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Article: Hildenberger (And Gee) Gets The Call

trevor hildenberger dillon gee ehire adrianza nik turley
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#21 gman

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 05:33 AM

With the call up of Hildenberger and Busenitz earlier, Rochester is running rather thin in available support. Reed and Melotakis may make appearances later this year, but currently have only thrown 3 innings between them at Rochester. Probably won't see them for at least a month. Given a choice I would prefer to see these four take their lumps then other teams retreads.

I expect to see Santiago, Pressly, Hughes and perhaps Tonkin again. Looks like a revolving door set up for the pitching staff in general for the rest of the year. 


#22 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 05:40 AM

My first guess was that Gee would be replaced by Santiago in a few days, then be recalled as the 26th man to start in next Saturday's doubleheader. But while Gee has options remaining, he also has over 5 years of MLB service time so he has to consent to being optioned. He consented to being optioned by the Rangers already this spring, so perhaps he could consent again for us. Or we could release him and re-sign him, I suppose.
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#23 Respy

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 05:45 AM

Gee will be temporary as Hughes and Santiago are almost ready to come back.  I really hope Hildenberger can stick.  About time!


#24 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 05:56 AM

Gee will be temporary as Hughes and Santiago are almost ready to come back.


Not sure. If Gee avoids implosion (and his record says that is likely), I think his service time status might keep him on the roster a while. The first ones to go will probably be any strugglers among Boshers, Busenitz, and Hildenberger. But hopefully they all do well, and perhaps that would finally shift the heat to Breslow.

Edited by spycake, 23 June 2017 - 05:56 AM.

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#25 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 06:11 AM

I'm pretty excited for Hildenberger. I got to meet him at ST in 2016. He is a nice guy. I hope the Twins give both him and Busenitz a reasonably long leash at this point, as both of shown in AAA that they are ready for a taste.

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#26 yarnivek1972

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 07:08 AM

How long has it been since Chargois pitched? Could he be a 60 day DL candidate? Could Haley be sent back to make room?


There is no such thing as a 60 day DL for the minors. Once the decision was made in March to option him to AAA and place him on the DL there, that ship sailed. I doubt it would be allowable to retroactively place him on the MLB DL unless his agent was successful with some sort of grievance. Which, frankly is possible and would likely even be successful. He was optioned because he pitched poorly in ST. He presumably was pitching poorly because of the injury. His agent could argue that Chargois should have been medically evaluated prior to being optioned.
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#27 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 07:34 AM

 

There is no such thing as a 60 day DL for the minors. Once the decision was made in March to option him to AAA and place him on the DL there, that ship sailed. I doubt it would be allowable to retroactively place him on the MLB DL

Options can be rescinded.  Here's a few examples:

 

http://www.bostonher...bled_list_after

 

http://m.mlb.com/new...tion-rescinded/

 

http://www.foxsports...34243235-050712

 

Obviously Chargois was optioned a while ago, so I'm not sure it would be quite so straightforward, and it would be the 60-day DL rather than the 15-day DL, but I'm also not finding any language anywhere yet that strictly prohibits it.  It's an odd area of transactional rules, to be sure!  It seems that, as long as their is no dispute about his health and timeline for return, he and the player's union would welcome the MLB back pay and service time (plus freeing up a spot for an additional union member?).

 

Otherwise, you are correct that there doesn't appear to be a direct mechanism for moving a player from a minor league DL to the MLB 60-day DL. Per Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia...League_Baseball

 

Minor League Baseball uses a 7-day disabled list for all injuries. Players who are on the 40-man roster but get hurt in the minor leagues are placed on the minor league DL, but not on the major league DL. One problem this poses is that a player who is injured in the minors and who would be placed on the major league 60-day DL cannot be placed on the 60-day, meaning the 40-man roster spot is not freed up.

 

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#28 yarnivek1972

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:00 AM

I think the Twins might have an issue with retroactively awarding service time and back pay.  Otherwise, they would have taken that action in April.


#29 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:04 AM

 

I think the Twins might have an issue with retroactively awarding service time and back pay.  Otherwise, they would have taken that action in April.

Obviously, yes, it's a bigger deal for the Twins.  But it wasn't clear that Chargois' injury was serious until the last couple weeks.  And the team arguably didn't have as much need for the 40-man spot in April.


#30 yarnivek1972

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:07 AM

 

Obviously, yes, it's a bigger deal for the Twins.  But it wasn't clear that Chargois' injury was serious until the last couple weeks.  And the team arguably didn't have as much need for the 40-man spot in April.

It was clear he was injured in April.  Frankly, that should have been all that mattered to change his status from optioned to DL.  But it wasn't.  Once again the Twins organization is bowing down to the almighty dollar.  That's why they remain a second rate organization.

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#31 Mike Sixel

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:07 AM

Congrats on the call up! It is deserved. Also, clearly the secret to his success is spending time in Bend, OR, one of the most beautiful places on the planet.

 

I hope the Twins are patient, and let him pitch up here for some time.

 

On Gee.....this is what happens when you make zero moves to fix the SP in the off season, despite having the worst (or close to it) starting staff in MLB the previous year.

Edited by Mike Sixel, 23 June 2017 - 08:08 AM.

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It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#32 drjim

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:08 AM

Obviously, yes, it's a bigger deal for the Twins. But it wasn't clear that Chargois' injury was serious until the last couple weeks. And the team arguably didn't have as much need for the 40-man spot in April.


In the Twins defense, they still don't have much need for a 40 man roster spot.
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#33 drjim

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:09 AM

It was clear he was injured in April. Frankly, that should have been all that mattered to change his status from optioned to DL. But it wasn't. Once again the Twins organization is bowing down to the almighty dollar. That's why they remain a second rate organization.


This doesn't make much sense. They haven't had a need for a 40 man spot, so why would they give up money and service time for nothing?
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#34 drjim

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:11 AM

Congrats on the call up! It is deserved. Also, clearly the secret to his success is spending time in Bend, OR, one of the most beautiful places on the planet.

I hope the Twins are patient, and let him pitch up here for some time.

On Gee.....this is what happens when you make zero moves to fix the SP in the off season, despite having the worst (or close to it) starting staff in MLB the previous year.


So now you're advocating they should have signed more veterans last offseason to block younger pitchers for even longer coming into the year?
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#35 Mike Sixel

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:11 AM

 

This doesn't make much sense. They haven't had a need for a 40 man spot, so why would they give up money and service time for nothing?

 

I'm surprised they haven't filed a grievance, since it appears he was hurt in MN. 

It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#36 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:13 AM

 

It was clear he was injured in April.  Frankly, that should have been all that mattered to change his status from optioned to DL.  But it wasn't.  Once again the Twins organization is bowing down to the almighty dollar.  That's why they remain a second rate organization.

It wasn't clear that Chargois was injured when they optioned him.  He even made a couple appearances in AAA before he hit the DL there.  That's a bit different case than most guys who have options rescinded.  I wouldn't jump to blame the Twins here, it may not really be possible to do this.

 

I don't think it's likely, but hypothetically, if Chargois did get service time for the entire 2017 season, he still wouldn't be arbitration eligible until after the 2019 season at the earliest.And he would still have 2 minor league options years remaining after this season, meaning we could option him back to the minors in 2018 and even 2019 if we so desired and potentially push back that arb timeline further (although he'd be 27-28 years old by then, and his arb salary is likely negligible if he's getting optioned those seasons).

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#37 Mike Sixel

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:13 AM

 

So now you're advocating they should have signed more veterans last offseason to block younger pitchers for even longer coming into the year?

 

I don't want to derail this thread. 

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It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 


#38 drjim

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:14 AM

I'm surprised they haven't filed a grievance, since it appears he was hurt in MN.


Maybe, but he also never let them know he was hurt trying to win a spot out of spring.

And he did reinjure himself since the original spring training injury.
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#39 spycake

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:16 AM

 

In the Twins defense, they still don't have much need for a 40 man roster spot.

True.  Although in relative terms, it's a slightly greater need now than before, but yeah, if not Haley, then Breslow is still a pretty obvious cut candidate.  And Gee likely will be too after our doubleheader next Saturday.


#40 Mike Sixel

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Posted 23 June 2017 - 08:18 AM

 

Maybe, but he also never let them know he was hurt trying to win a spot out of spring.

And he did reinjure himself since the original spring training injury.

 

right, we don't know....but if I'm him, I at least think about it. Especially with his injury history, it might be some of his real pay.

 

It kind of reinforces the thought that trying to play thru an arm injury (or any) for a pitcher is a bad idea....

It's been a fun year so far, GO Twins. 




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