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Article: Twins Drop Burroughs. But Why?

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#1 Nick Nelson

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:21 PM

You can view the page at http://www.twinsdail...rroughs-But-Why

#2 Thrylos

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:26 PM

Why? I never understood how: a. he made the team over others b. was kept on the team instead of Hughes. He was a rally killer with the bat (proved that last night too) several times. He was past the Mendoza line and even past the Butera line. There is a 40-man roster spot open now so another IF might be on the way up. Carroll (whose numbers are more like those of a UT IF) can back 3rd (or Plouffe) if needed. This is correcting a couple mistakes. And the Twins are full of LH hitters. Don't need another one esp. if he cannot hit his weight.

#3 Alex

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:36 PM

Why? I never understood how: a. he made the team over others b. was kept on the team instead of Hughes.

He was a rally killer with the bat (proved that last night too) several times. He was past the Mendoza line and even past the Butera line. There is a 40-man roster spot open now so another IF might be on the way up. Carroll (whose numbers are more like those of a UT IF) can back 3rd (or Plouffe) if needed. This is correcting a couple mistakes. And the Twins are full of LH hitters. Don't need another one esp. if he cannot hit his weight.


I mentioned this in the other thread, but Burroughs had 18 PA, 6 of which were pinch hits. Not really a test of a player's worth, especially if they thought he was good enough to make the roster in the first place. All that you say (not needing a lefty, and needing another IF) could have been accomplished in a different manner and when the Twins didn't have such a short bench already, especially when replaced with Butera.

#4 Thrylos

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:37 PM

I mentioned this in the other thread, but Burroughs had 18 PA, 6 of which were pinch hits. Not really a test of a player's worth, especially if they thought he was good enough to make the roster in the first place.


You can use the same reasoning about Revere and Hughes...
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#5 mhanson93

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:40 PM

Why? I never understood how: a. he made the team over others b. was kept on the team instead of Hughes.

He was a rally killer with the bat (proved that last night too) several times. He was past the Mendoza line and even past the Butera line. There is a 40-man roster spot open now so another IF might be on the way up. Carroll (whose numbers are more like those of a UT IF) can back 3rd (or Plouffe) if needed. This is correcting a couple mistakes. And the Twins are full of LH hitters. Don't need another one esp. if he cannot hit his weight.


Agreed. Nick, you are way overestimating Burroughs' value. No big loss here.

#6 Seth Stohs

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:42 PM

I actually agree with both of you. Burroughs served little purpose on the roster, other than being left-handed. But the pattern and DL usage and mentioned by Nick is 100% accurate. That said, if Morneau is able to play on Friday or Saturday (guessing not likely), then it was the right decision not to DL him... however, I still would have taken a pitcher off the 25 (and possibly 40) man roster. The Twins were already at 39, I believe.

#7 Alex

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:42 PM

You can use the same reasoning about Revere and Hughes...


Not really, I think both of those situations are different. Hughes was out of options but had been in the organization for awhile. Revere isn't really close to the same argument because I think it was clear the point of him playing at AAA was to get him ABs every day. This theory was supported when they picked Clete Thomas up off of waivers.

Edited by Alex, 01 May 2012 - 06:44 PM.


#8 mike wants wins

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:42 PM

No problem for me. I'm told Butera will go back down in a day or two (hahahahahahaha), and with Burroughs off the roster, we should see a young guy that can actually contribute (in the future, if not this year) come up and get experience.

#9 Thrylos

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:50 PM

I'm told Butera will go back down in a day or two (hahahahahahaha),.


I bet that Gardy will get fired before Butera goes down...
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#10 Nick Nelson

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:50 PM

Why? I never understood how: a. he made the team over others b. was kept on the team instead of Hughes.

OK, well whether or not you understood either of those things, they both happened. If you're going to stick with the guy for that long, why not give him more than 18 plate appearances and three starts to show what he can do? Pretty neat that you've determined he's a "rally killer" based on 10 at-bats with men on base.

I'm not really sure I believe Clete Thomas is more valuable than Burroughs, but the principal point is that there was no need to even choose between them. Keep them both and keep the team at full strength. If the Twins medical staff says Morneau is good to go in three days, do you trust them?

#11 Nick Nelson

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:53 PM

Also, it's interesting that some folks seem to be OK with the move based on the fact that Carroll can play third if needed. Great, you can take the team's best IF defender away from shortstop and put him at a position where he becomes an even bigger offensive liability than Valencia.

#12 Dark Kinetic-Grip

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 06:57 PM

I would not mind at all if they picked up Luke Hughes again. Burroughs should have gone in the first place.

#13 AT4MVP

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 07:10 PM

Burroughs has two hits I believe, and none of the at bats I've seen him take have been good. He is overly aggressive. I know for a fact that one of hits was also an infield single. I attended the game when we were rallying against the Red Sox, and the Twins batted around in the inning we scored five runs. Everyone had hit the ball hard and had good at-bats. Burroughs meanwhile, accounted for ALL THREE OUTS. He led off the inning, and struck out swinging. Then he came up again that inning with the bases loaded, and grounded into a double play. I am not a huge Butera fan and would much rather have liked to see Jeff Gray get DFAd, but I don't think there's any reason to be scratching your heads over this move. I specifically remember Gardy saying after Burroughs made the team that he felt Burroughs "was a guy who could come off the bench and give him a big league, veteran at-bat." Well, sorry to tell you Gardy, I never saw that this year.

#14 stringer bell

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 07:31 PM

While it isn't fair to judge Burroughs on 18 plate appearances, I don't think anyone will claim him and he'll have a chance to go to Rochester and get some at-bats and perhaps return to the team later in the season. I don't know how severe Mauer's injury is, but as long as Butera stays away from the field, it isn't that important. The bench is short for the rest of the Angels series, but they'll have enough pitchers and there aren't that many who could be hit for.

#15 one_eyed_jack

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 07:33 PM

What this all comes down to is that this team has zero depth beyond it's preferred lineup of 9. Absolutely none. Debating the relative merits of Burroughs, Hughes, Butera, Clete, etc. is akin to picking out the best smelling turd in a steaming pile of crap. Not one of these guys should be allowed in an MLB park without buying a ticket like the rest of us. It's a pretty sad statement with where things are when you start looking at pulling Jose Lopez off the Cleveland scrap heap as an appealing move.

#16 mnfireman

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:00 PM

Gardy is re-making the roster in his own image, he just can't talk Ryan into cutting Plouffe for Revere yet. Then the bench will be GREAT... Thomas, Butera, Revere...oh my.

#17 spideyo

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:16 PM

Yeah, cause Plouffe has been a HUGE asset off the bench. In 20 PA's over 6 games, Revere actually has one more hit than Plouffe does in his 40 PA's over 13 games.

#18 jorgenswest

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:25 PM

It is hard to trust the Twins assessment. Burroughs - He has the same ability and skill today as he did opening day. They could have sent him to Rochester without putting him on the 40 at the end of spring. They assessed he was worthy of a spot on the 25 and 40 and now risk losing him. Did the management fail to assess his ability a month ago or have they failed now? Butera - Butera's ability to hit has not changed in 4 weeks. There may be a need if Mauer can't catch right now. Howver, when Mauer is healthy Butera should be returned to AAA. If he remains, were the Twins incorrect in their assessment about his ability to contribute from the bench a month ago or are they incorrect now? 13 pitchers - Tonight they have one option on the bench. Trevor Plouffe. Inexcusable. Weren't some encouraged by the bench to open the season? Asset management - We will argue the value of Hughes and Burroughs to the organization. The Twins either mistakenly valued these assests or poorly mismanaged them.

#19 tcarlic

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:29 PM

Good, that dude sucked. How many times did he had runners on and didn't get a hit? Good, no need for him to be on the team. Is Plouffe the next to go?

#20 mike wants wins

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 08:29 PM

They are just awful at roster management, nothing has changed with Smith gone. I'm more convinced than ever that Smith wasn't calling the shots the last few years. NOTHING has changed in their approach, which should not be surprising, not one person in the FO is not homegrown....

What I just typed is probably an opinion, not a fact. I mean, I'm usually right, so you should maybe assume it is or will be a fact soon, but that's up to you. :) Also, I am NOT trying to convince anyone I am correct, I'm just talking here, not arguing.