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Liriano .... 4 more starts???

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#1 greengoblinrulz

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:27 PM

8 relatively solid starts now for Frankie since being reinstated. 49.2 IP 30h 15er 2.72ERA 52k 24bb.....99.25pitches per start He can only screw up a deal 4 more times..... If he woulda started the season like this, would he have gotten an extension???

#2 Mchans24

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 10:13 PM

Without a doubt. Problem is, we all expect him to melt down again at some point. They are trying to trade him, Gardy doing nothing but praising him on a night he walked six guys!!

#3 minn55441

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 10:37 PM

Will it be a package deal? The team that Takes Liriano also has to take Drew? they are a pitching team now.

#4 greengoblinrulz

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 11:00 PM

Will it be a package deal? The team that Takes Liriano also has to take Drew? they are a pitching team now.

without Frankie, Butera is again a AAA player.....but who will Gardy appoint to Drew to be his defensive savior after the deal??? My guess for personal catcher will be Blackburn

#5 jokin

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 11:22 PM

without Frankie, Butera is again a AAA player.....but who will Gardy appoint to Drew to be his defensive savior after the deal??? My guess for personal catcher will be Blackburn


Great! Can we send him down to Roc to join Blackie tomorrow?

#6 spideyo

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 10:32 AM

Hey, if Butera could get Blackburn to pitch like a Major League starter on a consistent basis, I'll take that! On another Liriano note, anybody else read MLB.com's recap of the game? "It's certainly not a stretch to say Francisco Liriano has been one of the best pitchers in baseball since rejoining the Twins' rotation on May 30 after a stint in the bullpen." It goes on to say that he has been dominating, and pitching like an ace. I'll give you that he's pitching much better, but one of the best pitchers in baseball? I don't think so. I would expect one of the best pitchers in baseball to make it through the 7th inning more than once in 8 games. Also, when I think "best pitcher in baseball" I think of guys who keep the bases clear, not guys who are really good at keeping the two guys they walked back to back from scoring. But hey, if the excessive praise jacks up his trade value, then I suppose let's just keep piling it on.

#7 Boom Boom

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 10:43 AM

I was ready to give up on Liriano and trade him for anything... but given the dearth of pitching in the Twins org., I'd seriously consider offering Liriano a 2 year + option deal right now while the price may be cheaper. If he continues pitching well, it's a great move. And if he does the Jekyll and Hyde routine again, you can try trading him later.

#8 Thrylos

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 10:45 AM

Hey, if Butera could get Blackburn to pitch like a Major League starter on a consistent basis, I'll take that!

On another Liriano note, anybody else read MLB.com's recap of the game? "It's certainly not a stretch to say Francisco Liriano has been one of the best pitchers in baseball since rejoining the Twins' rotation on May 30 after a stint in the bullpen." It goes on to say that he has been dominating, and pitching like an ace.

I'll give you that he's pitching much better, but one of the best pitchers in baseball? I don't think so. I would expect one of the best pitchers in baseball to make it through the 7th inning more than once in 8 games. Also, when I think "best pitcher in baseball" I think of guys who keep the bases clear, not guys who are really good at keeping the two guys they walked back to back from scoring.

But hey, if the excessive praise jacks up his trade value, then I suppose let's just keep piling it on.



Do not confuse Liriano's results (1.179 WHIP, .178 OBA, 3.38 ERA, 8.4 K/9 his last 6 starts) with when GardynAndy decide to take him out of the game. Manager's choice. Yes he has been pitching like an ace., but Gardy has been taking him out of the game.
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#9 CTS

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 12:15 PM

Can anyone explain why this page: http://espn.go.com/m...minnesota-twins shows Liriano as the team leader in ERA? Surely Diamond has enough innings to qualify?

#10 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 12:28 PM

Can anyone explain why this page: http://espn.go.com/m...minnesota-twins shows Liriano as the team leader in ERA? Surely Diamond has enough innings to qualify?


No, he doesn't. To qualify you have to have one inning pitched per game the team as played. That means right now you need 83 innings. Liriano is the only one on staff who has that (83.1). Diamond has only 79. He'll probably qualify, though, after his next start.

#11 ancestral

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 12:32 PM

Teams would want Liriano not as a starter (this year) but as a middle-relief/situational pitcher. The fact that he is left-handed is perhaps the biggest reason to trade for him. Not sure where he ranks in the league this year, but lefties are batting .154 against Liriano.

#12 Guest_USAFChief_*

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 12:51 PM

Teams would want Liriano not as a starter (this year) but as a middle-relief/situational pitcher. The fact that he is left-handed is perhaps the biggest reason to trade for him. Not sure where he ranks in the league this year, but lefties are batting .154 against Liriano.


Huh?

Get the extension done, TR. Get the extension done.

#13 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 02:21 PM

Apparently ERAs near 5 constitute ace material. Liriano has a strange power to inspire delusion.

#14 Guest_USAFChief_*

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 02:27 PM

Apparently ERAs near 5 constitute ace material. Liriano has a strange power to inspire delusion.


A year from now you (and a lot of folks) will be bemoaning the Twins lack of front line starting pitching, while simultaneously shaking your head in wonderment at how good Liriano has been for the (insert team name here).

Much like you've had to back off from your "there is no reason to let Plouffe play, ever, anywhere, he can't hit or field" take from a couple months ago.

#15 greengoblinrulz

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 06:15 PM

A year from now you (and a lot of folks) will be bemoaning the Twins lack of front line starting pitching, while simultaneously shaking your head in wonderment at how good Liriano has been for the (insert team name here).

Much like you've had to back off from your "there is no reason to let Plouffe play, ever, anywhere, he can't hit or field" take from a couple months ago.


there were just enough of us yelling for Plouffe to get everyday ABs to show what he can do.
There is NO way I give Liriano even a 1yr extension right now....trade him. HOWEVER, after trading him....nothing wrong with looking at him in FA if the money is right.

#16 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 06:34 PM

A year from now you (and a lot of folks) will be bemoaning the Twins lack of front line starting pitching, while simultaneously shaking your head in wonderment at how good Liriano has been for the (insert team name here).

Much like you've had to back off from your "there is no reason to let Plouffe play, ever, anywhere, he can't hit or field" take from a couple months ago.


Are you unable to constitute a fair argument ever? I didn't want him getting regular ABs at second and still don't. Never had an issue with third.

I won't ever go back and question letting Liriano go. He's garbage. By the way ~ five ERA is frontline material eh? One of the ten worst starters in all of baseball by virtually every stat for two of the last three years is "frontline"?

My god. With the ability to delude people about crappy performance Frankie missed his calling as an infomercial pitchman.

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 07:20 PM

Are you unable to constitute a fair argument ever? I didn't want him getting regular ABs at second and still don't. Never had an issue with third.

I won't ever go back and question letting Liriano go. He's garbage. By the way ~ five ERA is frontline material eh? One of the ten worst starters in all of baseball by virtually every stat for two of the last three years is "frontline"?

My god. With the ability to delude people about crappy performance Frankie missed his calling as an infomercial pitchman.


1. Fair Argument? Perhaps I'm mistaken...are you a different Leviathan? Not the one that spent a month ridiculing anyone on BYTO who suggested Plouffe should be given a full time shot, somewhere?

You're embarrassing yourself to anyone who knows the backstory.

2. If you think Liriano is always going to be a "five ERA pitcher" or is even right now a "five ERA pitcher" then you're right. I don't. I think gambling on him is a better bet than anything they're likely to get for similar money.

We'll see. I'll be here to admit I was wrong, if I indeed was wrong. Somehow I doubt you'll reciprocate.

#18 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 07:34 PM

Backstory is easy: you wanted him at second base because you didn't think he could hit enough for RF. I wanted nothingnothing to do with that. I still wouldn't. But he has been an offensive marvel. I hope it continues and I'm glad a spot that made sense for him opened up so we could see this. Never once did I have an issue with him playing third just had low expectations. So far my expectations were wrong. Hope it stays that way just like Perkins, Span, and others. That's the true, fair version. Not your warped nonsense. But its cute that less that 10 starts are enough to justify 20 million. Certainly these last ten tell us way more than last year, the start of this year, and all of 2009. Frontline indeed.

#19 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 07:59 PM

Is there a chance we could let Liriano go and, next year, when he has his head together, makes us look foolish? Yes - that is a real risk. There is also a real risk that, if we give him an extension, he ends up going back into a funk, and people are griping next year about how foolish it was for Ryan not to move him when he had some/any value. I guess it all comes down to which risk you think is greater. For myself, I have to look at his track record, and I'm more worried about the second choice than the first.

#20 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 08:03 PM

I guess it all comes down to which risk you think is greater. For myself, I have to look at his track record, and I'm more worried about the second choice than the first.


Any other conclusion is based on hope and a denial of the statistical preponderance of evidence. It isnt impossible for him to be great again but his track record says that is the sucker bet at this point.