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Mauer and Emotion

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#21 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:09 AM

Not so far this year.


He has an .815 OPS with men on base this year. A .751 OPS with RISP.

His OPS for the year is .704.

Statistical white noise that doesn't mean anything. Joe's problem is his overall line, not how he's hitting with men on base or RISP.

#22 LimestoneBaggy

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:21 AM

Never mind that our pitching is below average, that most of the lineup is below average, that our outfield defense reminds me of that "Delmon Young on Ice" show I brought my kids to last week, that we've had less power hitting in the month of May than the collective efforts of Jason Tyner and Ben Revere [subtracting one recent hit], that we've had shortstops in the outfield and minor league filler at shortstop.... but if Mauer would show some enthusiasm, boy howdy would that turn this team around....

Edited by LimestoneBaggy, 30 May 2014 - 07:31 AM.
Stupid Brock, always pointing out my flaws

I will one day successfully sneak onto the Sportive Podcast, and have nothing intelligent to say or add to the conversation.

 

"In order to have a testimony, you have to have a test." Teddy Bridgewater


#23 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:26 AM

we have shortstops in the outfield and minor league filler at shortstop


It's pretty hard to complain about what Escobar has been doing at short. I'm very skeptical that it will continue but hey, at least he's doing well in the short-term.

#24 LimestoneBaggy

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:29 AM

It's pretty hard to complain about what Escobar has been doing at short. I'm very skeptical that it will continue but hey, at least he's doing well in the short-term.


You are 100% correct on this. I am very pleased that Escobar has received an opportunity to take the position and run with it. I was directing that more toward Florimon's inability to hit the ball and Nunez being Nunez. While I'm at it, I'll exclude Santana from my rant as well.

I will one day successfully sneak onto the Sportive Podcast, and have nothing intelligent to say or add to the conversation.

 

"In order to have a testimony, you have to have a test." Teddy Bridgewater


#25 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:33 AM

I was directing that more toward Florimon's inability to hit the ball


Something the Twins should have noticed in August of last year but... Water under the bridge at this point, I suppose.

#26 Mike Sixel

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:39 AM

My oldest son is an introvert. When given a leadership role, he is awesome. But he does not seek them out. He prefers to do what he does well, and not be the center of attention. A large portion of the population is like him, including my wife. I think, from what you can see, most athletes are not that way. But, I am pretty sure Joe is. And as long as he gets on base, I guess I don't care if he's a great leader.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#27 tobi0040

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:41 AM

I'm with gunn on this. I've never bought into the "you need to scream and yell" argument. I don't think a guy reaches the majors by needing the artificial motivation of cussing out a teammate to play well.



I agree. I am guessing nobody on our team prepares and watches tape on the opposing pitchers like Mauer. Watching that preparation on a daily basis does more to inspire teammates than breaking a bat over his knee, or taking out his frustration on another player or ump.

How come nobody ever brings up the fact that every young baseball player in this state looks up to Joe and his lack of antics and off the field issues is a great example for them?

#28 Mike Sixel

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:45 AM

I don't agree with the general premise, that I think being espoused, that the team does NOT need some kind of emotional leader. Every team needs that, sports or business. Someone needs to set the tone and lead. I don't know that we know if players get more out of watching Mauer prepare than they would if he was a more vocal leader. We just don't know that.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#29 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:47 AM

I don't know that we know if players get more out of watching Mauer prepare than they would if he was a more vocal leader. We just don't know that.


I think that's kind of the point. Why make an argument that you wish a guy was different without having any sort of evidence that it would actually improve the situation?

When faced with a complete lack of evidence that what he does is right or wrong, I believe the right decision is to just let a guy be himself.

#30 Mike Sixel

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:50 AM

I think that was the point of my first post, Brock.

I don't know, it is a site to discuss sports, not airline safety.....maybe we should take it less seriously?


#31 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:52 AM

Fair enough.

I simply do not understand the "Mauer needs more fire" argument. These are professional athletes playing at the highest level of the sport. If they didn't know how to bring their own personal fire, they never would have made it here in the first place.

These guys are better at their job than anyone on this forum. They are competing at the highest level. We'd all have to be CEOs of our respective companies to be considered their peer group.

So my opinion is "let them be themselves". MLB players are not a middle school basketball team.

#32 LimestoneBaggy

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 07:59 AM

Fair enough.

These guys are better at their job than anyone on this forum.


I started to write a joke about you not knowing what I do for a living, and thus you can't possibly evaluate this position...and then I remembered I'm at work right now writing forum comments, and that's when I became my own joke.

I will one day successfully sneak onto the Sportive Podcast, and have nothing intelligent to say or add to the conversation.

 

"In order to have a testimony, you have to have a test." Teddy Bridgewater


#33 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 08:03 AM

I started to write a joke about you not knowing what I do for a living, and thus you can't possibly evaluate this position...and then I remembered I'm at work right now writing forum comments, and that's when I became my own joke.


And thus, the trap is set.

#34 JB_Iowa

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 08:09 AM

He has an .815 OPS with men on base this year. A .751 OPS with RISP.

His OPS for the year is .704.

Statistical white noise that doesn't mean anything. Joe's problem is his overall line, not how he's hitting with men on base or RISP.



Actually, in comparing 2014 to his career stats, his hitting with RISP is off significantly this year.

I'm a little confused about how bref shows it but here are a couple of lines:

2014 BA/OBP/SLG/OPS
RISP 32 games .189/.373/.378/.751
..... 46 games .279/.310/.315/.626 (this is the line I don't get - what is ....)

Career 877 gms .329/.452/.477/.928
,.... 1155 gms .311/.374/.460/.834


Anyway you look at it, it's a pretty significant dropoff.

It is human nature to remember the failures -- especially the failures in the late innings.

There is a lot of cause for concern about Mauer -- just not much any of us can do about it.

#35 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 08:14 AM

Actually, in comparing 2014 to his career stats, his hitting with RISP is off significantly this year.


Absolutely. My point is that his RISP and MoB lines are better than his overall 2014 stat line, which tells me one thing:

Joe's problem is his 2014 stat line. It's that simple. RISP and MoB numbers normalize over time to match what the player does overall.

#36 Westgaard66

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 10:31 AM

Joe's problem is his 2014 stat line. It's that simple. RISP and MoB numbers normalize over time to match what the player does overall.



Its not that simple. I did not type OBA w/ RISP. OBA with RISP is great and all, but walks don't drive in runs unless the bases are jacked.

This season he has struck out or walked in 24 of his 49 plate appearances with RISP. Last season he struck out or walked in 45 of 110.

In 2012 he struck or or walked in 62 of 170 PAs w/RISP

So since April 2013, in damn near HALF of his Plate appearances, mauer didn't even put the ball in play.

(Props to anyone who can find a way to see how many double plays he hit into with RISP since the start of last season. )



Back to my original post. I typed "when the game is on the line."

guess how many game winning RBI has this season? I know MLB doesn't recognize that stat anymore, but just take a guess.......








Zero....(318 MLBers have more than him)

Guess how many he had last season?
2...... (304 had more than he did)

In 2012?
11.....(43 had more than he did)

In summary and in my opinion, Mauer has not been clutch for the better part of a season. Teams have adapted to his approach to hitting in order to minimize the amount of damage he can do. They know how to pitch to him so he doesn't put the ball in play in nearly half of his PAs w/ RISP because he either walks (which buoys his OBA w/ RISP) or strikes out. Honestly, basically averaging 1 for 3 w/ a walk per game is great for his BA & OBA stats, but when that "1" occurs will determine whether he is clutch or not.

I bet if #7 was at his 2012 numbers, many would be questioning his "emotion" or even his approach to hitting.


if it's possible, I would really like to see a breakdown of Mauer's batting average, OBA and runs driven in by inning.....


(for the record....this response got typed up before I read Parker's article on Mauer's struggles, which I found to be a great read, but needed to put some of the onus for change in approach on #7 himself)

Edited by Westgaard66, 30 May 2014 - 10:48 AM.


#37 Pius Jefferson

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 02:19 PM

Not so far this year.



He wasn't great with RISP last season either.

#38 longstrangetrip

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 02:28 PM

I agree. I am guessing nobody on our team prepares and watches tape on the opposing pitchers like Mauer. Watching that preparation on a daily basis does more to inspire teammates than breaking a bat over his knee, or taking out his frustration on another player or ump.


How come nobody ever brings up the fact that every young baseball player in this state looks up to Joe and his lack of antics and off the field issues is a great example for them?


If Joe watches more tape than anyone else, wouldn't he notice that 88% of the time he's taking the first pitch...and often it's the fattest pitch of the at bat? And wouldn't he then adjust to that? Don't players watch tape in order to find ways to improve?

Whoops, I think I may be in the wrong thread...

#39 Beezer07

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 03:23 PM

Westgaaard: If I remember correctly, "Game Winning RBI" just means "who drove in the run that ended up being the last run necessary to win the game," right? So if you win 9-0, whoever got the first RBI gets the game winning RBI. Or if the other team came back to lose 8-9, whoever drove in that 9th run gets the Game Winning RBI. Pretty terrible way to judge how someone performs with the "game on the line," in my opinion.

Now, in true Internet fashion, I'm going to leave without offering a better way to judge someone in the clutch. Although I'll say I don't believe there is such a thing as a "clutch" baseball player.

#40 Westgaard66

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 09:57 PM

Yes that is what the stat represented, but I am willing to bet it was a very small %.

I wish I knew how to dig into stats more. I would like to see his BA the last two seasons w/ RISP in innings 6-9



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