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Promote Josmil Pinto?

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#21 jokin

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 10:18 PM

He wasn't known to be such an abomination behind the plate in the minors. Not good, but certainly passable. The Twins can rotate Mauer, Vargas, and Pinto a little bit to give Pinto DH time and he can start behind the play some too.

 

Suzuki is a question mark next year as well.

 

To you and me, maybe, but the coaching staff went out of their way to convince management and ownership at the trading deadline to pony up at least $12M and maybe more over the next 2-3 years.  For better or worse, with Gardy in charge, I think Suzuki will be the every day guy unless and until he hits consistently below the Mendoza line.

Edited by jokin, 20 August 2014 - 01:37 PM.

 

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#22 iTwins

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 01:20 PM

What role then? Backup C? RH bench bat?


I think his role for the Twins is catcher or "bust". That may be as a time sharing catcher with Suzuki, or as a starter (if his bat dictates it) or even as the backup. Either way, his defense has to get up to Major League caliber or I'm not sure where he fits.

He'd make a good DH or even a nice part of a DH platoon, but with the switch hitting Vargas looking good (so far) at DH, I don't think the Twins could (or should) bump him in favor of Pinto.

I'm rooting for Pinto and I'd love him to become a solid catcher - and I want to be clear that I don't think he's a failure if ONLY his bat develops - but from the Twins' perspective, it may be a necessity if he wants to play on this club.
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#23 Willihammer

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 02:25 PM

Impossible question: what would Vargas fetch on the trade block?

Well, there's that.

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#24 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 02:40 PM

totally makes sense that the minor league playoffs are more important than seeing what he can do at the MLB level.....


For all this talk about a winning clubhouse atmosphere and what not, I'd think participating in a playoff race would be a good thing. I don't have a problem waiting a few days for that. He wont' get that atmosphere in Minnesota, that's for sure.

#25 ashburyjohn

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 02:57 PM

I think his role for the Twins is catcher or "bust".

Many minor league catchers switch to another position.Do you think that his defense elsewhere also wouldn't be close to acceptable, or that his bat won't "play" anywhere but at an up-the-middle defensive position?

Why worry about tomorrow when today is so far off.


#26 jokin

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 03:19 PM

For all this talk about a winning clubhouse atmosphere and what not, I'd think participating in a playoff race would be a good thing. I don't have a problem waiting a few days for that. He wont' get that atmosphere in Minnesota, that's for sure.

 

 

None other than Rob Antony himself- in his May, 2014, dismissal of AAA versus the major leagues in the case of a prospective Alex Meyer promotion- put a major quash on any notion of the beneficiality of an I-League playoff series or two versus actual major league PAs and catching reps, particularly for a major-league-ready guy like Pinto.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, come September, Pinto should be playing 3 out of every 4 games, either to inform the Twins on whether or not he's a keeper- and if they've already decided to move on at some point- to showcase him for an offseason trade, someone is going to bite, and hitting catchers are always in demand.

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#27 Mike Sixel

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 03:39 PM

I don't see how "playoff experience" in AAA is better at seeing what he can do in the majors than actually being in the majors. But, I am genuinely curious about how it could help him.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#28 Tibs

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 04:01 PM

Have him work on some LF in the offseason, especially if you don't like him at catcher. If we have a manager who is willing to get creative, he could easily play half the games a week between C/LF/DH.

 

LF really isn't all that hard. I'm not sure how major leaguers like Bartlett and Nunez can make it look hard.

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#29 drjim

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 04:11 PM

Impossible question: what would Vargas fetch on the trade block?

 

Not much. No d guys have limited value.

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#30 Platoon

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 04:38 PM

Pinto's lot was cast before the ink dried on Suzuki's contract. He is a Gardy type guy. There was never truly a competition to be the starter. The good Lord himself could not catch Deduno and look good doing it. So, if you have a catcher who you consider poorer defensively, is that the guy he gets to catch? One of the reasons we kept Suzuki was to work with the plethora of young pitchers on the way, like May! Well so far we don't know how that is going to work, do we. One could easily say Suzuki is the catcher of the present. But the problem for the Twins is there is no present, only a future. And all decisions should be based on that premise. I think the fans would buy into that completely. I would rather lose 100 than 90 with the future players losing them. In reality spring training started for this team after the first 10 games post ASG! Btw, I see no way Pinto gets to to equally share catching duties equally with Suzuki, sans injury. It's really not the way Gardy rolls!
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#31 jokin

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 04:59 PM

Not much. No d guys have limited value.

 

I'm not sure about that.  He's demonstrated an .895 OPS/150 OPS+ in AA/AAA, with outstanding plate discipline.  And of course, .813 OPS/126 OPS+ with the Twins. His D may always hold him back as a full-time catcher, but surely there would be teams lining up for a guy who projects as a part-time C/DH/LF with a potentially potent bat.

 

Joyous, fact-based and tireless Twins fan for 40+ years, who unfortunately has been characterized as-

 

"forcing Twins fans to endure more bitter, baseless, and tiresome cheap shots about the Twins FO."


#32 Monkeypaws

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 05:14 PM

It sure makes a lot more sense to play Pinto in September than Fryer. Give him and Kurt 50-50 and give the kid some more valuable MLB experience. The Twins need to be more aggressive giving these kids a shot when the season has gone down the tubes. The games might be meaningless for the Twins, but not for their opponents.


#33 spycake

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 06:15 PM

Is it just me, or do the Twins not like Latin American players in the catcher position? Unless they are already established there from another org, like Henry Blanco...

#34 drjim

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:28 PM

I'm not sure about that.  He's demonstrated an .895 OPS/150 OPS+ in AA/AAA, with outstanding plate discipline.  And of course, .813 OPS/126 OPS+ with the Twins. His D may always hold him back as a full-time catcher, but surely there would be teams lining up for a guy who projects as a part-time C/DH/LF with a potentially potent bat.

 

He was asking about Vargas.

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#35 drjim

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:29 PM

It sure makes a lot more sense to play Pinto in September than Fryer. Give him and Kurt 50-50 and give the kid some more valuable MLB experience. The Twins need to be more aggressive giving these kids a shot when the season has gone down the tubes. The games might be meaningless for the Twins, but not for their opponents.

 

Fryer won't start a game once Pinto comes up in September. Not sure it will quite be 50-50 though.

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#36 DocBauer

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 07:57 PM

I believe there is absolutely room for Pinto, and his bat, on the club now and in the future.

I believe his role is that of backup C, (at least-pending), RHPH and sometimes DH as well.

Firstly, 2015 in particular is still fluid. I'm a big believer in Vargas and love his potential. Hopefully, his potential is NOW. But despite an impressive start, what if he's not ready yet for 2015 after pitchers make adjustments.

Second, every spot on a 25 man roster has the potential to help and be important. And bench roles usually revolve around two types. Catcher or not, some backups are excellent defensive players who fill in but aren't very good offensive players/hitters. The second type are offensive performers who can also fill in, but aren't necessarily very good defensive players. Neither type is right or wrong, just different. And neither hurts the team as long as not overly exposed. Pinto wasn't special, but wasn't bad, defensively in the minors, and didn't seem too bad to close out 2013. So with a little improvement, why not him as the backup catcher? There is no rule that says your backup C has to be a Butera type.

Thirdly, there can be injuries and regression. Both can lead to increased opportunity, though we don't wish for either one of them.

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#37 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 08:41 PM

Fryer won't start a game once Pinto comes up in September.

Promise? :)
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#38 Willihammer

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 10:12 PM

Seriously though, can anyone explain what the Twins are doing with Pinto? How does he fit into their plan? He is wrapping up his 9th minor league season. He's crushed the highest levels. He's even crushed MLB in his short time here.

 

TBH if I were in Pinto's shoes, I'd be getting kinda pissed

Edited by Willihammer, 20 August 2014 - 10:12 PM.

Well, there's that.

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#39 Shane Wahl

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 11:24 PM

Seriously though, can anyone explain what the Twins are doing with Pinto? How does he fit into their plan? He is wrapping up his 9th minor league season. He's crushed the highest levels. He's even crushed MLB in his short time here.

 

TBH if I were in Pinto's shoes, I'd be getting kinda pissed

 

I agree completely. It is now just laughable to watch this Eric Fryer show while Pinto mashes in AAA. He doesn't need playing time "every day" he needs to be up facing big league pitching and working on catching big league pitchers.

Anyway, it would be nice to have 13 good position players. It seems like we as Twins fans have become complacent about the bench and the last 4-6 roster spots. The Twins finishing the season next year with bench options like Pinto and Plouffe? Yes, please.

 


#40 Paul Pleiss

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 11:52 PM

... and if Rochester is in the playoffs, it will be even later.

 

 

agreed.

 

He stays with the Red Wings until their season is over. Then he comes up and he probably hits well and hopefully catches anytime the Twins even think of putting Fryer into a game. Pinto may be nearing the end of his career as a C, at least with Twins. Could be an interesting trade chip for a team looking for a backup catcher/DH. i would love to see the Twins have Pinto as a back-up catcher/bench bat/DH than Fryer, who provides essentially nothing.

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