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Article: Trade Candidate: Josh Willingham

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#31 John Bonnes

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:48 AM

You have greatly misused statistics if you only believe that Willy is marginally better than Nunez or Colabello.

 

The message that this team shouldn't be sending is giving away a good player in order to play a much worse player in his place.  Players understand if a veteran like Willy is traded but if there is no interest in getting something back and there is nobody with a future to replace him then it sends a message that we are trying to make this team as bad as we can but we expect you to play hard.

 

I think baseball players are a little more accustomed to the business of baseball than that. They understand that Willingham is gone after this year. They understand that the logical move is to trade him for a prospect right now. I sure didn't get any sense of outrage when they made a similar trade last week, shipping Morales for a minor league reliever. Did you?. I think they get it. 

 

That said, I think we might be underrating Willingham's appeal a little. He's hitting .219, but he's got a .360 OBP and a 782 OPS. He's slugging .481 over the last 2 weeks. He's not an all-star, but plenty of teams could find room for him, even in a corner outfield spot. 


#32 Cris E

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:58 AM

That said, I think we might be underrating Willingham's appeal a little. He's hitting .219, but he's got a .360 OBP and a 782 OPS. He's slugging .481 over the last 2 weeks. He's not an all-star, but plenty of teams could find room for him, even in a corner outfield spot. 

 

A good two weeks plus a track record of decent power plus a short and cheap contract makes him a decent bet for a team eyeing a stretch run.  He'll be worth something to someone: more than a low A scrub, less than a Top 20 talent.


#33 TheLeviathan

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 10:03 AM

You have greatly misused statistics if you only believe that Willy is marginally better than Nunez or Colabello.

 

The message that this team shouldn't be sending is giving away a good player in order to play a much worse player in his place.  Players understand if a veteran like Willy is traded but if there is no interest in getting something back and there is nobody with a future to replace him then it sends a message that we are trying to make this team as bad as we can but we expect you to play hard.

 

I also think it's hypocritical if people are both calling for Gardy to be replaced and judging him by his 90+ loss record.  The road to 90-100 losses is this strategy of giving away anybody that is good but 30+.  Trading them for a decent prospect or to open up playing time for a good prospect is one thing but giving them away for nothing and replacing them with Colabello is dumb.

 

Except that they can replace him with Pinto.  Or Vargas.  Or other options as well.  Clutching to a guy like Willingham is unnecessary on every level.

 

I can't change that Willingham isn't very good.  Replacing him with other players that aren't very good isn't going to crush this team.  They aren't very good with or without him.  

 

Move on, have some incentive to play the kids.

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#34 tobi0040

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 10:27 AM

You have greatly misused statistics if you only believe that Willy is marginally better than Nunez or Colabello.

 

The message that this team shouldn't be sending is giving away a good player in order to play a much worse player in his place.  Players understand if a veteran like Willy is traded but if there is no interest in getting something back and there is nobody with a future to replace him then it sends a message that we are trying to make this team as bad as we can but we expect you to play hard.

 

I also think it's hypocritical if people are both calling for Gardy to be replaced and judging him by his 90+ loss record.  The road to 90-100 losses is this strategy of giving away anybody that is good but 30+.  Trading them for a decent prospect or to open up playing time for a good prospect is one thing but giving them away for nothing and replacing them with Colabello is dumb.

I am a little torn on the expectation. I think if a team in the AL has a need at DH he may have some value.  It is kind of like Jake Peavy, his ERA was actually higher than KC's at the time of the trade and he snagged two prospects, one 75 overall.  With Peavy and to a certain extent Willingham, we may get a premium because of what he has done. 

 

But when you look at the teams in contention, none have a glaring hole at DH and I can respect nobody rushing to have Josh play LF for them.


#35 drjim

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:03 PM

Good to see one of our assets doing well going into the deadline. With the shortage of bats he should bring back more than salary relief.

Papers...business papers.

#36 drock2190

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 09:16 PM

Good to see one of our assets doing well going into the deadline. With the shortage of bats he should bring back more than salary relief.

 

Except the Twins arent dealing him per mlbtraderumors.com


#37 jorgenswest

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 09:53 PM

They should have let the Orioles take his contract last year.

#38 drjim

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 06:29 AM

They should have let the Orioles take his contract last year.

 

So the Pohlads can pocket more money?

Papers...business papers.

#39 mike wants wins

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 06:41 AM

so, they aren't trading him? What is the point of stocking the farm system, if you won't call up players?

What I just typed is probably an opinion, not a fact. I mean, I'm usually right, so you should maybe assume it is or will be a fact soon, but that's up to you. :)


#40 nicksaviking

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 07:04 AM

The report is that they aren't dealing him before July 31st, not that they aren't dealing him at all.  They are almost surely gambling that he will increase his value in the next month and move him after the deadline. 

 

It is frustrating that every year bad teams have good talent that they can move for nice returns at the deadline, and every year the Twins are terrible and have next to nothing to move.  It does speak poorly of the Twins front office that they rarely have any assets to swap this time of year, of course it speaks just as poorly about the field staffs of the other losing teams.  If the Red Sox, Cubs, Padres, Rangers and Indians have players this coveted, they should probably be playing better baseball.

 

On a somewhat related note, Cleveland moved Justin Masterson and is close to dealing Asdrubal Cabrera.  That takes some guts seeing as they are only a half game under .500.  Can anyone imagine the Twins doing that, even if it's the smart move?


#41 mike wants wins

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 07:08 AM

TR did it in the past, but I don't see them doing it this year. The owner seems a bit peeved at the results lately.....But, CLE is doing a great job this trade deadline. It helps to acquire good players in the first place.

Edited by mike wants wins, 31 July 2014 - 07:09 AM.

What I just typed is probably an opinion, not a fact. I mean, I'm usually right, so you should maybe assume it is or will be a fact soon, but that's up to you. :)


#42 jorgenswest

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 08:36 AM

So the Pohlads can pocket more money?


I should have been more clear. I hadn't thought that would be the conclusion. I thought they should have let him go last year so the would seek a different solution.

Do the Orioles sign Nelson Cruz if they have Willingham?

Who do the a Twins find in the winter to replace him?

#43 nicksaviking

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 08:59 AM

I should have been more clear. I hadn't thought that would be the conclusion. I thought they should have let him go last year so the would seek a different solution.

Do the Orioles sign Nelson Cruz if they have Willingham?

Who do the a Twins find in the winter to replace him?

 

I don't think the Twins were ever going to give up the draft pick for a player who had a QO, especially not for a player getting a one year deal and extra especially not for a confirmed steroid user who would bring them heat from the clean and sober Minnesota grandparents who make up 95% of the fan base.


#44 drjim

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 09:00 AM

TR did it in the past, but I don't see them doing it this year. The owner seems a bit peeved at the results lately.....But, CLE is doing a great job this trade deadline. It helps to acquire good players in the first place.

 

Acquiring better players is a great solution. We can all get behind that!

Papers...business papers.

#45 drjim

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 09:02 AM

I don't think the Twins were ever going to give up the draft pick for a player who had a QO, especially not for a player getting a one year deal and extra especially not for a confirmed steroid user who would bring them heat from the clean and sober Minnesota grandparents who make up 95% of the fan base.

 

Posts like this make message boards worth it.

 

A perfectly valid criticism taken to nonsensical hyperbole.

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#46 old nurse

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 09:08 AM

Oakland might need an upgrade over Gomes in their all out push.