Jump to content

Providing independent coverage of the Minnesota Twins.

Subscribe to Twins Daily Email

Photo

Jose Christensen: Wimmers May Need Tommy John Surgery

  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

#1 East Coast Twin

East Coast Twin

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 155 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:46 AM

http://www.startribu.../164526046.html

Also, an interesting quote from Terry Ryan in the Pioneer Press:

"I don't quite get it," Ryan said. "I'd like to think we can diagnose and make sure we know what's going to go on, but we're not going to let him go any farther until we figure this out."
In the first season of his return as the Twins' GM, Ryan was planning to evaluate the team's medical operation after a 2011 season marred by injuries to key players like Joe Mauer and Justin Morneau. That evaluation is still ongoing, Ryan said, as is the team's new practice of making Ryan or assistant GM Rob Antony the sole point of contact for reporters on injury updates, though Ryan said he thinks that process has worked well.

http://www.twincitie...immers-injury-i

Edited by East Coast Twin, 01 August 2012 - 03:42 PM.


#2 sorney

sorney

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 215 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:19 AM

Completely and utterly shocked!!! Who would have guessed he would need surgery after trying to pitch through a partially torn UCL. <insert heavy heavy doses of sarcasm>

#3 gil4

gil4

    Cavalierly throwing hyperbole since 2012

  • Members
  • 1,128 posts
  • LocationOklahoma

Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:31 AM

I know the bloggers and on-line commenters aren't close to the situation and don't have all of the data. That's why it's frustrating that the bloggers get right and the team medical staff and management get it wrong so often.

#4 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 06:42 AM

"I don't quite get it," Ryan said. "I'd like to think we can diagnose and make sure we know what's going to go on, but we're not going to let him go any farther until we figure this out."


I think that's as close as JR gets to saying "some asses are going to get fired over this". While many on this board advocate wholesale firing of everything and everyone, that's just not how these things work and shows just how little understanding the average forum poster has for how a business operates. It takes time to evaluate where the problem is and how to fix it. If you fire everybody, you're just as likely to continue repeating the same mistakes with the next batch of hires (plus, it's bloody hard to find people who don't suck at their jobs).

Hopefully this is the straw that pushes the front office to the breaking point and allows them to fix the medical staff problems.

#5 diehardtwinsfan

diehardtwinsfan

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Mods
  • 8,707 posts
  • LocationThe charred ruins of BYTO

Posted 01 August 2012 - 07:23 AM

the other problem with firing people is that encourages people to simply lie and cover things up. I've seen that happen first hand in the medical profession, which can lead to other really big problems down the road... No doubt in my mind that the medical staff needs some accountability, but simply firing everyone without giving people a chance to improve is equally stupid... that said, I think that the axe is coming.

#6 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 07:28 AM

the other problem with firing people is that encourages people to simply lie and cover things up. I've seen that happen first hand in the medical profession, which can lead to other really big problems down the road...


It's not unique to the medical profession. I remember the first time a subordinate lied to me about a problem and covered it up because she thought she'd be fired... I was like "WHAT THE HELL, you wouldn't get fired for that!" but by the time we caught the server issue she covered up, the entire thing was coming unraveled at the seams and I was almost fired for it.

Creating a fear-based environment and expecting results never works. God knows I am speaking from experience... I've had plenty of bosses who thought that was the way to do things and they never got anything close to my best performance because of it.

#7 Thrylos

Thrylos

    Total System Failure

  • Members
  • 6,920 posts
  • LocationLehigh Valley, PA, USA
  • Twitter: thrylos98

Posted 01 August 2012 - 08:02 AM


Also, an interesting quote from Terry Ryan in the Pioneer Press:

"I don't quite get it," Ryan said. "I'd like to think we can diagnose and make sure we know what's going to go on, but we're not going to let him go any farther until we figure this out."
In the first season of his return as the Twins' GM, Ryan was planning to evaluate the team's medical operation after a 2011 season marred by injuries to key players like Joe Mauer and Justin Morneau. That evaluation is still ongoing, Ryan said, as is the team's new practice of making Ryan or assistant GM Rob Antony the sole point of contact for reporters on injury updates, though Ryan said he thinks that process has worked well.


So Ryan tried to fix (and he thinks he fixed) the communication process, instead of the medical/training situation in the organization.

Great. Lets not focus on how to avoid or reduce the likelihood of a disaster, lest focus on an Emergency Response Plan...
-----
Blogging Twins since 2007 at The Tenth Inning Stretch
http://tenthinningst...h.blogspot.com/
twitter: @thrylos98

#8 Badsmerf

Badsmerf

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 2,342 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 08:36 AM

Come on Twins. Its not even funny to joke about anymore. This has to be fixed. Please send Alex to someone that can help him.

#9 diehardtwinsfan

diehardtwinsfan

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Mods
  • 8,707 posts
  • LocationThe charred ruins of BYTO

Posted 01 August 2012 - 12:12 PM

It's not unique to the medical profession. I remember the first time a subordinate lied to me about a problem and covered it up because she thought she'd be fired... I was like "WHAT THE HELL, you wouldn't get fired for that!" but by the time we caught the server issue she covered up, the entire thing was coming unraveled at the seams and I was almost fired for it.

Creating a fear-based environment and expecting results never works. God knows I am speaking from experience... I've had plenty of bosses who thought that was the way to do things and they never got anything close to my best performance because of it.


I've seen that first hand as well.... There's no shame in being cautious about it. That said, I think we are getting very close to a point where someone should lose a job... I'd probably start with the guy in charge of the staff.

#10 greengoblinrulz

greengoblinrulz

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,759 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 12:30 PM

again, name me ONE legit pitcher who successfully pitched with the partially torn UCL after rehab & didnt need surgery. Aroldys Vizcaino of ATL was the one mentioned last yr as possibly showing teams how to rehab the UCL as he didnt need surgery. Come 2012 & he did, tear it, missing the whole yr.

#11 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 01:31 PM

I've seen that first hand as well.... There's no shame in being cautious about it. That said, I think we are getting very close to a point where someone should lose a job... I'd probably start with the guy in charge of the staff.


Yep. People wanted JR to act immediately but that wouldn't have been prudent or smart. He's only been back in the GM position for ~9 months and it takes time to evaluate this sort of thing.

Now that he's approaching the one year mark, it's time to take action and fix the problem.

#12 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 10,891 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 02:15 PM

Yep. People wanted JR to act immediately but that wouldn't have been prudent or smart. He's only been back in the GM position for ~9 months and it takes time to evaluate this sort of thing.

Now that he's approaching the one year mark, it's time to take action and fix the problem.


Why wasn't it time to take action during the Scott Baker debacle?

#13 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 03:56 PM

Why wasn't it time to take action during the Scott Baker debacle?


How many doctors outside the organization examined Baker? I doubt JR ignored the situation but it's hard to pin that one on the medical staff.

#14 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 10,891 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:00 PM

How many doctors outside the organization examined Baker? I doubt JR ignored the situation but it's hard to pin that one on the medical staff.


I'm talking about the (mis)-timing of the latest quote from TR. The Baker event was when that bell should have been rung. And the Twins management had made the situation worse by letting it be known that they considered that Baker was "soft".

#15 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:04 PM

I'm talking about the (mis)-timing of the latest quote from TR. The Baker event was when that bell should have been rung. And the Twins management had made the situation worse by letting it be known that they considered that Baker was "soft".


Let's stop blurring the issues. The "soft" comments were ridiculous and completely unwarranted but really have nothing to do with the topic at hand.

The medical staff, by all accounts, did their job with Baker, didn't they? Everybody was mis-diagnosing Scott. It's an unfortunate situation but from what I've read, there is little medical blame to be thrown around in that situation.

But let me be clear. I've wanted to see change in the Twins medical staff for a long time. All I'm arguing is that it's not wrong for JR to take some time to decide how to make the proper changes. If by next Opening Day we see the same schleps running the team's medical program while crap like this continues to happen, then I will be the first guy in line with a "FIRE EVERYBODY" sign.

#16 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 10,891 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:09 PM

Let's stop blurring the issues. The "soft" comments were ridiculous and completely unwarranted but really have nothing to do with the topic at hand.


I agree with everything up to the last phrase. The situation regarding personnel with the medical/training staff and the FO go "hand-in-hand" and demonstrate yet another blind eye to the developmental situation of a key prospect.

#17 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 10,891 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:14 PM


But let me be clear. I've wanted to see change in the Twins medical staff for a long time. All I'm arguing is that it's not wrong for JR to take some time to decide how to make the proper changes. If by next Opening Day we see the same schleps running the team's medical program while crap like this continues to happen, then I will be the first guy in line with a "FIRE EVERYBODY" sign.


I again, mostly agree with what you say and I'm not advocating the "Fire Everybody" solution. It's just that the clock has been ticking since last October, Ryan had an admittedly monumental job in front of him, given the state of the club; perhaps he could have brought in more outside consultancy help to more immediately address the broad range of issues facing the club. Clearly, in his initial press conference, he identified the injury problem and training/rehab techniques as representing a huge failure to the 2011 Twins. Thus far in 9 months, little seems to have changed.

#18 Brock Beauchamp

Brock Beauchamp

    Owner

  • Administrators
  • 15,406 posts

Posted 01 August 2012 - 04:21 PM

I again, mostly agree with what you say and I'm not advocating the "Fire Everybody" solution. It's just that the clock has been ticking since last October, Ryan had an admittedly monumental job in front of him, given the state of the club; perhaps he could have brought in more outside consultancy help to more immediately address the broad range of issues facing the club. Clearly, in his initial press conference, he identified the injury problem and training/rehab techniques as representing a huge failure to the 2011 Twins. Thus far in 9 months, little seems to have changed.


I agree that it would have been nice to see more movement on this front already but I don't know what's going on behind the scenes. Generally, I try to give people time to sort out mistakes and make the right moves and those moves aren't going to happen overnight. But, again, JR hasn't been back at the helm for all that long. I'll give him a little more time before condemning the entire front office as inept.