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Shohei Otani

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#41 drjim

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:23 PM

 

This is incorrect.They usually sign them (have been signing them) to minor league contracts, but there is not a place that says that you cannot sign him to a major league contact.

 

The new cba says teams cannot sign players under 25 to mlb contracts.

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#42 Steve Lein

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:25 PM

 

The new cba says teams cannot sign players under 25 to mlb contracts.

 

Does this then include extensions?

 

If it does, this will hurt a team with a young superstar more than it helps...

Scouting Report: Power: 30, Hitting: 50, Arm: 60, Defense: 45, Speed: 45. "Line drive swing and shows good contact and on-base abilities. Double's power at his peak. Strong arm from 2B or the OF, stiff hands. Not a fast runner, but above average instincts on the bases. Skinny body doesn't look the part, but will sneak up on you. ACL surgery sapped much of his athleticism." (Probably)


#43 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:30 PM

 

Does this then include extensions?

 

If it does, this will hurt a team with a young superstar more than it helps...

 

No, players can be extended. 

 

What it excludes is attempts to get around the IFA maximums. At least that is what every website says.

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I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#44 Willihammer

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:35 PM

How would a team go about promising an extension legally?

Would a promise to extend at more money later break the Joe Smith rule?

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Well, there's that.

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#45 Vanimal46

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:38 PM

 

How would a team go about promising an extension legally?

Would a promise to extend at more money later break the Joe Smith rule?

 

Certainly sounds like it. "Hey Shohei, sign this reasonable contract now.... and, wink wink, we'll tear it up 6 months from now and pay you $200 MM" 

There would be a big uproar from the league if that happened. 


#46 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:40 PM

 

How would a team go about promising an extension legally?

Would a promise to extend at more money later break the Joe Smith rule?

 

The commissioner has been quoted as saying he will be unhappy if that happens, or something like that.....I'm guessing they'd come down hard. Or not, it is baseball. 

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#47 drjim

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:47 PM

Hard to believe putting arbitrary caps would lead to problems.

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#48 Willihammer

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 02:49 PM

Or maybe,

"checkout this 7 bedroom house on Lake Minnetonka- the team's willing to let you stay here on a 2 year lease for $100/month. The 6 car garage has a Ducati and a Hummer and jet skis. There's a $100,000 gift card to Fuji-ya sushi in the kitchen somewhere. Oh and I think the red phone over there is a direct line to the team's 24/7 on call 'masseuse.'"

 

Whatever the NY/BOS/LAD equivalent of that is.

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Well, there's that.

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#49 Steve Lein

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 03:20 PM

 

No, players can be extended. 

 

What it excludes is attempts to get around the IFA maximums. At least that is what every website says.

 

I've read in a few articles that exceptions are capable of being made in a player like Ohani's case. Even that it might be likely because the rule isn't intended to stop what he is, a player universally touted as an MLB-caliber, and quite possibly one of the world's best right now.

 

From what I can tell it's intended to stop big-spending teams from securing a young prospect's rights by offering them what other teams around the league can't (more money).

 

Yoan Moncada, as an example, still spent 2 years in the minors before making his debut. So he was not deemed MLB ready when signed, and none of the 16-year-old Latin players that are signed would be either.

 

These are the types of signings they are trying to curb with the rule, not someone like Ohani.

Scouting Report: Power: 30, Hitting: 50, Arm: 60, Defense: 45, Speed: 45. "Line drive swing and shows good contact and on-base abilities. Double's power at his peak. Strong arm from 2B or the OF, stiff hands. Not a fast runner, but above average instincts on the bases. Skinny body doesn't look the part, but will sneak up on you. ACL surgery sapped much of his athleticism." (Probably)


#50 Mike Sixel

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 03:23 PM

 

I've read in a few articles that exceptions are capable of being made in a player like Ohani's case. Even that it might be likely because the rule isn't intended to stop what he is, a player universally touted as an MLB-caliber, and quite possibly one of the world's best right now.

 

From what I can tell it's intended to stop big-spending teams from securing a young prospect's rights by offering them what other teams around the league can't (more money).

 

Yoan Moncada, as an example, still spent 2 years in the minors before making his debut. So he was not deemed MLB ready when signed, and none of the 16-year-old Latin players that are signed would be either.

 

These are the types of signings they are trying to curb with the rule, not someone like Ohani.

 

They've been clearly quoted as saying "no otani exceptions"...

 

Not sure it matters, he certainly won't be coming here.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#51 Thrylos

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 03:45 PM

 

The new cba says teams cannot sign players under 25 to mlb contracts.

 

Look at the Twins roster and tell me how many players under 25 are signed to mlb contracts...You play in the MLB, you have an mlb contract.

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#52 drjim

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 04:01 PM

Look at the Twins roster and tell me how many players under 25 are signed to mlb contracts... You play in the MLB, you have an mlb contract.


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#53 Bark's Lounge

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 04:44 PM

I think the best thing for Otani is to stay in Japan until he is 25. It's all too complicated if he tries to force his teams hand in the next offseason. He won't be circumventing any MLB rules.

 

Plus, this way he can prove himself more at the plate. I believe what I hear about his talent as a batter, but he has had one season with 300PA's (a very great season) and he is off to a tremendous start this year.

 

I am sure MLB teams fawn over him as a pitcher way, way more than they do as a hitter. If he waits, I think he will have a much better chance to live out his dream as a starting pitcher and hitter. As a pitcher he is MLB ready and would be an impact player on any team right away.

 

If his arm holds up, this young fella is going to be swimming in a sea of U.S. Dollar bills.

Major League Baseball is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side.


#54 drjim

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 05:30 PM

He's signing as a pitcher.
Papers...business papers.

#55 Bark's Lounge

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 05:36 PM

 

He's signing as a pitcher.

I agree. If some team let's him bat he will never be anything other than a PH or DH. It will be too big of an investment to ever take the risk of having him throw a baseball other than pitching.

Major League Baseball is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side.


#56 Steve Lein

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 05:38 PM

 

They've been clearly quoted as saying "no otani exceptions"...

 

Not sure it matters, he certainly won't be coming here.

 

This is one instance I read, doesn't sound likely but also isn't "no otani exceptions": http://www.bleachern...-otani-problem/

 

I don't think he would, either. But that's why this is in the "other baseball" forum :)

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Scouting Report: Power: 30, Hitting: 50, Arm: 60, Defense: 45, Speed: 45. "Line drive swing and shows good contact and on-base abilities. Double's power at his peak. Strong arm from 2B or the OF, stiff hands. Not a fast runner, but above average instincts on the bases. Skinny body doesn't look the part, but will sneak up on you. ACL surgery sapped much of his athleticism." (Probably)


#57 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 06:53 PM

 

 

 

These are the types of signings they are trying to curb with the rule, not someone like Ohani.

 

Honestly, I'm not so sure.The problem with a signing like Otani is a competitive balance issue, which is something that all MLB has to deal with.Yes, it's a convenient way of saving the owners millions, but it is a real problem where teams like NY, LA, and CHI can simply print money and get that potential superstar at the expense of teams like KC and Pit. 

 

I'm not arguing that the rule doesn't suck for Otani, but I do think it's there for more than just saving the owners a few dollars.


#58 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 06:56 PM

 

This is one instance I read, doesn't sound likely but also isn't "no otani exceptions": http://www.bleachern...-otani-problem/

 

I don't think he would, either. But that's why this is in the "other baseball" forum :)

 

The work around is likely a lawsuit over anti-trust violations... that would be my guess.He could sue MLB... no idea on the legality of it and whether or not it would work, but if I was his agent, I'd be exploring that thoroughly. 


#59 Pardon My Dinger

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 07:22 PM

Man, I just watched three minutes of his 2016 highlight reel on YouTube, before it got so silly, I just had to stop.

This kid's stuff is ridiculous. That forkball? It looks like a fastball out of the hand. Thirty feet later, it's on the ground and the batter's shoes and helmet have fallen off.

It would be beyond interesting to see him on an AL team, pitching and DH-ing. Not sure how likely it is he'll be given a ton of at bats, though.

Every team in baseball will place a bid. If your team doesn't try to get him, your team is dumb. If your team signs him, your team is probably the New York Yankees.
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#60 Pardon My Dinger

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 07:27 PM

I know the chances are slim, but good god almighty, I hope Falvine takes a big swing on this. Shohei would be exactly what we need to turn the corner. Once in a lifetime opportunity, really.

I do not think this kid will be a bust. Watch some video. That s--word is filthy stanky sexy cool.

Edited by Pardon My Dinger, 11 April 2017 - 07:28 PM.

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