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Astros mess

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#141 gunnarthor

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 08:40 AM

How is the Appel thing bad? Teams do this all the time. Another stupid unwritten rule thing. It's like these guys are not even adults sometimes.

 

Actually, I don't think teams do that very often at all.  I certainly don't remember any Twin minor leaguer coming up to Target Field (except right after they sign and do the post draft media swing).  And I also don't think it would've gone over that well at Twins Daily if the Twins had drafted Appel, saw him absolutely suck at A ball and then promote him anyway and give him a pitching session at TF.  I suspect some people would find a way to ****** about that.

 

One of the Astros beat writer tweeted a lot more about this.  Basically, players on the ML team think that the FO isn't concerned about the ML team at all.  The Springer signing fiasco left a bad taste in some players mouth (Springer was offered a team friendly contract, didn't take it and was sent to AAA instead).  So, yeah, in one sense it doesn't matter that Appel threw a bullpen session and nothing will happen b/c of it.  On the other side, it's somewhat similar to the Joe Mauer bi-lateral leg crap when players were complaining about Joe.  There is a sense of entitlement that a player is getting - in Joe's case, he at least had a track record.  Appel is not viewed as warmly.

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#142 mike wants wins

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 08:44 AM

Appel was having issues. they wanted their coaches to get a look at him. How would you go about doing that, other than having him throw in front of them?

What I just typed is probably an opinion, not a fact. I mean, I'm usually right, so you should maybe assume it is or will be a fact soon, but that's up to you. :) Also, I am NOT trying to convince anyone I am correct, I'm just talking here, not arguing.


#143 gunnarthor

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 08:52 AM

Appel was having issues. they wanted their coaches to get a look at him. How would you go about doing that, other than having him throw in front of them?

Not saying it was wrong but it isn't common.  Most teams have roving instructors.  When Shooter Hunt lost the ability to throw strikes, the Twins didn't send him to Anderson or Blyleven for a one time evaluation.  

 

And I'm not sure how much help one bullpen session could possibly be.  It seems like - and players certainly viewed it as - an entitlement to a guy who hadn't deserved it.  Long run, there's no harm in it but there's also no harm in the ML players express their anger over it.


#144 mike wants wins

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:04 AM

Why are they angry though? What harm did it do anyone, other than to some unwritten belief? No one was cut that shouldn't be. No one was hurt by this.

 

He should not have been in that band box place in the first place, imo. Now he won't be. We'll see what happens in a couple of years, but I'd still role the die on him being very good.

What I just typed is probably an opinion, not a fact. I mean, I'm usually right, so you should maybe assume it is or will be a fact soon, but that's up to you. :) Also, I am NOT trying to convince anyone I am correct, I'm just talking here, not arguing.


#145 kab21

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:12 AM

The Appel thing should be a complete non-issue in an organization.The fact that it pissed people off says that this is a very unhappy clubhouse.

 

I wouldn't think anything if the Stewart or Thorpe (in Cedar Rapids) were given a bullpen session at Target Field if their mechanics fell apart.Frankly everything should be tried when a top prospect (pick 1.1) completely falls apart like this.

I look forward to the day that a pitching prospect is truly blocked by good pitchers.


#146 JB_Iowa

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:22 AM

The Appel thing should be a complete non-issue in an organization.The fact that it pissed people off says that this is a very unhappy clubhouse.

 

 

But actually that was the point of bringing this up.  The Astros are a mess.  If you had an organization where players and prospects felt they were treated with respect, this probably would never have come up.

 

But Astros management has decided that they are going to be the smart kids on the block.  They are taking analytics to the extreme and playing extreme hardball with their prospects and draft choices (and I can only guess from this event that their major league players aren't treated much better).

 

There are some things that I find really interesting in what the Astros are doing -- for example, the idea of using analytics to determine if some players are more injury-likely than others -- but it seems like in their pursuit of all things analytical, they have forgotten that there is also a human element to the equation and that EVERYONE -- players, fans, prospects -- does better if they are treated with respect.

 

There has to be a balance.

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#147 drjim

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:31 AM

I suspect the majority of this is more narrative than reality, but they have lost control of the narrative and people are going to be looking for quotes and stories that confirm the narrative.

 

These stories show some of the pitfalls of sudden, drastic change in any industry, especially one as conservative as baseball. If you come out with a certain attitude people are going to enjoy bringing you down. And the massive amounts of losses certainly don't help either.

Papers...business papers.

#148 gunnarthor

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:43 AM

Why are they angry though? What harm did it do anyone, other than to some unwritten belief? No one was cut that shouldn't be. No one was hurt by this.

 

He should not have been in that band box place in the first place, imo. Now he won't be. We'll see what happens in a couple of years, but I'd still role the die on him being very good.

 

 

I think JB_Iowa hits it on the head.And I suspect the totality of the players anger was "Why is that ****** up here?What the ****!" and then they moved on with their lives.