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Your Confidence Level in Justin Morneau

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#1 mini_tb

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 03:21 PM

There have been a number of Justin Morneau related articles lately outlining his health maladies and his ongoing recovery from post concussion syndrome. How has reading these articles affected your outlook on Morneau's 2012 season and his career? Please refrain from posting any of the "Morneau is faking it" types of comments.

#2 Seth Stohs

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 03:46 PM

I have to be honest. I have no concerns about Denard Span or Joe Mauer, but right now, I feel anything that the Twins get from Morneau is a bonus. As Gleeman pointed out a couple of weeks ago, when Morneau said (on about January 16th) that he hadn't had any concussion symptoms since December, that was just 2-3 weeks. Man, I hope I'm wrong because he was so good!

#3 Parker Hageman

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 04:37 PM

Is it positive that he has been symptom-free dating back to December? Yes. Will it mean he's good to go from here on out? Who knows. What we do know is that he is working hard and that's a good sign - particularly because of the wrist, shoulder, etc - but the concussion is such a hard injury to pin down.

#4 Nick Nelson

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 05:06 PM

If he plays 140 games at his previous level of effectiveness, it'd basically be a miracle. The concussion alone might be enough to end his career, but on top of that he's got an apparently severe wrist problem, not to mention the litany of more minor injuries he's recovering from. At this point the Twins need to be planning for life without Morneau, which is truly unfortunate.

#5 Chad Jacobsen

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Posted 06 February 2012 - 05:29 PM

I want to see Justin do well but I think anyone hoping for him to return to his pre-concussion self is in for a major disappointment. I do think he can eventually get back there but it won't be anytime soon. The fact that he has missed so much time has to throw his timing off big time, something that seemed apparent last year when he was in the lineup. I agree with Seth in saying that I am not worried about Span or Mauer but I am worried about Morneau. I think it's going to take him a while to get his timing and swing back. hopefully something a full Spring Training will help out with this year. You can hit off the pitching machine and BP all you want but he is going to need a lot of in game action and live pitching to get back to where he needs to be. How long it will take I have no idea, I am just hoping he can stay healthy this season and be somewhat productive in the beginning of the season to the point where he is not hurting the Twins by taking some time to re adjust to major league pitching.

#6 John Bonnes

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 01:35 PM

50% that he's even average. 10% that he's the old Justin. Let's ponder this - what if he is just an average 1B, or slightly below average? Where does he bat in the lineup? It takes Gardenhire at least 2.5 months to move him our of 4 or 5, right? I assume Willingham and Doumit move up a spot, and then Morneau goes 6th with Valencia following him. And if any of those guys are hurt, Plouffe is the next option? Fine against LHP, but vs RHP...ugh.

#7 travistwinstalk

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 06:11 PM

you guys negativity is unbelievable to me. What is he supposed to do retire, he is only 30 years old and is still very talented. There is nothing that I have heard that tells me he can't get back to where he was. Bottom line the Twins owe him 30 million over the next 2 years and trust me he is not going to retire and walk away from that money. So Twins fans we are stuck with Morneau so why be negative when there is nothing to say he can't be good again. His concussion problems appear in the past and the wrist problem is the only thing that gives me pause to guarantee a 30/120 type of year. I am not worried at all about the concussion symptoms anymore, but I know that none of you are going to believe in him. I realize it is easier to be negative than positive when it comes to Morneau, but I am not wired that way so I truly believe that Morneau will make it all the way back and be good again. I have 99.99 percent confidence taht he will play 130 games in 2012. I have 80 percent confidence taht Morneau hits 25/90 and 70 percent that he hits 30/120.

#8 Seth Stohs

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 06:23 PM

Geek, I would assume that they will (and they should) give Morneau 200-250 plate appearances to get back. He deserves that. He's got the history. It would be great to see him at 100% and just see what happens. I think that Gardy would be willing to flip Morneau and Willingham between 4 and 5 based on matchup. Travis, I think each and every one of us who have commented hope like crazy that you are right.

#9 travistwinstalk

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 10:10 AM

I feel like Twins fans owe Morneau the benefit of the doubt. He has brought many great moments to Twins Territory and is our best power hitter. So the thought of him hitting 6th behind journeymen Josh Willingham and Doumit is inconceivable and disrespectful to Morneau. I guess I am more loyal to players than some as I don't forget what they have done for organization. I am not as quick to cut the cord on players as some. The ones that are critical of Morneau are the same that said Joe Mauer was a team cancer and would like to get out of that contract. Both Mauer and Morneau have been key cogs for years and I for one am not going to forget that and turn on them. Thats just me though everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

#10 Fanatic Jack

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 10:16 AM

I admire Morneau for trying to play through this injury. However, it's clear to me he will never even be a small fraction of the player he was in 2006. What a tremendous loss! He has a wife and daughter to think about and baseball is not worth being paralyzed the rest of his life. If he retired the Twins could get back the last two seasons of his salary because the contract is insured. I honestly believe Chris Parmelee is going to be very good for many years to come. (Snip) Nothing wrong with being positive but at some point reality has to set in. (Snip) The team will lose 90 games again this season, but with Ryan in charge, the draft should go well, and good trades will most likely put the team back into contention around 2014.

Edited by Seth Stohs, 12 February 2012 - 10:38 AM.
No need for personal attacks.


#11 travistwinstalk

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 10:24 AM

Actually no I don't agree with every move the organization makes as I was disappointed they traded JJ Hardy. However, I don't see the point of always being critical its not like it is going to change anything. I am going to support the guys they put out there and not criticize every move they make because it is not worth it. Jack actually if Morneau retired he wouldnt get a cent. That is why regardless why he won't retire because he has a family to think about. He is 30 years old and if it was me i would continue trying until i couldnt do it anymore. The Twins would have been fine in 2011 if Mauer, Morneau, Span wouldnt of missed so many games and Liriano wouldnt have been a disaster. Yeah but I should have known that when I said they would be fine. I am a positive guy that is just how I am and think positive not just on the twins but everything i do in my life. I am not asking people to agree with that philosophy just give people the benefit of the doubt before you call them bums that should be cutting your grass.

#12 Seth Stohs

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 10:40 AM

Travis, saying that there is a strong chance that Morneau doesn't return to his 2006 or 2008 form doesn't in any way say that people have forgotten what he did. As I've written above, I think he should start the season hitting 4th or 5th. The question was... if he's hitting .180/.250/.300 in mid-June, will Gardy be willing to drop him in the order, and the answer to that has to be "I hope so." Willingham is a pretty good on-base guy and a power hitter. Even if Morneau was coming off of a 100% healthy season, it's fair to ask if they should hit 4th and 5th.

#13 Nick Nelson

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 11:21 AM

Come on, let's not start finger-wagging and claiming that holding a realistic viewpoint on Morneau's situation is somehow disrespectful to the guy. I think we all appreciate what he's done for the Twins, but if team management followed your approach and decided to simply "give him the benefit of the doubt" against their better judgment because of his past accomplishments it'd be hugely irresponsible. They need to be preparing for life without him while hoping like heck that he can make an unlikely comeback.

#14 spideyo

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 10:54 PM

I really really hope that Morneau comes back and crushes the hell out of the ball every day, and plays well enough to make Parmelee sign a long-term lease in Rochester. However, concussions are scary as hell, and very complex. I can't help but think about Koskie, and worry that that is where Morneau is headed. No one wants that.

#15 woolhouse

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 08:55 AM

Why risk it? If Morneau's bat is there, he's most valuable as the team's MVP. His last concussion came in the field diving for a ball hit down the line. I know he's only 30, and if he hadn't gotten the concussion, talking this early in his career about moving him to DH would be unheard of (unless there was a Doug Mientkiewicz-style glove waiting in Triple-A with a 2006-Morneau-bat to boot) but I think taking away one area of focus of his game (the glove) would allow him to focus on an area the Twins need him to bounce back in more than the other (his bat.) Gardy, Morneau, the team, everyone should have learned from last year that bringing him back too soon is just going to make him frustrated, and that is not good for a concussed brain either.

#16 StormJH1

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 10:05 AM

Why risk it? If Morneau's bat is there, he's most valuable as the team's MVP. His last concussion came in the field diving for a ball hit down the line. I know he's only 30, and if he hadn't gotten the concussion, talking this early in his career about moving him to DH would be unheard of (unless there was a Doug Mientkiewicz-style glove waiting in Triple-A with a 2006-Morneau-bat to boot) but I think taking away one area of focus of his game (the glove) would allow him to focus on an area the Twins need him to bounce back in more than the other (his bat.) Gardy, Morneau, the team, everyone should have learned from last year that bringing him back too soon is just going to make him frustrated, and that is not good for a concussed brain either.


Agreed. I think what Seth said above makes a great deal of sense...he's not "worried" about him because you'd have to be nuts to EXPECT a full season of top-level production out of this guy. I think Morneau's quote from a few weeks ago shows that he's beginning to "understand" the gravity of his situation. He was asked if he would just switch to DH if playing 1B was too much of a risk for him, and his response was to the effect of "Look, if I'm so fragile that I can't even play in the field, talking about DH is basically pointless because I probably shouldn't be playing at all."

It'd really be one of the great tragedies of Twins history if this guy were to hang it up so soon because you recognized that Hrbek's number hangs in the rafters, yet Morneau's star potential was so much greater. Unfortunately, the seeds of this thing may have been planted in that one moment in Seattle 2005, along with any other cumulative head trauma he may have picked up playing hockey, etc. in his youth. I really wish he could play and not suffer any effects of this - the only Twins jersey I own with a number on it has the "33" on the back.

#17 mikeee

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 10:42 AM

Synptom free since December doesn't seem like that long a time. I don't know how long "symptom free" he's been previously. If his training is the same as it's been, he may hit well and play well, but then you never know when the symptoms will come back.

#18 Nick Nelson

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 10:58 AM

The other thing is that Morneau has a number of other issues beyond the concussion that he's trying to bounce back from. It sounds like the left wrist problem might be just as big of a concern at this point. If he has no feeling in his index finger... that's not good.

#19 Jeff

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 11:05 AM

I have little confidence he will play more than a few weeks. It seems like he could be done for the year (or his career) if he sustains any kind of trauma to his head at all.

#20 BeefMaster

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 01:25 PM

Is it positive that he has been symptom-free dating back to December? Yes.


I'd say that it'd be a lot more of a positive if it was, say, September or October.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

#21 JB_Iowa

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 02:42 PM

I'd love to see Justin Morneau playing the way he did in the first part of 2010. In many ways, I've felt that he was the heart and soul of this club -- much more so than Mauer who seems like a bit of an automaton to me. But Nick is right, it isn't just the concussion. It is the wrist. It is the pinched nerve. It just feels as though his body is letting him down -- as though he were 40 instead of 30. I don't blame him for not retiring before this season but I do think that he may have to face some hard truths this spring -- and decide how much risk he wants to take with the rest of his life. Scary prospect.

#22 Knuckelball

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:02 PM

It's not only his concusion that is a concern I am concerned about his wrist and what that will do to his power especially in the vast Target Field. I am old enough to remember how Roger Maris lost his power after injurying his wrist. A lot of power comes from snapping our wrist.

#23 YLT

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 09:17 PM

If he can't play one of the easiest fielding positions in the game, how do we expect him to hit 90+ mph stuff with relearned reaction times and visual perception? I'm with Morneau regarding the idea of permanent DH if it comes to that. No go. I really hope the guy comes back in full force and us realists/pessimists/pragmatists/etc all eat a whole lot of crow by mid-June. Love the guy, love his swing, love his attitude toward the game.