Jump to content

Providing independent coverage of the Minnesota Twins.
Subscribe to Twins Daily Email
Photo

Buxton on MLB Network

  • Please log in to reply
114 replies to this topic

#41 Bark's Lounge

Bark's Lounge

    Too Weird to Live. Too Rare to Die.

  • Members
  • 4,418 posts
  • LocationKerguelen Island

Posted 13 April 2017 - 06:14 PM

Buxton's Doomsday Clock is no where near What the Human Race's is right now, but this thread is very concerning. It would be an awful blow to this organization if he does not pan out.

  • Jerr and BoofBonser like this

Major League Baseball is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side.


#42 Darius

Darius

    Chattanooga Lookouts

  • Members
  • 626 posts

Posted 13 April 2017 - 07:11 PM

Buxton is just pressing right now.

I don't think any of these things are a mystery to him, as far as his swing goes. But, when you've lost confidence and are trying to force things like he is, that all goes out the window in a live AB.

It's there. He'll settle in and get things figured out again. I still expect him to put together some decent numbers this year.

#43 Vanimal46

Vanimal46

    Minnesota Twins Whine Line Host

  • Members
  • 7,122 posts
  • LocationAustin, TX

Posted 13 April 2017 - 07:15 PM

I think Buxton needs to bunt more, not just because it could help him get on base, but more importantly because it could help him get more advantageous pitches, if people start throwing him more fastballs so they aren't burned by his bunting on breaking balls.


I disagree Buxton needs to bunt more. IIRC, Molitor said over the off-season they made a mistake in 2016 wanting him to hit the ball on the ground instead of driving it into the gap. I prefer for him not to rely on bunting. Instead, get good contact on the ball through routine and repetition...

#44 Dantes929

Dantes929

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,414 posts

Posted 13 April 2017 - 07:16 PM

 

from mlbtr.com today:

 

BYOP
2:26 How much longer are the Twins going to allow Buxton to suffer?

 

Jeffrey Todd
2:26 Like, half the season at least. Can't think he'll keep striking out half the time, though if that really does continue for a long time they'd probably have to drop him.
(To Triple-A.)

 

TwinsWin
2:49 Can't Buxton build his strike zone comfort by bunting 50% of the time? Even if the opponent knows what's coming, it's still a ball put in play and his speed to contend with...

 

Jeffrey Todd
2:50 Starting and completing a swing is quite a different thing than placing a bunt.

To me, its not about strike zone comfort as much as just not pressing.  I've always thought it was extremely important in 2010 that Valencia got a bunch of infield and seeing eye singles early on so he wouldn't have to worry so much about his batting average and could relax a little bit. I like the idea of giving him half a year to improve and someone should tell him that. Nothing makes you press more than thinking you need to get a hit or you will be benched.

Don't Sweat the Small Stuff ... and it's all small stuff.


#45 Blake

Blake

    Super Duper Senior Member

  • Members
  • 3,164 posts
  • LocationBakersfield CA

Posted 13 April 2017 - 07:23 PM

 

I love this analogy... As an average golfer, it's incredibly difficult to progress forward when you're continuously changing your grip, how far you take your backswing, where you line up the ball, etc... 

 

  • Willihammer likes this

#46 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 17,915 posts

Posted 13 April 2017 - 07:53 PM

 

I disagree Buxton needs to bunt more. IIRC, Molitor said over the off-season they made a mistake in 2016 wanting him to hit the ball on the ground instead of driving it into the gap. I prefer for him not to rely on bunting. Instead, get good contact on the ball through routine and repetition...

I really waver on Buxton bunting when pressed for how often he should do it. I don't have a good number for how often he should bunt. Basically, my opinion is "if the defense gives you a bunt hit, take it".

 

But that applies to almost any player, which is why it drives me nuts when lefty sluggers don't beat the shift by laying a bunt down the third base line. It only applies moreso to Buxton because he's so bloody fast. Whereas a guy like Ortiz needs a shift to hope to ever bunt successfully, Buxton merely needs the first baseman to step back three feet.

  • Steve Lein likes this

#47 Blake

Blake

    Super Duper Senior Member

  • Members
  • 3,164 posts
  • LocationBakersfield CA

Posted 13 April 2017 - 08:17 PM

 

from mlbtr.com today:

 

BYOP
2:26 How much longer are the Twins going to allow Buxton to suffer?

 

Jeffrey Todd
2:26 Like, half the season at least. Can't think he'll keep striking out half the time, though if that really does continue for a long time they'd probably have to drop him.
(To Triple-A.)

 

TwinsWin
2:49 Can't Buxton build his strike zone comfort by bunting 50% of the time? Even if the opponent knows what's coming, it's still a ball put in play and his speed to contend with...

 

Jeffrey Todd
2:50 Starting and completing a swing is quite a different thing than placing a bunt.

I think bunting would help if Buxton is having trouble with watching the ball all the way into the bat. It is very difficult to bunt successfully, I would think, without looking the ball into the bat. 

 

For what it's worth. Which, with inflation, isn't much. :)


#48 Old Twins Cap

Old Twins Cap

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 478 posts

Posted 13 April 2017 - 08:39 PM

With Buxton, it's severely painful to watch him swing and miss very hittable in-zone fastballs.

 

Most hitters, when they are not in sych, will at least foul those balls off.

 

So, something fundamental is wrong.Sure, the eyes and head aren't tracking, the lower half of the body is late, the upper half is not fluid.

 

What is that? 

 

If any of us knew, we would be millionaires.

 

It will make a very compelling case-history once Buxton emerges, and exactly what it was that held him back -- how he overcomes it.

 

It seems way more internal than just a head thing. 

 

If that makes sense.

Edited by Old Twins Cap, 13 April 2017 - 08:40 PM.


#49 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 17,915 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 07:08 AM

I'm going through yesterday's game again and watching Buxton's plate appearances more closely.

 

So far, I've only watched the third inning plate appearance, which he popped out in foul territory. He worked a 3-2 count and appeared to track every ball to the plate. None of his swings were painful to watch.


#50 diehardtwinsfan

diehardtwinsfan

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Mods
  • 10,433 posts
  • LocationThe charred ruins of BYTO

Posted 14 April 2017 - 07:31 AM

Honestly, if Buck's struggles stem from looking at the batting average and pressing, then bunt away... if anything, it will start drawing in the infield a bit more and give him a few more seeing eye grounds when he swings away.I have zero problems with that if his issues are confidence related.


#51 crapforks

crapforks

    Member

  • Members
  • 306 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 09:06 AM

 

Honestly, if Buck's struggles stem from looking at the batting average and pressing, then bunt away... if anything, it will start drawing in the infield a bit more and give him a few more seeing eye grounds when he swings away.I have zero problems with that if his issues are confidence related.

And a single that just barely bleeds through can turn into a double for him.

  • diehardtwinsfan likes this

#52 gunnarthor

gunnarthor

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 7,400 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 09:09 AM

Remember how often Kenny Lofton would bunt?  That's how often Buxton should.  


#53 mikelink45

mikelink45

    Junior Member

  • Members
  • 874 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 09:21 AM

This was an exceptional break down.  A very basic explanation that really makes sense.  Please Twins - invest in your most promising player.  Clear the table of advisers and get one person to work with him, a person Byron can trust and listen to who has a simple straight forward message.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=72jJIkczWlc

  • Mike Sixel likes this

#54 Mike Sixel

Mike Sixel

    Now living in Oregon

  • Members
  • 21,017 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 10:03 AM

yesterday:

 

Sean: First, thank you for all of the work. I can’t wait to read your book. Second, I am assuming you have seen Buxton this year. He looks awful at the plate. How do the Twins and Buxton fix this?

Keith Law: I said on BBTN that I think it’s become mental. He’s getting killed low and away, and I’m sure the Twins have told him to try to lay off those pitches, but apparently the fear of striking out has overtaken him. If he can’t make that adjustment in the majors, he’ll have to go back to triple-A to clear his head and work very specifically on that problem. A ton of his swings and misses were in that part of the zone, on all pitch types.5

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#55 ashburyjohn

ashburyjohn

    26th Man

  • Twins Mods
  • 14,501 posts
  • LocationNatick, MA

Posted 14 April 2017 - 11:05 AM

but apparently the fear of striking out has overtaken him.

220px-Fearstrikesout.jpg

  • Mike Sixel and HitInAPinch like this

Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?


#56 Bill

Bill

    Junior Member

  • Members
  • 37 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 12:05 PM

I have always thought Buxton's swing looked a little funny; kind of like was lunging at the ball with a very loopy swing.  I spent some time playing amateur batting coach trying to figure out what is going on.

 

A good site for looking at swings from the side is here: https://www.youtube....astimeAthletics

 

When you look at pretty much any of the swings from the side, you can really see what is going on with the "load": the hands move back (*away* from the pitcher) as the stride comes forward.

 

In old videos of Buxton, if you look here (around 2:12):

 

 

or here:

 

 

you see that Buxton hands actually move *forward* as he strides (or more accurately does that toe tap). 

 

Here is a newer video from 2016:  

 

 

He has a discernible load here, but he is still letting his hands get dragged forward and down by his body before he really starts his actual swing.  As his body weight is coming forward, his hands seem to be coming forward too soon.

 

Anybody know where there are more recent side videos of Buxton's swing available?

 

 

 

 

  • nicksaviking likes this

#57 Mike Sixel

Mike Sixel

    Now living in Oregon

  • Members
  • 21,017 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 12:30 PM

http://www.fangraphs...s/let-him-play/

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#58 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 17,915 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 12:43 PM

http://www.fangraphs...s/let-him-play/

I'm glad someone finally brought up Buxton's playing time. I was harping on that last season. I believe it has been a real impediment to him progressing as a hitter.

#59 Teflon

Teflon

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 467 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 01:14 PM

 

Buxton's Doomsday Clock is no where near What the Human Race's is right now, but this thread is very concerning. It would be an awful blow to this organization if he does not pan out.

 

Question - If Byron Buxton profiled to be a Paul Blair at this point -an elite defensive center fielder but subpar hitter - would that be enough for him to remain an everyday player?  


#60 Mike Sixel

Mike Sixel

    Now living in Oregon

  • Members
  • 21,017 posts

Posted 14 April 2017 - 01:18 PM

 

Question - If Byron Buxton profiled to be a Paul Blair at this point -an elite defensive center fielder but subpar hitter - would that be enough for him to remain an everyday player?  

 

how subpar?

 

 

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?