10:42 AM

 

Eh, I know people need to rip on the Twins but Berrios was a damn good prospect. I think he should at least count as mediocre.  I do like your Trump-like "... SAD" thing though.

 

I think it was "amount" there....so 1 isn't a lot of amount. And I'd agree with that.

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I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#23 dbminn

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 10:43 AM

The top two prospects in the trade have serious potential. Still, I'm surprised the Cubs didn't have to add a third prospect from their top 30.

 

I would've traded the four Seth mentioned for Quintana. 

 

 

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#24 biggentleben

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:02 AM

Not surprising the Sox went for this over some of the "depth" deals that have been mentioned rumored going back to offseason. Hahn has said they want to go for top-end guys when they make a deal, not a spread of guys. However, I do like that in every deal they've picked up a flyer guy that I could really see turning out well. Rose in this deal has some prodigious right-handed power, and if he could polish his zone judgement, he could be a big bat for the middle of an order. Could never develop that zone judgement and be nothing as well, but a good flyer at the back of a deal like this.

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#25 KirbyDome89

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:08 AM

 

Eh, I know people need to rip on the Twins but Berrios was a damn good prospect. I think he should at least count as mediocre.  I do like your Trump-like "... SAD" thing though.

Not a "need," to do so, it's an objective view. In < 2 years of smart trades and drafting the Sox have acquired the type of pitching talent that wins divisions. Yes, it's sad to see Houston doing so well, and Chicago basically following their blueprint to success thus far, while the Twins have struggled to reach mediocrity. That isn't "ripping," them, it's pointing out the obvious. 

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#26 nicksaviking

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:14 AM

Ugh, I liked it better when the White Sox had to build their team through pricey free agent deals. They haven't done well with that. Not looking forward to seeing Chicago become competitive with cheap controllable young guys. The money the young guys will save the team could be devastating for the KC, CLE and MIN when it comes to bringing in the big ticket and high priced hole fillers.

 

I never hear them mentioned, but they're going to have so much money to spend they could easily get Harper or Machado. Or both.

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#27 LA VIkes Fan

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:24 AM

This shows the cost of quality starting pitching.  Nick is right about the price in Twins prospects (if that would even have been enough) and we just don't have the prospects to trade. This makes me think that getting a front line starter is really a pipedream so probably no Gray, Archer or Cole.  Sounds like we should concentrate on relief pitching, a RH DH/1B/OF bat and see what the young starters can do.  


#28 Twinsoholic

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:25 AM

This is not going to happen as he Twins are in contention for the playoffs, but if they were to offer Santana what do you think the return would be?


#29 markos

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:35 AM

 

Ugh, I liked it better when the White Sox had to build their team through pricey free agent deals. They haven't done well with that. Not looking forward to seeing Chicago become competitive with cheap controllable young guys. The money the young guys will save the team could be devastating for the KC, CLE and MIN when it comes to bringing in the big ticket and high priced hole fillers.

 

I never hear them mentioned, but they're going to have so much money to spend they could easily get Harper or Machado. Or both.

They almost have to, right? Their position player pipeline is still really thin. Moancada and Jimenez are nice pieces (I guess like Buxton and Sano back in the day), but they don't really have any Gordons, Polancos, Keplers or even Rosarios also in the pipeline. Basically, if you broaden it to all 24-and-under position players (majors or minors), the Twins are way, way, way ahead of where the White Sox are.

Edited by markos, 13 July 2017 - 11:36 AM.

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#30 Brandon

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:39 AM

I just saw on mlbtraderumors that the cubs aquired Quintana for 4 prospects including a top 5 mlb prospect and their 2nd best prospect and 2 others. I dont know much about these prospects but this becomes a good gauge to see what a controllable starter is worth. I wanted to get your thoughts on the prospects and compare to ours and to other pitchers on the market.

Edited by Brandon, 13 July 2017 - 11:40 AM.


#31 Mike Sixel

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:40 AM

 

They almost have to, right? Their position player pipeline is still really thin. Moancada and Jimenez are nice pieces (I guess like Buxton and Sano back in the day), but they don't really have any Gordons, Polancos, Keplers or even Rosarios also in the pipeline. Basically, if you broaden it to all 24-and-under position players (majors or minors), the Twins are way, way, way ahead of where the White Sox are.

 

The WS are less than 2 years into their attempt to rebuild, they seem to have made some strong progress by committing to one direction, and executing to that strategy. Add 1-3 really good drafts, any FA signings, and any international market moves, and they seem to be doing a solid job so far with this strategy.

 

The Twins are supposedly in year 4-5 of the rebuild, I'd expect them to be ahead.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#32 brvama

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:41 AM

Maybe it's my anti-WS bias, but I'm going to wait 2-3 yrs before I jump on the band wagon of how great their haul for future success these prospects are. "Prospects are still prospects until they aren't," as some smart poster has said before on this site.
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#33 mazeville

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:45 AM

 

Interesting that the White Sox would work with the Cubs like this. 

 

The White Sox are almost looking like an Astros-like rebuild with the talent they now have in their pipeline.

 

They are going to be really, really good in a couple of years.

 

This is how you do an effective rebuild. You tear everything down and collect assets. Twins didn't do that. Drives me nuts.

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#34 brvama

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:50 AM

They are going to be really, really good in a couple of years.
 
This is how you do an effective rebuild. You tear everything down and collect assets. Twins didn't do that. Drives me nuts.


The Twins really didn't have the assets to net trades like this.
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#35 Taildragger8791

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:50 AM

 

They almost have to, right? Their position player pipeline is still really thin. Moancada and Jimenez are nice pieces (I guess like Buxton and Sano back in the day), but they don't really have any Gordons, Polancos, Keplers or even Rosarios also in the pipeline. Basically, if you broaden it to all 24-and-under position players (majors or minors), the Twins are way, way, way ahead of where the White Sox are.

 

Those mid-level players are easier to acquire than top-end pitching though. Free agency, the draft, and international free agency are all more reliable for finding decent position players at reasonable cost. Really good starting pitchers are more of a crapshoot to develop and are rarely available in free agency for less than a mint.


#36 twinsfanstreif

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:51 AM

wow, now the White Sox have 9 prospects on the MLB.com top 100 list, with the last being #68! that's crazy, they have the #1 prospect and 5 in the top 30. Baseball America is a little less friendly to them but on their midseason update this still puts 7 in the top 100. This reminds me of the Astros and the Cubs farm systems a few years ago, I believe they had 8 each on the top 100 list, we also had 7 at one point.

Edited by twinsfanstreif, 13 July 2017 - 11:55 AM.


#37 bluechipper

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:52 AM

 

They are going to be really, really good in a couple of years.

 

This is how you do an effective rebuild. You tear everything down and collect assets. Twins didn't do that. Drives me nuts.

The White Sox had many more tradeable players while still being a bad team than the Twins did though. It's harder to tear it down when there's not much to tear down.

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#38 jimmer

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:57 AM

They almost have to, right? Their position player pipeline is still really thin. Moancada and Jimenez are nice pieces (I guess like Buxton and Sano back in the day), but they don't really have any Gordons, Polancos, Keplers or even Rosarios also in the pipeline. Basically, if you broaden it to all 24-and-under position players (majors or minors), the Twins are way, way, way ahead of where the White Sox are.

White Sox now have, per BA midseason prospect rankings, the #1, #5, #20, #45, #59, #75 and #83 prospects.

We have 2 top 100 guys?

And that doeant even include Chicago's Alec Hansen, who was top 50 in BPs midseason list but somehow missed BAs top 100. Nor does it include Burger, their 1st round pick this year who will likely be their 3B in 2019.

Edited by jimmer, 13 July 2017 - 12:11 PM.


#39 dbminn

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 11:58 AM

The White Sox are 11 games under .500 and headed south. They are doing what they need to rebuild. They will be strong about the time the Twins core group is eligible for free agency. (Maybe earlier, depending on who they get for Robertson and Frazier)

 

The Twins have five position players age 25 and under and are headed up. Two Twins starters are here to stay and are 23 and 24. There should be at least two more new relievers up later this year. Granite and Garver give the Twins some depth. They also have enough farm talent and available cash to acquire players and compete for the next four years.

 

I'd rather be the Twins than the White Sox. Of course, we could trade our MLB talent and build for 2021...

Edited by dbminn, 13 July 2017 - 11:58 AM.

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#40 spycake

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Posted 13 July 2017 - 12:10 PM

 

I often get asked what a comparable Twins deal might be...

 

The Twins don't have a prospect that's as highly touted as Eloy Jimenez, unless you want to say Byron Buxton.

 

So, the best I could come up with is:

 

Nick Gordon, Fernando Romero, Zander Wiel and Nelson Molina. 

Might be better to say "we couldn't make a comparable deal" so as not to mislead anyone.

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