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2016-2017 Vikings Offseason Thread

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#41 Mike Sixel

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 09:31 AM

 

I'm all for drafting a RB, but I don't like to do that early. Seems to me that is the position where success is most independent of where a guy is drafted. Unless you're talking about one of the clearly elite guys who tend to go top 5 or so.

 

Also, assuming Bridgewater isn't ready next year; if the Vikings aren't comfortable with Taylor Heinike as Bradford's backup and feel the need to sign another vet, I'd rather they just cut Heinike and find another young QB. I'd really like this team to try to keep trying to find a project QB that could potentially steal the starting gig or be flipped someday. Even if it only rarely works out I think it's worth the effort. If it's clear Heinike isn't capable next year, he's probably never going to be, try again.

 

Agreed on all points, and a decent RB can have success behind a decent OL also....fix the OL.

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One of the best opening day rosters in years. Now go get 'em.


#42 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 10:54 AM

I think if you can find a multi-dimensional back (good in the passing and running game) you pounce on that guy.  I just think the drop off in talent from a 2nd round RB to a 3rd/4th is more dramatic than the drop off in 2nd round and later offensive linemen.


#43 Mike Sixel

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 11:13 AM

 

I think if you can find a multi-dimensional back (good in the passing and running game) you pounce on that guy.  I just think the drop off in talent from a 2nd round RB to a 3rd/4th is more dramatic than the drop off in 2nd round and later offensive linemen.

 

But the OL is, imo, a bigger hole. It has to be filled for this team to be better, but if they go into next year with McKinnon and random FA back, with a much better OL, they can still win, imo. 

One of the best opening day rosters in years. Now go get 'em.


#44 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 11:21 AM

 

But the OL is, imo, a bigger hole. It has to be filled for this team to be better, but if they go into next year with McKinnon and random FA back, with a much better OL, they can still win, imo. 

 

I don't disagree, I just see this more as 2nd Round OL > 3rd Round OL  compared to 2nd Round RB >>>>> 3rd Round RB.

 

Depending upon the RB of course.  

 

Also, given that the team defensively is built to win now, IMO the best course of action for the team is to pursue veteran offensive lineman for immediate needs.  I'd use both 3rd round picks on depth/future players.  It's why I'd go with something like Kalil-Boone-Berger-Zeitler-Reiff.  Or some combination of Zeitler/Reiff/Harris on the right side.  (Harris also seems to be back in the loop now after the story I read yesterday)

 

Young OL are going to struggle out of the gate most of the time, I'd rather invest some of the sizable cap room we'll have to just fix that unit with established players and draft for depth/future.


#45 Mike Sixel

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 11:32 AM

 

I don't disagree, I just see this more as 2nd Round OL > 3rd Round OL  compared to 2nd Round RB >>>>> 3rd Round RB.

 

Depending upon the RB of course.  

 

Also, given that the team defensively is built to win now, IMO the best course of action for the team is to pursue veteran offensive lineman for immediate needs.  I'd use both 3rd round picks on depth/future players.  It's why I'd go with something like Kalil-Boone-Berger-Zeitler-Reiff.  Or some combination of Zeitler/Reiff/Harris on the right side.  (Harris also seems to be back in the loop now after the story I read yesterday)

 

Young OL are going to struggle out of the gate most of the time, I'd rather invest some of the sizable cap room we'll have to just fix that unit with established players and draft for depth/future.

 

If they sign two legit starters in FA, sure, I could maybe get behind that. I'd argue LB and maybe DT are bigger needs than RB, though. I think we largely agree on this path to success....

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One of the best opening day rosters in years. Now go get 'em.


#46 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:40 PM

I just think so little of Asiata and McKinnon that I think it makes RB a priority.  (If the right kind of RB is there that is)

 

And I'd rather draft a back and invest money in the line than the reverse.

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#47 nicksaviking

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:41 PM

 

I don't disagree, I just see this more as 2nd Round OL > 3rd Round OL  compared to 2nd Round RB >>>>> 3rd Round RB.

 

Depending upon the RB of course.  

 

 

Are you referencing Le'Veon Bell specifally or is there other precedence you have in mind? Because looking back through the past drafts, it looks like you can get a good RB in rounds 3-5 just as easily as round 2.

 

It seems to me that lately, unless there is a true clear stud, RBs tend to get taken at least a round later than most people expected. Most tend to drop even further. I wouldn't want the Vikings being the only team reaching for a RB, particularly when they don't have a 1st round pick and lots of holes.

 

Also, I want this team to transition away from being a run heavy team.

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#48 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:48 PM

 

Are you referencing Le'Veon Bell specifally or is there other precedence you have in mind? Because looking back through the past drafts, it looks like you can get a good RB in rounds 3-5 just as easily as round 2.

 

It seems to me that lately, unless there is a true clear stud, RBs tend to get taken at least a round later than most people expected. Most tend to drop even further. I wouldn't want the Vikings being the only team reaching for a RB, particularly when they don't have a 1st round pick and lots of holes.

 

Also, I want this team to transition away from being a run heavy team.

 

It's more projecting of the guy I like best other than the elite backs.  Kamara has a receiving skill set that may be the best out of all the backs in the draft.  

 

I agree that you can find good backs later, but if the right kind of back is there at 2 I'd pick them.  You can plug and play a RB day one.  I'm not sure you can plug and play a 2nd or 3rd round OL as easily.  To be clear, I'm not going to force that pick to be a back, but if a great one is there i'm pulling the trigger.  In my book, the need is that high.

Edited by TheLeviathan, 04 January 2017 - 12:49 PM.


#49 nicksaviking

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 01:26 PM

I guess if Kamara is the guy you like, I'd be looking at it that he's likely to go at least round later than expected, most RB tend to. Just looking for more info on this guy, I don't see him in any mocks in round 2. CBS Sports has him projected as a 5th round back.

 

 Outside of the 1st round I don't like to focus on 1 player either.


#50 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 01:41 PM

I forsee Kamara being a possible late first rounder, which is why I take him with the second round pick.  

 

I'm projecting a bit, if I'm wrong and he's a later pick so be it, but I don't think that's going to happen once the league gets their hands on him at the combine.


#51 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 01:52 PM

Watch some film of the kid. (He's number 6)  Excellent in pass protection.  Great in the open field.  Excellent hands.  Freaky agility to make people miss with moves so subtle they are hard to spot.  Surprising power.  This kid is going to be good.

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#52 Vanimal46

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 01:59 PM

 

I just think so little of Asiata and McKinnon that I think it makes RB a priority.  (If the right kind of RB is there that is)

 

And I'd rather draft a back and invest money in the line than the reverse.

Agreed. Asiata should be cut and McKinnon should get no more than 15 touches a game. Nothing would make me happier than never seeing an Asiata stuffing on 3rd and 1 again. 

RB is high on my priority list as well.. Without AP, they'll need a new feature back to handle 25+ touches a game. 

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#53 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 04:54 PM

It's not so much the crunch part, it's that why are you keeping Treadwell at all if he's not going to see the field? I guess you could draft a project WR late but I wouldn't put much of a need there. Thielen, Diggs, Patterson, Treadwell, Johnson/Wright is a pretty decent group. Anyone you pick up is going to have to slot at the bottom of that group, even if you don't retain Patterson.


In the modern NFL, a 3rd WR is essentially a starter.
If we can get Patterson back it's fine, but if not then I don't want any of those other options getting anything close to starting snaps.
If we lose Patterson, then adding a third WR is a pretty big need, imo.

#54 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 05:22 PM

 

In the modern NFL, a 3rd WR is essentially a starter.
If we can get Patterson back it's fine, but if not then I don't want any of those other options getting anything close to starting snaps.
If we lose Patterson, then adding a third WR is a pretty big need, imo.

 

Sure, but I think Patterson makes more sense to retain.  He's an excellent special teams player with upside as a WR.  Having him and Treadwell as your top 4 is solid.

 

I'd rather use what resources we have to address other positions.


#55 Vanimal46

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 05:43 PM

Watch some film of the kid. (He's number 6)  Excellent in pass protection.  Great in the open field.  Excellent hands.  Freaky agility to make people miss with moves so subtle they are hard to spot.  Surprising power.  This kid is going to be good.


Thanks for sharing the video. I like what I see so far. Guy who can run in between the tackles, take it outside, and catch the ball. Also, someone who can take handoffs from the shotgun formation?! That's a completely foreign concept to AP....

#56 TheLeviathan

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 05:50 PM

 

Thanks for sharing the video. I like what I see so far. Guy who can run in between the tackles, take it outside, and catch the ball. Also, someone who can take handoffs from the shotgun formation?! That's a completely foreign concept to AP....

 

There are other guys to like, but I think he's going to be a 2/3 round pick and he looks to me like a more powerful Jamal Charles.  This is the multi-dimensional skill set you want to have in a back.


#57 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 05 January 2017 - 12:33 AM

Sure, but I think Patterson makes more sense to retain. He's an excellent special teams player with upside as a WR. Having him and Treadwell as your top 4 is solid.

I'd rather use what resources we have to address other positions.


I'd love to have Patterson back. But, it only takes 1 team to think they can fix his flaws and offer him a ridiculous Tayvon Austin like contract.
When I make statements regarding adding another WR, it's under the assumption that Patterson leaves.
If he comes back then disregard it.

#58 Vanimal46

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Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:31 PM

There's a good article on The Ringer that found a trend that NFL playoff teams look for when they draft prospects. "The Draft Trend Uniting This Season's Playoff Field"

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#59 snepp

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 05:11 PM

I hate the Packers.

 

 

Carry on.

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#60 Mike Sixel

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 07:51 AM

I don't think 1 game went my way this weekend.....I was trying to decide who, among the remaining teams, was least offensive. Having friends all over the country means most teams have fans I don't want bragging.....

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One of the best opening day rosters in years. Now go get 'em.