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Article: Twins Minor League Report (07/08): Alex Meyer Shines, Mike Kvasnicka Glows

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#1 Eric R Pleiss

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 09:15 AM

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.co...Kvasnicka-Glows

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#2 Possumlad

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:07 AM

Wanting "more consistency" from our minor-league starters is an infuriating, nonsensical double-standard. The only of our major-leaugers who've been "consistent" have been "consistently bad." (Phil Hughes has been the most consistently good, but even he has had a recent run of mediocre to poor outings, until yesterday).

Even great pitchers have ups & downs, that's simply the nature of of the job. Of course consistency is great if you can get it, but it needn't be a pre-requisite if the overall body of work is very strong.

I remember someone around here doing a piece earlier this year regarding how few major-league pitchers (even the best of the best) are consistent over long stretches.

The only caveat here is that we don't know exactly the type of consistency that Antony is talking about. If he's talking about consistently in results, then my points above stand. If he means that Meyer is having trouble using a consistent motion, arm angle, or some other mechanical issue, then I suppose it could be justified. My sense, however, is that they're simply talking about results.

#3 gunnarthor

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:16 AM

Nice to see Hicks heating up. I hope he gets to AAA sometime this season.

#4 tobi0040

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:19 AM

Wanting "more consistency" from our minor-league starters is an infuriating, nonsensical double-standard. The only of our major-leaugers who've been "consistent" have been "consistently bad." (Phil Hughes has been the most consistently good, but even he has had a recent run of mediocre to poor outings, until yesterday).

Even great pitchers have ups & downs, that's simply the nature of of the job. Of course consistency is great if you can get it, but it needn't be a pre-requisite if the overall body of work is very strong.

I remember someone around here doing a piece earlier this year regarding how few major-league pitchers (even the best of the best) are consistent over long stretches.

The only caveat here is that we don't know exactly the type of consistency that Antony is talking about. If he's talking about consistently in results, then my points above stand. If he means that Meyer is having trouble using a consistent motion, arm angle, or some other mechanical issue, then I suppose it could be justified. My sense, however, is that they're simply talking about results.


The only thing I can make sense of these comments and why Meyer is still in AAA would be either the futures game, or they are waiting until next June. Both make zero sense to me.

The next playoff team has Alex Meyer starting game 1. Let's get his feet wet.

#5 SDFan

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:28 AM

It's nice to see Hicks hitting well at AA. I haven't given up on him at all. I hope the organization hasn't.

#6 jokin

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:31 AM

The only thing I can make sense of these comments and

why
Meyer is still in AAA would be either the futures game,

or they are waiting until next June. Both make zero sense to me.

The next playoff team has Alex Meyer starting game 1. Let's get his feet wet.


The reason for holding him back definitely isn't the Futures Game, Meyer was the second choice for that spot, behind May (actually the third choice, behind the originally-chosen Cardinals pitcher who was promoted).

The only recent encouragement to suggest a possible acceleration of this go-slow process is the fact that besides this being the 3rd straight effective outing, Meyer now is apparently allowed an expanded pitch count. But unfortunately, now sitting at nearly 90 innings, Meyer only has another 50-60 innings left- max. That's about 9 starts, which means a shut-down by around the end of the third week in August if he remains in a starting role.

Perhaps there's a smidgen of hope that a roster spot is cleared for Meyer by a trade or two in the next week? Maybe, but I'll stand by my prediction in May that we don't see Meyer until June 2015.

Edited by jokin, 09 July 2014 - 10:44 AM.


#7 Eric R Pleiss

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:38 AM

I don't think anyone has given up on Hicks, but the expectations are now back where they should have been after a strong AA season in 2012, not the sky high expectations after strong 2013 Spring Training (and trading away all other CF options) that saw him as the Opening Day CF the last two years. Twins will have to move him up before too long, once Buxton is back at full speed he'll be at AA, forcing Twins to do something with Hicks.

#8 drjim

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:40 AM

Wanting "more consistency" from our minor-league starters is an infuriating, nonsensical double-standard. The only of our major-leaugers who've been "consistent" have been "consistently bad." (Phil Hughes has been the most consistently good, but even he has had a recent run of mediocre to poor outings, until yesterday).

Even great pitchers have ups & downs, that's simply the nature of of the job. Of course consistency is great if you can get it, but it needn't be a pre-requisite if the overall body of work is very strong.

I remember someone around here doing a piece earlier this year regarding how few major-league pitchers (even the best of the best) are consistent over long stretches.

The only caveat here is that we don't know exactly the type of consistency that Antony is talking about. If he's talking about consistently in results, then my points above stand. If he means that Meyer is having trouble using a consistent motion, arm angle, or some other mechanical issue, then I suppose it could be justified. My sense, however, is that they're simply talking about results.


I think comparing the minor leaguer to current major league roster is somewhat of a mistake. Half the rotation is not going to stand in the way of Meyer when he is ready.

The two things he has to improve are fastball command and the development of a usable third pitch. Things that work in AAA don't necessarily work in the majors, and certainly won't lead to long term success. Meyer has the potential to be a front of the rotation guy, but won't get there until he cleans these two things up. There is good reason to be patient.

The debate of course is whether this development is best done in the majors or in AAA. As a fan I surely want to see him at Target Field, but perhaps that is not the most prudent course of action.
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#9 Eric R Pleiss

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:41 AM

Agreed, Meyer has been consistent, and deserving of a promotion. Same for Trevor May. Meyer is not on 40 man roster yet, so I'd think that May has the lead for next man up, potentially when Twins realize that Eric Fryer is a waste of space on the roster and Twins call up pitcher after ASG. Then Fryer comes off 40 man and Meyer could potentially take his spot when Twins are ready.
Or maybe Edgar Ibarra could come off, he's been struggling this year and hasn't really made progress since being moved to the bullpen two-three years ago.

#10 Possumlad

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 10:44 AM

I think comparing the minor leaguer to current major league roster is somewhat of a mistake. Half the rotation is not going to stand in the way of Meyer when he is ready.

The two things he has to improve are fastball command and the development of a usable third pitch. Things that work in AAA don't necessarily work in the majors, and certainly won't lead to long term success. Meyer has the potential to be a front of the rotation guy, but won't get there until he cleans these two things up. There is good reason to be patient.

The debate of course is whether this development is best done in the majors or in AAA. As a fan I surely want to see him at Target Field, but perhaps that is not the most prudent course of action.


Agreed on all points. To be clear, I'm more than fine with keeping Meyer down if the purpose is to "improve fastball command and the develop a third a pitch." My only issue is the Twins continued, bizarre insistence on general "consistency." If he needs to improve fastball command and work on a third pitch, just say that.

#11 mike wants wins

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 11:19 AM

I'd like Meyer up for a taste, so that when they NEED him next year, he's a bit used to MLB parks.

#12 drjim

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 11:34 AM

Agreed on all points. To be clear, I'm more than fine with keeping Meyer down if the purpose is to "improve fastball command and the develop a third a pitch." My only issue is the Twins continued, bizarre insistence on general "consistency." If he needs to improve fastball command and work on a third pitch, just say that.


As a general rule I don't get caught up in specific words that are used and tie myself in knots trying to decipher everything that is said. I think "show more consistency" is short hand for continue to do the things he needs to work on.

Meyer has been plenty good but it's not like he has ripped off 10 dominate starts in a row. He certainly has things to improve upon.
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#13 drjim

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 11:39 AM

I'd like Meyer up for a taste, so that when they NEED him next year, he's a bit used to MLB parks.


I personally agree with you and think he would be a great candidate to spend a couple of months in the bullpen to end the season.

However, with innings restrictions going into next year it is probably pretty unlikely he could start from day 1 in the rotation and last the entire season, so he will either have to spend time in the bullpen or AAA, so that would be just as effective in easing him in.

It is a fun thing to debate but there is certainly wisdom in both methods.
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#14 Wyorev

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 12:05 PM

99 pitches, 4 walks, 2 runs, in 6 innings in AAA doesn't scream out to me - "put me in coach."
At the same time - the 10 strikeouts are sure fun. . .

#15 jokin

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 12:19 PM

99 pitches, 4 walks, 2 runs, in 6 innings in AAA doesn't scream out to me - "put me in coach."
At the same time - the 10 strikeouts are sure fun. . .


...and the International League-leading K/9 of 10.4 and K% of 27%, along with ranking 5th in H/9 @ 7.55 are at least whispering "let me show you what I got, coach."

Edited by jokin, 09 July 2014 - 12:32 PM.


#16 kdrupp09

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 12:37 PM

...and the International League-leading K/9 of 10.4 and K% of 27%, along with ranking 5th in H/9 @ 7.55 are at least whispering "let me show you what I got, coach."


Those stats are pretty eye popping. It does kind of give the "let me show you something" vibe.

#17 tobi0040

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 12:50 PM

Maybe, but I'll stand by my prediction in May that we don't see Meyer until June 2015.


I hope you are very, very wrong here but I can't lay down any money on this one. We probably want to see Pino get more starts, May, Kris Johsnon, see what we have in Scott Diamond, etc.

#18 oldguy10

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 12:51 PM

And how many years down the road will that playoff team be that Meyer will be the starting pitcher in? May I hazard a guess - 2018 and that is being charitable. That also predicates that Meyer will be the Twins best starter from their current crop of young pitchers, I posit perhaps Berrios or Stewart instead.

#19 Seth Stohs

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 01:03 PM

I think it's a little silly to say that Meyer is absolutely ready for the big leagues. He was great in April, and mediocre in May and not very good in June. He's been alright the last three outings, though his walk rate is not good.

I think they should get him up this year too, but it's not a travesty at all that he isn't up yet.

#20 mike wants wins

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Posted 09 July 2014 - 01:15 PM

Who said he is ready? IMO, he should be brought up to learn more about how ready he is, both the twins and Meyer need that learning.