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Schafer!

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#21 ashburyjohn

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:12 AM

I like him batting ninth. 

Then to me he's a fourth outfielder at the very most.

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#22 twinsnorth49

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:23 AM

While I would certainly agree he's hit well in 77 PAs for the Twins, he has 1300 MLB PAs of 228/.313/.311 that make me very skeptical he's even an adequate 4th OFer on a good team.

Concur, the Braves are a pretty good team and he was the odd man out. He's been a good stopgap so far but if the Twins are looking to be more competitive it shouldn't be with the likes of Jordan Schaefer on their bench.


#23 ashburyjohn

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:24 AM

Has anyone mentioned his BABIP for the Twins is .382?Because, his BABIP for the Twins is .382.

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#24 Parker Hageman

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:25 AM

Schafer put up a .381 wOBA over 146 PAs in the first half of 2013 but it was largely BABIP driven which meant that, when his luck ran out, he was worse than BJ Upton.

 

 

BABIP driven. That's one way to look at it. The other way is that he fouled a ball off his ankle which led to missing 31 games after getting consistent playing time and then coming back and trying to get regular at-bats. 

 

Just to reiterate, I don't think Schafer's recent approach modifications makes him a star suddenly, but this is positive progress for someone who has been viewed as a top talent as a prospect who is now entering his prime. The other side of the coin is, if he is converted to a part-time OFer -- which he should -- would he be able to provide the same contributions as he is right now without the consistent playing time? Obviously the defense is strong but it is possible he falls into the same bad habits that he had with the Braves this year.

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#25 Parker Hageman

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:30 AM

Has anyone mentioned his BABIP for the Twins is .382?Because, his BABIP for the Twins is .382.

 

 

Did I mention his line drive rate is 28%? Because his line drive rate with the Twins is 28%. 

 

That is all coming down. There will be regression. To be clear, 30 days is nothing to make a determining factor upon. There have been plenty of other hitters who have made some changes to their approach only to have teams readjust and render them hitless again (cough, Colabello, cough). 

 

What will be interesting to see if how opposing teams adjust and if Schafer makes adjustments with them in September.

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#26 ScrapTheNickname

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:07 AM

I've pointed this out before, so if I'm boring, forgive me. But I don't see that anyone has mentioned stolen bases.

 

Schafer has 25 steals in 170 plate appearances, with an OBP of .325. He will finish well inside the top 10 in all of MLB in steals.

 

What if he got 500 or 600 plate appearances in a year?

 

It is an exciting thought.

 

Of course he is probably just teasing us, but he's doing a fine job of teasing.

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#27 Thegrin

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:35 AM

We have seen that Schafer is a bad bunter, and when you see his bunts compared to Santana's bunts it is striking how terrible he is.Yet, he said in an interview, that he considered himself a good bunter.Can the Twins teach him how to bunt correctly ?Is he willing to learn ?:)


#28 stringer bell

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:57 AM

The consensus is that we shouldn't get too excited by the so-far outstanding offensive numbers.I get that and agree.However, this may be one guy who has to play more than once a week to be the best he can be.Not everyone can adjust to the role he had with the Braves--pinch run, pinch hit and start maybe once a week.In Fuld's role, he would get consistent ABs and if he can OPS in the .700s (never has in the majors), he can be a real asset with his decent defense and basestealing speed. 

 

How would the Twins go about retaining him?I'm think that if he flattens out this last month, but still posts good numbers compared to what he has put up in previous years, that the Twins should non-tender him, but offer a minor league contract where he makes decent cake if he makes the team. 


#29 Linus

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 12:04 PM

I think his speed is a very valuable asset - the Twins have never had a guy that can steal bases like this guy.I can see him coming into the late part of a game and stealing a base to get the winning run in scoring position.In theory he should be an excellent defensive replacement as well.

 

As DMan mentions, the real trick is whether he should get a 40 man spot at the possible expense of a younger prospect.


#30 DJL44

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 03:04 PM

I think the Twins should trade him for a starting pitcher. That's what they did with Ben Revere and Sam Fuld after all!


#31 Mike Sixel

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 08:16 PM

No, they traded Revere for nothing, apparently

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#32 drjim

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 09:20 PM

May will end up as a decent reliever, but you certainly want more than that.

Revere still isn't that much of a loss.
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#33 biggentleben

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 09:31 PM

If Schafer can improve his bunting as a Twin he could be quite valuable in certain situations. I haven't really seen anyone improve their bunting as a Twin though.

 

He's been drilled on this for years, even by Glenn Hubbard, who Greg Maddux once credited with making him into a skilled bunter.  Jordan has a lot of very positive skills, but his head has always been what got in his way.  Perhaps his original organization finally getting tired of his lack of effort and poor clubhouse attitude drove him to put forth the effort and hard work that got Chipper Jones' attention before his MLB debut.  He was compared very favorably to top-end Carl Crawford as he was coming up, with all the positives and negatives that entails - too many strikeouts for a speed guy, though he will take a walk, gets seemingly power-hungry at times and changes his swing which can lead to some long slumps, and lives on his speed on defense without really having great instincts - all the positives and negatives that Crawford in Tampa Bay possessed.  If he can be 1/4 of what Crawford was for a 3-5 year run, the Twins have nailed this pick up.  I am glad to see him finally playing like the guy who he showed he could be before his wrist injury in 2009.

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#34 kab21

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 09:57 PM

I remember thinking when the Twins were good that they should work and alter the back end of the 40-man roster. They've done a nice job of that this year, trading out the likes of Alex Pressly and Darin Mastroiani for Jordan Schafer and Sam Fuld. 

 

He's arb eligible, but he wouldn't make more than about $1 million. Enough potential yet, and worst case, a solid fourth outfielder.

 

The problem is that Mastro and Pressley had nice short stints that they looked like good 4th OF'ers or spot starters but then they reverted back to what they were.It's quite likely that we will be able to lump Schafer into the Mastro/Pressley category next year. 

Is 2016 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? And the answer is NOPE!


#35 stringer bell

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 09:58 PM

I've been interested to see what you might have to say, Ben.It is still a ridiculously small sample size, but Schafer has demonstrated undeniable tools that the Twins are missing.Not only is he fast, he is aggressive in stealing bases.I can see that his routes to balls in the outfield haven't always been picture-perfect, but his speed covers the deficit nicely.So far, he seems to have a very good approach at the plate, he 'll go the other way, take a walk, but he has hit some mistake pitches hard. 


#36 kab21

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 10:01 PM

He does add a nice bench weapon that your typical utility IF'er or OF'er doesn't have.I usually complain about the lack of a good bench hitter but Schafer is a nearly elite pinch runner and can be used as a pretty good defensive replacement.

Is 2016 the year that a good pitching prospect is truly blocked by 5 good pitchers in the starting rotation? And the answer is NOPE!


#37 jokin

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 01:47 PM

He does add a nice bench weapon that your typical utility IF'er or OF'er doesn't have.I usually complain about the lack of a good bench hitter but Schafer is a nearly elite pinch runner and can be used as a pretty good defensive replacement.

 

 

To the arb experts out there.... I'm wondering what this current run of games started and possibly maintaining his current OPS+ of 136 will do to his potential arbitration value come off-season.  They refused to put a claim in on Bonifacio, who was and is a nice bench weapon, as he could play both the Inf and the OF and had blazing speed, with the possibility of only being on the hook for $1.925M (KC had to pay an additional $575,000).  Shafer makes $1.09M this year..... around what potential dollar amount would the Twins completely walk away from Shafer for 2015?

Edited by jokin, 30 August 2014 - 01:49 PM.

 

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#38 biggentleben

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 03:54 PM

To the arb experts out there.... I'm wondering what this current run of games started and possibly maintaining his current OPS+ of 136 will do to his potential arbitration value come off-season.  They refused to put a claim in on Bonifacio, who was and is a nice bench weapon, as he could play both the Inf and the OF and had blazing speed, with the possibility of only being on the hook for $1.925M (KC had to pay an additional $575,000).  Shafer makes $1.09M this year..... around what potential dollar amount would the Twins completely walk away from Shafer for 2015?

 

The least he could make in arbitration is roughly $875K.  I would wager on him making in the $1.5-2M range, and that's not out of this world for a 4th outfielder.  Anything over $2M would be very questionable to me.

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#39 stringer bell

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 04:00 PM

I wonder if they DFA him and immediately sign him to a two-way contract, knowing that he would make more in arbitration than he would on the open market.$2M is not too much if he plays anything like he has so far.It is too much if he doesn't make the team (and ties up a 40-man spot).


#40 jokin

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 04:07 PM

The least he could make in arbitration is roughly $875K.  I would wager on him making in the $1.5-2M range, and that's not out of this world for a 4th outfielder.  Anything over $2M would be very questionable to me.

 

 

Thanks, Ben.  Now the question is, would the Twins offer close to that amount, risk going to arbitration, or non-tender?.... knowing they didn't claim Bonifacio for less than a $2M commitment in 2014.  And more importantly, knowing anything about Shafer, what might be his own preferences?  If he's looking for a shot at playing every day, it seems the Twins have a spot available to prove he's an everyday player until Buxton arrives.

 

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