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Sonny Gray Trade Target?

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#1 Loosey

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 12:17 PM

With Oakland looking like sellers, what do you think they would ask for in return for Sonny Gray?  Gray isn't exactly your prototypical frontline Ace, but is a "high-end" #2 starter on almost any team and can pitch as a #1 for extended periods of time.  On the surface he doesn't look spectacular this year, but his peripherals look awfully close to his 2015 All-Star season.  Mix in the Twins outfield and you might have something here that could be a nice looking piece of the rotation for a few years.

 

Gray isn't a Free Agent until after the 2020 season and the Twins looking like they may be ready to be real life contenders in a year if things fall into place would make something with Gray make sense.

 

The question would become what would Oakland ask for in return?  I assume some combination of Gonsalves/Gordon/Romero would be a starting point.  

 

Having a 1-2 punch of Berrios and Gray would look very nice for a few years.  But is he sturdy enough to give up some very solid prospects?

 

 

 

 

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#2 Rhino and Compass

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 12:31 PM

I think for a team that brought in a new FO with an emphasis on it's ability to develop pitching talent, moving two pitching prospects for one pitcher with an injury history doesn't seem like the appropriate type of gamble. I would say that the team would be loathe to give up any of their top end pitching talent, especially the younger guys that they have more time to tinker with before the reach the Show.

 

Now, whether it be for Gray or some other youngish pitcher, I foresee Gordon, or perhaps even Polanco being a major component of any offer, especially given the redundancy of middle infield prospects in the system. I could also see someone like Palka's name being bandied about, but I would be surprised to see the top pitchers be dangled so early in Falvey/Levine's tenures.

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#3 Mike Sixel

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 01:25 PM

 

I think for a team that brought in a new FO with an emphasis on it's ability to develop pitching talent, moving two pitching prospects for one pitcher with an injury history doesn't seem like the appropriate type of gamble. I would say that the team would be loathe to give up any of their top end pitching talent, especially the younger guys that they have more time to tinker with before the reach the Show.

 

Now, whether it be for Gray or some other youngish pitcher, I foresee Gordon, or perhaps even Polanco being a major component of any offer, especially given the redundancy of middle infield prospects in the system. I could also see someone like Palka's name being bandied about, but I would be surprised to see the top pitchers be dangled so early in Falvey/Levine's tenures.

 

Why would it be better to give up your starting MIF (gordon or Polanco) for the next 5-8 years for a pitcher, than 2 pitching prospects?

 

Palka has no trade value, none.

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I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#4 yarnivek1972

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 02:11 PM

 

Why would it be better to give up your starting MIF (gordon or Polanco) for the next 5-8 years for a pitcher, than 2 pitching prospects?

 

Palka has no trade value, none.

It's something you might do if you had no plans to trade Dozier.


#5 Mike Sixel

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 02:14 PM

 

It's something you might do if you had no plans to trade Dozier.

 

Dozier is a FA in 1.5 years, and is approaching the wrong side of his aging curve, most probably. Are you going to re-sign him?

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#6 yarnivek1972

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 02:33 PM

 

Dozier is a FA in 1.5 years, and is approaching the wrong side of his aging curve, most probably. Are you going to re-sign him?

 

Didn't say that I personally would sign him.  Merely that trading Polanco or Gordon would be something you would do if your intention was to not trade (and perhaps resign) Dozier.  I'm kinda on the fence on it.  The Twins do not have ANY right handed power bats in their system anywhere close to ready (other than Sano of course).  Nick Gordon, LaMonte Wade even Palka.  All lefties.  Kepler and Rosario are lefties.  Castro is here for two more years, he also is a lefty.  Sure, there's Park.  But I did say "anywhere close to ready".  I have doubts that Park will ever be an impactful MLB player.  He turns 31 in a month - which makes him almost a full year older than Dozier - and has only 3 HR in 130 plus AB at AAA.

 

I'm certainly not going to dangle a 5 year deal to Dozier.  But extending him 2 or 3 years beyond what he is signed through now is something I might consider this offseason or maybe next year in ST, if the price is right.

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#7 jorgenswest

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 07:51 AM

I would think it would take two key top young players. Someone will offer a combination like...

Up the middle player in Gordon or Polanco.
Starting pitcher in Gonsalves or Romero.

Additionally, they might need to add a player or 2 in A ball to beat the other offers. Acquiring a mid rotation pitcher is going to hurt.
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#8 spycake

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 08:44 AM

Gray isn't a Free Agent until after the 2020 season


Gray is a FA after 2019, actually. B-Ref says 2020 because that will be his first FA season. So, 2.5 years of control for Gray.
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#9 howieramone2

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:03 AM

I would love it if they would take Romero and Jorge, but believe they will want Thorpe as one of the two. I consider Gonsalves and Stewart to be untouchable, but would listen to offers on our other top pitching prospects. 

Read my lips. Santana has shown absolutely no signs of decline.


#10 drock2190

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:06 AM

I'm guessing by the end of this series, we will be talking about who to SELL, not who to buy. 

 

This team isn't one pitcher away. It's a whole bullpen plus 1 good starter away.


#11 twinsfanstreif

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:11 AM

I would love it if they would take Romero and Jorge, but believe they will want Thorpe as one of the two. I consider Gonsalves and Stewart to be untouchable, but would listen to offers on our other top pitching prospects.


Why is Stewart untouchable? I hope you mean Gordon
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#12 howieramone2

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:19 AM

 

Why is Stewart untouchable? I hope you mean Gordon

Stewart has pitched all of 24 innings this year before being injured and I am more than aware that many successful pitchers are not strikeout pitchers.

 

Berrios is shining, Gonsalves is on deck, and Stewart is in the hole. 

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Read my lips. Santana has shown absolutely no signs of decline.


#13 Tibs

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:31 AM

I'm very interested in trying to get someone like Sonny Gray, but there is absolutely no way I include Nick Gordon in the deal. I would like to keep Gonsalves, and there is no way I send Gonsalves and Romero in a deal for Gray. I know you have to give up good prospects to get major leaguers, but Sonny Gray does not cost a king's ransom in prospects right now. He was pretty bad last year and he is giving up a lot of hits again this year. 

 

Does Oakland have a bad defense? Maybe Gray is just unlucky right now. Can you justify making a major deal based on luck?

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#14 kab21

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 09:54 AM

This is exactly the type of move the Twins should be making. It is very easy to see that the Twins biggest weakness this year and next year is pitching. All of Gray's advanced stats show him pitching at his best although his BAPIP, HR/FB% and ERA (all luck stats) have been poor. Check out his velocity, K:BB and swstr%.

 

Nick Gordon is a very good prospect but this wouldn't be a bad time to sell high on him if you can bring back an excellent pitcher. Don't let his .874 OPS fool you. He has a .395 BAPIP and a 22% K rate. I know that this criticism will immediately bring backlash. He is a very good prospect but he shouldn't be considered untouchable for a pitcher that would be a 2/3 (I think 2) for 2.5 years.

 

I don't want to trade Gordon but adding a pitcher like Gray completely changes my outlook for the team. People keep saying that this team isn't one player away but actually they are. A front end starter is that one player. They still need to find a few pieces in the bullpen but those aren't impossible to find (just look in the minors for example).

 

Gray

Santana

Berrios

 

this is a legit rotation

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Is 2016 2017 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? 

Looks like we will have to wait another year until a good pitching prospect is actually blocked.


#15 Andrew

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 10:29 AM

Any chance we can get Gray and Jesse Hahn? so our rotation actually would start to look legit and I'd have to believe one of Turley, Gibson, Santiago, Hughes, or even Heston can fill in the 5th spot. I know it would probably take Gonsalves and Romero +. I would offer those two plus Blankenhorn, Stewart, and maybe even Rosario (and put Grossman at full time RF. Not my favorite idea, but he hasn't been that bad in the field this year) My hope is that we don't have to give up Polanco or Gordon. I wouldn't be opposed to it, as I believe everyone is very much available (except Sano) and I feel we'd be better off-road wait and see if we trade Dozier or extend him. If they did then one of the two would be available

#16 USAFChief

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 11:10 AM

Stewart has pitched all of 24 innings this year before being injured and I am more than aware that many successful pitchers are not strikeout pitchers.
 
Berrios is shining, Gonsalves is on deck, and Stewart is in the hole.


If the Twins tried to use Stewart as a major piece of a Gray trade, the A's hang up the phone and don't take a return call.
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#17 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 11:15 AM

Gray is definitely the kind of player the Twins should be targeting but only if the price is reasonable. Gray looks like a better pitcher this season but wasn't very good last year. His peripherals are outperforming his ERA but I'm wary of any pitcher who calls the Coliseum home for half his games, particularly one who has never relied on swing and miss stuff to succeed.

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#18 kab21

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 11:21 AM

 

Gray is definitely the kind of player the Twins should be targeting but only if the price is reasonable. Gray looks like a better pitcher this season but wasn't very good last year. His peripherals are outperforming his ERA but I'm wary of any pitcher who calls the Coliseum home for half his games, particularly one who has never relied on swing and miss stuff to succeed.

People in this thread are hemming and hawing about Gonsalves, Romero and Gordon though. Gonsalves can only dream about being as good as Gray. Romero has stuff but probably ends up in the bullpen or injured. Gordon is legitimately good but still flawed. Trading from this pool to get a #2/3 (buy low) is a great value.

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Is 2016 2017 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? 

Looks like we will have to wait another year until a good pitching prospect is actually blocked.


#19 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 11:24 AM

 

People in this thread are hemming and hawing about Gonsalves, Romero and Gordon though. Gonsalves can only dream about being as good as Gray. Romero has stuff but probably ends up in the bullpen or injured. Gordon is legitimately good but still flawed. Trading from this pool to get a #2/3 (buy low) is a great value.

Absolutely. In no way do I mean to say Gray isn't a pretty good pitcher but he's a couple of years from his last #2 season. And his performance this season looks pretty good but he's still in SSS territory with an extreme home/road split.

 

Like you said, a great buy low candidate but we need to consider who Gray is going forward. I'm skeptical he's ever going to be the 2014-15 Gray again and that's okay. It means the Twins might be able to get him for a reasonable price but it's unlikely he's going to be a savior... just a decent/good pitcher, something the Twins are in dire need of right now.

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#20 DJSim22

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 11:35 AM

Usually I find the trade threads here to be more hilarious than anything, but I must say this one has me thinking.Gray is flawed, but a younger starter with a past record.I doubt the current FO makes this move in their first year, but I'd definitely look into it.If Romero and Gordon are not part of the deal, I think I'd be swayed towards making the deal.If you solidify the starting rotation, the bullpen becomes much easier to fix. 

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