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Trade Dozier, Now!

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#1 mudcat14

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:09 PM

He'll never be worth more than he is right now.  With Santana, Escobar, Nunez, Florimon, Polanco & Rosario all able to step in, he's not that difficult to replace.  Hell, even Levi Michael is finally playing like a 1st rounder!  Get Dozier through waivers and see what the Giants or somebody will offer.


#2 nicksaviking

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:14 PM

Dozier would never get through waivers, and while he probably has good value, it's not nearly as high as Twins fans would like to think.  

 

Besides, his .250 BABIP and strong 18% K rate would suggest he actually could hit and get on base much, much better than he is now, meaning his value absolutely could go up.

Edited by nicksaviking, 19 August 2014 - 09:16 PM.

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#3 Shane Wahl

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:32 PM

Nunez is not a replacement. Escobar still has utility guy written all over him. Rosario is mediocre, at the moment, in AA. If Santana moves over, then there is a hole at shortstop. Florimon will never happen again. Polanco is still finding his way in AA.

 

No trading of Dozier.

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#4 acrozelle

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:48 PM

No.

 

What the Twins have been doing - trading older players that will not contribute to this team in the future - is the right move. But I don't want to trade a player who actually has a chance to contribute to their success in the future.


#5 stringer bell

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 09:50 PM

I like Dozier a lot.  I thought he did an admirable job as the leadoff hitter, but he really isn't a good fit as the #2 guy.  He has flattened out in the second half and could have been served by a few more games off earlier.  I do think there is some bad luck involved in the low BA, but he pulls so much and hits so many balls in the air, so I think he needs to adjust some more.  I would like to see him hit lower in a good lineup where the good power and good baserunning could be put to better use. 

 

As Shane noted, there aren't any sure things behind him.  I think maybe next year, he might finally figure out how to raise that BA while still getting his share (and then some) of extra base hits. 

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#6 huhguy

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 10:10 PM

if you are going with the youth movement, I think Dozier would play, if you give me a CF Prospect and a Power Hitting Outfield prospect, I pull the trigger,..especially if you get me a catcher too


#7 Thegrin

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 10:32 PM

Trade Dozier ?  A bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush ? Trade Dozier ?  You probably want TR to retire and Gardy fired too :)


#8 PseudoSABR

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 10:37 PM

He's not good enough to fetch premium value, and not bad enough to be cost prohibitive.  It makes little sense to trade him, when really the guys behind him are less proven and might establish themselves at other positions (say outfield or short).

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#9 h2oface

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 12:11 AM

No.  While I fear that he will never hit above .250 for a season, I just don't want to add him the the fantasy team of Morneau, Hunter, Cuddyer, Ortiz, Gomez, Loshe, Garza, Span, Ramos, ..... et al - (and I left out Revere on purpose).  you fill in the rest.  

No No No No No.

Edited by h2oface, 20 August 2014 - 12:14 AM.

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#10 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 04:54 AM

If someone blew me away, I'd probably trade him. That said, I think the .230 BA is more of a fluke personally. I think he can hit in the .260-.270 range, and his minor league numbers indicate that. So in my opinion, his value can go up. He's also still making the major league minimum, which is very valuable. If some team knocks our socks off, by all means, let him go, but I don't see that happening.

#11 SgtSchmidt11

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 05:30 AM

He is still cost controlled and a fan favorite. It's not going to happen.

Plus I would have to find another Twin with amazing hair for my pic, and i'm not liking Arcia's...

Edited by SgtSchmidt11, 20 August 2014 - 05:31 AM.

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#12 Teflon

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 06:04 AM

He is still cost controlled and a fan favorite. It's not going to happen.

 

Exactly. Nobody is going to buy an Escobar, Nunez, Florimon, Polanco or Rosario t-shirt. (I  think they would consider a Santana t-shirt, however, if not for the fact they already have one from the previous Santana in the back of their closet.)


#13 tobi0040

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:11 AM

Add me to the no list as well.

 

Everyone has a price.  Mike Trout would be moved for Kershaw and Puig. But in the confines of reality, I see no reason to trade him. 

 

I disagree that his value will never be this high.  If we give him a 6 year deal for $30M and/or his batting average improves which it likely will (BABIP pointed out on another post), I think his value would go up.

 

But I don't think we have a replacement in house.  Rosario is not going to play 2B in the big leagues. Pedro is not an option, and I am not willing to call Santana and Polanco the middle infielders. The odds of the Twins finding both good enough defenders there seems unlikely to me.

 

So sit back, and enjoy 20-20+ and very good defense at 2B and lets not take that for granted.  He is the best 2B since Knobby and will likely have more longevity than Chuck.

Edited by tobi0040, 20 August 2014 - 07:12 AM.


#14 dougkoebernick

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:17 AM

Every year we see teams in the hunt as the buyers.  I've always thought there were opportunities for teams that weren't in the hunt to make some deals for the next year.  What would the Twins have to give up to get Yu Darvish (who allegedly cleared waivers and has a very favorable contract)?  


#15 tobi0040

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:32 AM

Every year we see teams in the hunt as the buyers.  I've always thought there were opportunities for teams that weren't in the hunt to make some deals for the next year.  What would the Twins have to give up to get Yu Darvish (who allegedly cleared waivers and has a very favorable contract)?  

 

I really don't see a fit for Yu. They would certainly require Sano or Buxton and neither is at a high point right.


#16 gunnarthor

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:41 AM

I think Ryan should gauge interest in the offseason but the return would have to be pretty high.  He's been about a 4 WAR guy the last two years and is just now entering his arb years so he'll be pretty cheap yet.  

 

I do think that it makes sense to move him if you can find a good return b/c the team does seem to have a few good options behind him - Santana, Rosario, Polanco (who I really like), Michael.  But the return would have to be better than the Span/Revere moves and I'm not sure they'd find a team to bite on that.  

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#17 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:17 AM

I think Ryan should gauge interest in the offseason but the return would have to be pretty high.  He's been about a 4 WAR guy the last two years and is just now entering his arb years so he'll be pretty cheap yet.  

 

I do think that it makes sense to move him if you can find a good return b/c the team does seem to have a few good options behind him - Santana, Rosario, Polanco (who I really like), Michael.  But the return would have to be better than the Span/Revere moves and I'm not sure they'd find a team to bite on that.  

 

Yep this, and I'd add that none of those guys behind him (minus Santana) are ready for an extended trial, much less sure things...

 

I'd want a couple of top 100 guys and a date with Jessica Alba.  No one bites on that.  I'd have a better chance with Alba, which is less than .00000001%

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#18 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:18 AM

Everybody should be on the block for the right price but I don't understand the desire to trade Dozier.

 

Do some of you want the Twins to be in rebuilding mode eternally? Because that's essentially what you're advocating by suggesting the Twins should trade a young-ish cost-controlled player who is way above average.

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#19 mike wants wins

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:20 AM

Not a fan of this idea.
Lighten up Francis....

#20 gunnarthor

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:25 AM

 

 

I'd want a couple of top 100 guys and a date with Jessica Alba.  No one bites on that.  I'd have a better chance with Alba, which is less than .00000001%

I'd hold out for a date with Yvonne Strahovski instead.

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#21 birdwatcher

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:38 AM

I'd wait until the message gets through his thick hair to stop pulling the ball and slap it the other way. Once that's accomplished, we can send him off grumbling about the Twins Way for the proverbial bag of baseballs.  ;)

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#22 TheDean

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:45 AM

Everybody should be on the block for the right price but I don't understand the desire to trade Dozier.

 

Do some of you want the Twins to be in rebuilding mode eternally? Because that's essentially what you're advocating by suggesting the Twins should trade a young-ish cost-controlled player who is way above average.

 

Totally agree with this.  I also think it's interesting that TD can have discussions about signing FA SS for 3 years, while also talking about trading away Dozier.  I mean, I guess it just shows that we all have different opinions of our middle infield and the overall state of the rebuild.  I think both trade/sign views are a bit extreme.  In reality, there's no way we don't see a performance drop from the MI if Dozier got traded.  Dozier>Escobar and Santana>>the rest.  On the other hand, Escobar and Santana = FA SS performance , and they're cost-controlled.  I think the MI is actually a slight strong-suit for now, but not so strong that you can trade from it.

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#23 tobi0040

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:48 AM

Everybody should be on the block for the right price but I don't understand the desire to trade Dozier.

 

Do some of you want the Twins to be in rebuilding mode eternally? Because that's essentially what you're advocating by suggesting the Twins should trade a young-ish cost-controlled player who is way above average.

 

Yeah, it seems like most are frustrated with how long the Twins have been a 90 loss team.  Yet we want to flip Dozier for presumebly prospects?  We traded Revere and Span two years ago and Meyer and May are just seeing the show. Worley was up right away I guess, but I think the haul in that deal was May.


#24 James

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:56 AM

Yeah.  I'm definitely not a fan of this idea.  Dozier seems to be a part of future.  I think everyone has given enough reasons given his numbers and status as a crowd favorite.  

 

Also, August would definitely not be the time to make this trade.  The haul would probably be bigger in the offseason.  I'd rather they explored an extension with Dozier to try to buy out his arb years and possibly one or two free agent years rather than exploring a trade.  That's my personal opinion, at least.  

You can come up with statistics to prove anything. Forty percent of all people know that.


#25 Monkeypaws

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 09:06 AM

Everybody should be on the block for the right price but I don't understand the desire to trade Dozier.

 

Do some of you want the Twins to be in rebuilding mode eternally? Because that's essentially what you're advocating by suggesting the Twins should trade a young-ish cost-controlled player who is way above average.

 

Well said - "sell high" means selling someone who is actually playing well. Those are the pieces we should be trying to keep.


#26 Trov

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 09:44 AM

A deal at this time of year would make little to no sense.  What could be received in return would be much higher in the off season because any player on the 40 man rosters have to clear waivers to be traded.  I would only be willing to trade him for a ML ready guys.  I am always willing to see what is out there, but I do not see a clear replacement ready right now.  He is a top notch fielder and is a threat with the bat.  I do feel some overrate him, but on a good team he would be a solid 7-9 hitter, not a 2-3 like he has been. 


#27 BMCACCAL

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 10:51 AM

I agree with the earlier posts; there's no good reason to trade Dozier.  Twins fans and Sabrmatricians (sp?) tend to overvalue Dozier, but there's no good reason to trade him for less than a true #1 or #2 starter or #4 hitter and he isn't worth that. We really don't have an in-house replacement for him and losing him thins out an already very thin lineup. The loss of his bat isn't worth the likely return.

 

Having said that, he shouldn't be hitting 2 in the order, or anywhere below 6 for that matter. He's a strong defender and on offense he's a nice complimentary piece on a good team built around 2 or 3 others.  The Twins' problem is that we don't have the 2 or 3 others unless you count Mauer as one of those players. We need at least one or two more big bats for the middle of the order. Vargas and/or Arcia may be one or more of those but we're a long way from knowing if that's the case. Another year with Dozier batting 2 (or 3 as some have suggested) means another year of struggling offensively.   


#28 clutterheart

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 10:53 AM

As I say to everyone wanting a hypothetical trade:

 

To Who?  For What?

 

Who would the Giants give up for him?


#29 drjim

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 11:03 AM

Still don't see why creating a hole going into next season is a good strategy. If the younger guys continue to develop and force themselves into the majors, Dozier's value won't change a whole lot.

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#30 Shane Wahl

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 11:30 AM

I want to see Dozier batting 5th between Vargas and Arcia next year after Sano arrives. For right now, with Santana leading off it is absurd to not put him after Mauer.