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Boras, Morales interested in long term deal.

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#1 PseudoSABR

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:06 PM

[COLOR=#292F33][FONT=Gotham Narrow SSm]

Posted ImageDarren Wolfson[COLOR=#88C9F9]Verified account[/COLOR]‏[COLOR=#8899A6][COLOR=#B1BBC3]@[/COLOR]DarrenWolfson[/COLOR]
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[COLOR=#292F33][FONT=Gotham Narrow SSm]Talked w/ Scott Boras. Gushed about how much Morales likes it here. Said a long-term marriage is certainly in play. [COLOR=#66C1D5]#[/COLOR]mntwins

[SIZE=2]Mlbtraderumors link.[/SIZE]

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#2 70charger

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:08 PM

I don't see it. Can't someone like Kennys Vargas take over at a much cheaper price?

#3 Seth Stohs

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:09 PM

I don't see it. Can't someone like Kennys Vargas take over at a much cheaper price?


Yes. Vargas isn't in Morales's league, but he can be solid for much less.

#4 jokin

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:14 PM

I don't see it. Can't someone like Kennys Vargas take over at a much cheaper price?


I definitely don't see the Twins ponying up for a multi-year deal @ 8 figures$$$/year. But I imagine the Twins like the idea of a veteran Latino mentoring all the young Spanish-first players here and on the way, acting sort of as an additional coach. I could maybe see them offering Kendrys the freed-up Willingham money, but would Boras accept that?, seems doubful.

#5 tobi0040

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:20 PM

I definitely don't see the Twins ponying up for a multi-year deal @ 8 figures$$$/year. But I imagine the Twins like the idea of a veteran Latino mentoring all the young Spanish-first players here and on the way, acting sort of as an additional coach. I could maybe see them offering Kendrys the freed-up Willingham money, but would Boras accept that?, seems doubful.


As they say, Boras only signs when he really, really found the sucker. Look at Mike Pelfrey. Initially signed on a deal where he could rehab here for $6M and showcase himself for other teams. He pitched terrible last year and he found the only sucker that would give Pelfrey 2 years.

Now Morales will sit out and not play, comes back and plays terrible and wants a long term deal because he "loves it here". Here we go again.

#6 mike wants wins

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:25 PM

Please no. They need the future, not the past. Please, no.
Lighten up Francis....

#7 jokin

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:27 PM

Please no. They need the future, not the past. Please, no.


Boras, the walking conflict of interest, because of Pelfrey and Morales might give the Twins a break on extending Meyer down the road.

#8 Kwak

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:32 PM

The reason Morales "likes it here" translates to "no winning team has interest in me". Twins got burned on Pelfrey, Ryan should learn from that painful lesson. If the "trade market" for Morales is poor, that is a clear indication no one else wants him at anything close to this hugely generous contract he has with the Twins. Trade Morales and at the worst Mauer returns to 1B with Willingham/Colabello/Arcia/Parmalee filling the three positions of LF, RF, and DH.

#9 mike wants wins

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:35 PM

Arcia and Vargas deserve a shot at DH/1B/RF (for Arcia). At some point, if your strategy is to build through the farm system, you actually need to use the farm system and trust the young guys.
Lighten up Francis....

#10 tobi0040

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:38 PM

The reason Morales "likes it here" translates to "no winning team has interest in me". Twins got burned on Pelfrey, Ryan should learn from that painful lesson. If the "trade market" for Morales is poor, that is a clear indication no one else wants him at anything close to this hugely generous contract he has with the Twins. Trade Morales and at the worst Mauer returns to 1B with Willingham/Colabello/Arcia/Parmalee filling the three positions of LF, RF, and DH.


Boras's wiki site lists seven players as his key clients. If you constructed a list of the 10 or 15 worst long term contracts of the last 10 years, he would have five players among those seven listed.

A-Rod, Zito, Prince Fielder, Jayson Werth, and Magglio (his last dealw as pretty bad). Please, lose his number Terry.

#11 nicksaviking

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:41 PM

I wish Wolfson would have pressed to see if he was talking about a mid-season deal or an off-season deal. Because if it was a mid-season deal, that's very un-Boras like and I'd have to give him credit on not pushing his cash-grab agenda on the player.

I'm not interested in a mid-season, or off-season deal, but I can appreciate the unexpected, even if I anticipate this to be a ploy not in the Twins best interest.

#12 Dman

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:47 PM

Morales just isn't a long term fit for this club. Even if his salary was low I wouldn't want him. We need at bats for the young guys. I really think Morales is going to need to play better to get more than another one year deal from anyone. I would rather overpay for Suzuki than bring Morales back on Multi year deal.

#13 twinsfan34

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 02:52 PM

In addition to being mostly a DH limitations...not much value added at 1B there.

But is he even seen as a clubhouse guy? (If so, I don't know that he is)

He doesn't look like the most fit guy. And thus the 'follow me' or 'train with me' type as the other guy who someone other players want to be like type. Also, I would think you'd want a Cuban/Latin player (much like David Ortiz) who's as equally affective at speaking English as Spanish.

Morales speaks through an interpreter:

Man, listening to that interview again...to sign Morales...Terry Ryan..."The Pohlad's were kind enough to try to free up some money to allow us to make this move."

Like wow...I have a lot of respect for Terry Ryan (may not be shared by many), but I'd love to see him with many of the freedoms that other GMs have.

But I'm with the youth movement. DH is a nice place to keep a guy here in the bigs, getting at bats and being around MLB guys if he isn't necessarily good in the field. Candidates include Josmil Pinto, who I believe would have hit better had been consistently in the lineup. Vargas, as others mentioned is an option. Arcia is a guy who's looked a lot better in RF, but he's also a guy who when (if) he gets his pitch recognition act together, could need some time at the DH role.

I don't know who all is going to be back, but of the guys who I am pretty sure will be back for 2015 of the position players, they are:

C: Pinto
1B: Mauer
2B: Dozier
3B: Plouffe
SS: Santana
LF:
CF: Hicks
RF: Arcia

7 guys...

Replaceable/Utility Guys:
IF: Escobar, Nunez
OF: Parmalee, Colabello

My guess is Escobar and Nunez stick.

Likely gone: Willingham, Morales, Fuld

Possible extensions: Suzuki


Possible farm additions:
1B/DH Vargas
2B/LF Rosario
3B Sano

So basically going to need some FA's to come in...especially at the OF spot(s) unless Rosario, Hicks, and Arcia can make them believers before Opening Day 2015.

#14 jokin

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 03:01 PM

In addition to being mostly a DH limitations...not much value added at 1B there.

But is he even seen as a clubhouse guy? (If so, I don't know that he is)

He doesn't look like the most fit guy. And thus the 'follow me' or 'train with me' type as the other guy who someone other players want to be like type. Also, I would think you'd want a Cuban/Latin player (much like David Ortiz) who's as equally affective at speaking English as Spanish.

Morales speaks through an interpreter:

Man, listening to that interview again...to sign Morales...Terry Ryan..."The Pohlad's were kind enough to try to free up some money to allow us to make this move."

Like wow...I have a lot of respect for Terry Ryan (may not be shared by many), but I'd love to see him with many of the freedoms that other GMs have.

But I'm with the youth movement. DH is a nice place to keep a guy here in the bigs, getting at bats and being around MLB guys if he isn't necessarily good in the field. Candidates include Josmil Pinto, who I believe would have hit better had been consistently in the lineup. Vargas, as others mentioned is an option. Arcia is a guy who's looked a lot better in RF, but he's also a guy who when (if) he gets his pitch recognition act together, could need some time at the DH role.

I don't know who all is going to be back, but of the guys who I am pretty sure will be back for 2015 of the position players, they are:

C: Pinto
1B: Mauer
2B: Dozier
3B: Plouffe
SS: Santana
LF:
CF: Hicks
RF: Arcia

7 guys...

Replaceable/Utility Guys:
IF: Escobar, Nunez
OF: Parmalee, Colabello

My guess is Escobar and Nunez stick.

Likely gone: Willingham, Morales, Fuld

Possible extensions: Suzuki


Possible farm additions:
1B/DH Vargas
2B/LF Rosario
3B Sano

So basically going to need some FA's to come in...especially at the OF spot(s) unless Rosario, Hicks, and Arcia can make them believers before Opening Day 2015.


You're pretty optimistic on Hicks. Right now he's in AA and deferring in CF to Eddie Rosario at times. I gotta think the Twins will need to see quite a bit more from Hicks in 2014 before they hand him back the CF spot to start out the season for the 3rd year in a row.

#15 jokin

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 03:02 PM

Boras's wiki site lists seven players as his key clients. If you constructed a list of the 10 or 15 worst long term contracts of the last 10 years, he would have five players among those seven listed.

A-Rod, Zito, Prince Fielder, Jayson Werth, and Magglio (his last dealw as pretty bad). Please, lose his number Terry.


Ryan has to keep it for Meyer or become a better flipper.

#16 old nurse

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 03:16 PM

Vargas is at AA, has yet to play AAA. If there is not a promotion soon I would doubt Vargas would make the team to start 2015. Where does the power bats on the team come from. There are no proven bats, only "I hope" bats. I hope Arcia, Plouffe and Pinto can hit for power, but nothing is yet foreseeable for next year.

#17 TheLeviathan

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 03:22 PM

Since an extension certainly means more than one year.......no. Please no.

#18 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 03:50 PM

The reason Morales "likes it here" translates to "no winning team has interest in me".


Or maybe he just likes it here. He wouldn't be the first player to talk up how much he likes the Twins clubhouse.

But no, Morales is not a good fit going forward. I'm glad he likes it here but with Arcia, Pinto, Mauer, and Vargas, there isn't much room for another plodder on this roster.

#19 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 04:15 PM

Morales (and Willingham) needs to be traded or released ASAP in order to make regular playing time for Santana and Parmelee and others. just an opinion.

#20 jaimedude2

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 04:50 PM

I like Morales and hope he plays more first base with Mauer out a little longer but there is a caveat to that. I want him to play more first base so he get's in better game shape and starts hitting more so the Twins can trade and flip him for something even maybe in August if the July trade deadline does not work out. He may be a decent mentor to the younger spanish speaking guys, but this team is built on a little smoke and mirrors. There is no way that Suzuki and Corriea are going to sustain there current levels of success and even a young guy like Santanna is going to tail off more as they see more of him and get more of a book on him. Once they start busting him inside more, Santanna is going to struggle more when there is more of a book on him.
Dozier is streaky and he blows hot and cold, with the holes in center field and lack of starting pitching depth, this team has that look about them that they will not contend, you do not have two major holes in your rotation in this day, suck in center field, and majorly streaky offense and stay in it for the long haul. I just don't see the Twins promoting Meyer and May and them being the lights out guys we hope for in a short amount of time. If the team contends for being even and playing 500 ball that will be a huge improvement.

You cannot offer him Morales a qualifying offer so holding on to him until the end of the season makes no sense if the Twins stay out of it which will likely be the trend with this inconsistent bunch. What are the chances he signs an extension for two years at 7.5 million, not likely he still sees himself as a double 10 + million a year guy when really Morales is not that anymore.

Vargas to me is clearly not ready for major league pitching, the kid may have put on a show in batting practice but you can tell he has a bit of a long loopy swing like so many raw prospects do in the minors. Watch some New Britian games if you get a chance or catch even the game cast. You can tell where the pitchers work him that he struggles with breaking pitches as many young guys do.
Right now he has a slow reaction to recognizing breaking pitches and his hands are not the quickest through the zone right now resulting in a longer swing.

Defensively Vargas is going to have to drop about 20 pounds, work on his footwork at first base and shorten his swing if he is ever going to be a big leaguer, he is too bulky in his upper body. Right now he cannot even foul off a curve ball much, let alone other nasty breaking pitches like splitters and sliders. The guy can pummel fast balls all day, pitches with movement not so much. Vargas is no where near major league ready. I give the kid credit though, even though he has stuff to work on, his hard work and staying with it attitude at least give him a chance to be a big leaguer and a decent prospect, a couple years ago most would not have even thought he had a chance. You can tell he works hard and has the want to for getting to the big leagues. He has a shot to make it if he can shorten his swing and get in better shape.

Edited by jaimedude2, 14 July 2014 - 04:59 PM.


#21 TheLeviathan

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 04:52 PM

Vargas isn't the guy Morales would be blocking next year, it'd likely be some combination of Pinto/Arcia/Mauer. At least until September or so.

Which is why Morales makes no sense since he likely wouldn't sign for only one year. Plus...what's he done so far to make us want him back at this point?

#22 Guest_USAFChief_*

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 07:11 PM

Just turned 31, lifetime .800 OPS switch hitter. Money isn't an issue for the club. Mauer isn't exactly an iron man, Morales can play some first when needed.

I think there's room for that over the next few years. If...IF...Vargas needs a place to play at some point, there might be a conflict. That's a big if.

I know I am in the minority, but Waiting around for the minor leagues to provide everything needed to be a WS contender holds zero interest for me.

#23 DocBauer

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 07:22 PM

I am NOT a fan of Boras! I understand his objective to make the most money for his players, and thusly, for himself. And I suppose in the long run, he's accomplished goals often. But he has also burned several of his clients in the past with his advice and projections. And I'm also surprised at some of the contracts he has suckered teams in to. No, I don't think Pelfrey's deal qualifies under that umbrella. It's only 2 years, not for that much in proper context, and the Twins truly thought they were getting an even more healthy and rebounding Pelfrey for 2 years, based on last year. And it's actually kind of surprising that Ryan and Boras seem to have a healthy relationship. I hope that bodes well for the future, especially in regard to Meyer. But this all a bit of digression on my part.

Here is where I get raked over the coals! I know it's coming. But unabashedly, I print my stance, and the reasons behind it.

I am in favor of re-signing Morales.

My reasons are very simple. The Twins have one of the best farm systems in all of baseball, seem to be loaded to the gills with talented prospects at almost all positions. And I am as excited as anyone as to the possible futures of these talented youngsters and the, hopefully soon, future of the Twins.

But it taking just a small step back, I'm also a realist. Buxton and Sano were both slowed this season. This affects the OF, the INF, and possible combinations to come. Example: Plouffe maybe moving to the OF. Willingham is gone at seasons end, if not before. We're uncertain at LF and CF to begin next season. I think Vargas in an excellent prospect. And his talent, production and work ethic, all echoed by Tom Kelley, speak to his future. And he's a perfect fit for DH and a backup to Mauer. But he's also young, has yet to hit AAA, and may not be ready to start 2015. Rosario is loaded with talent, but is still getting on track. Hopefully, Hicks is also getting on track, with a believer/supporter in Rod Carew of all people.

But to think the Twins will march in to 2015 with Buxton, Sano, Vargas, Rosario and Hicks all ready to assume a starting/primary role in the lineup is naive. A) we need to plug guys in to the daily lineup to not only have a chance to win, but to also promote a winning attitude/possibility B) it doesn't hurt to have at least a couple quality, productive veterans for the youngsters to work with and learn from.

Yes Morales has been a bit of a disappointment so far, which might bring his cost down, but he practically crawled out of bed/golf cart when he joined the Twins. He's also been getting in to a groove lately. He's also been a proven producer when healthy, and could be a nice influence for many of the Twins young Latin players.

Now, maybe he's a jerk and a bad clubhouse guy, though I've never heard anything to suggest this. And maybe he and Boras will try to parlay a DH with a so-so 2014 in to a big and long term deal. Under any of these circumstances, I say NO WAY. I'll take my chances elsewhere.

But something fair dollar-wise, 1-3 years, or options involved, I'm all in. He fits the heart of the lineup with a proven, veteran producer, who can also be moved at a higher value with more time put in.

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#24 DocBauer

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 07:32 PM

Just turned 31, lifetime .800 OPS switch hitter. Money isn't an issue for the club. Mauer isn't exactly an iron man, Morales can play some first when needed.

I think there's room for that over the next few years. If...IF...Vargas needs a place to play at some point, there might be a conflict. That's a big if.

I know I am in the minority, but Waiting around for the minor leagues to provide everything needed to be a WS contender holds zero interest for me.


Also what chief said. And still young 30's. Honestly, where is the downside here?

If everyone is healthy and playing even close to their potential, let's say the lineup is:

1) Santana=CF/ and or SS
2) Dozier= 2B
3) Mauer=1B
4) ?
5) ?
6) ?

Arcia and Plouffe could definitely be part of that. But isn't a solid veteran bat or two mixed in there a better alternative while waiting for Sano, Buxton and Vargas to arrive?

"Nice catch Hayes...don't ever f*****g do it again."

 

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#25 TheLeviathan

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 08:01 PM

Also what chief said. And still young 30's. Honestly, where is the downside here?


Doesn't that depend heavily on the years and dollars?

Guys that are basically 1B/DHs are not the hardest guys to find. Especially not if you want to pay them 10+ million a year.

#26 twinsnorth49

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 08:27 PM

Arcia and Plouffe could definitely be part of that. But isn't a solid veteran bat or two mixed in there a better alternative while waiting for Sano, Buxton and Vargas to arrive?


Sure, as long as he's gone by the 2015 deadline I think he has value. That value over 2 years gets greatly reduced if he has a poor first half next year though. Ideally they get him for 1 more, unlikely Boras goes for that however.

#27 drjim

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 08:30 PM

Just turned 31, lifetime .800 OPS switch hitter. Money isn't an issue for the club. Mauer isn't exactly an iron man, Morales can play some first when needed.

I think there's room for that over the next few years. If...IF...Vargas needs a place to play at some point, there might be a conflict. That's a big if.

I know I am in the minority, but Waiting around for the minor leagues to provide everything needed to be a WS contender holds zero interest for me.


I'm generally on board with this. I don't think you can count on Vargas being anywhere near the lineup on opening day next year.

My question would be what they truly think of Pinto. If no chance he can catch then I wouldn't want to lock in a 1B and DH for next year (with also the possibility of Sano ending there). If Pinto can catch, or at least part time catch, then I would be all over this for a year, possibly two, if the money was right.
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#28 LewFordLives

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 08:46 PM

Was just watching Morneau in the Home Run Derby. It makes me both sad and angry. I find it ironic that an offense starved team like the Twins didn't feel the need to find a spot for a fan favorite like Morneau, yet a year later we are paying Kendrys Morales $3 million more for only a half-season to fill basically the same roll Morneau would have filled (and not doing it nearly as well).

I would say absolutely no way to extending Morales, but I wouldn't put anything past the Twins front office. I thought the same thing about Pelfrey.

#29 Kwak

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 08:47 PM

Rather than signing Morales (who I classify as underwhelming) why not seek a younger power hitter who is also a competent OF? Extending Willingham makes no sense. Combine the annual salaries of Morales and Willingham and the Twins can definately sign an outstanding OF! There has been way too much money spent on hole-pluggers. Use FA money for real talent and plug holes from within the franchise.

#30 Guest_USAFChief_*

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Posted 14 July 2014 - 09:05 PM

Rather than signing Morales (who I classify as underwhelming) why not seek a younger power hitter who is also a competent OF? Extending Willingham makes no sense. Combine the annual salaries of Morales and Willingham and the Twins can definately sign an outstanding OF! There has been way too much money spent on hole-pluggers. Use FA money for real talent and plug holes from within the franchise.

Got a name in mind?

The list of 2015 free agent OFers/DHswho are younger than Morales: Melky Cabrera, Delmon Young, possibly Colby Rasmus, Tyler Colvin, probably Billy Butler. If you add those roughly the same age: Jeff Francour, Chris Young, Nick Shierholz, probably Nic Markakis, possibly Denard Span.

Which of those is likely to be a better hitter than Morales?

I agree with Lev that the terms matter, but I certainly wouldn't dismiss out of hand the idea that Morales can be an asset going forward.