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Article: Rotation Reinforcements Waiting in the (Red) Wings

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#1 Nick Nelson

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 09:43 PM

You can view the page at http://www.twinsdail...the-(Red)-Wings

#2 Brandon

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 10:25 PM

That does make me feel better about the rotation this year. If Deduno moves to the rotation and Burton is either hurt or in a prolonged slump, who gets the next call to the pen? There's Guerrier and Pressly and who else Tonkin is already up.

#3 Seth Stohs

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 10:34 PM

That does make me feel better about the rotation this year. If Deduno moves to the rotation and Burton is either hurt or in a prolonged slump, who gets the next call to the pen? There's Guerrier and Pressly and who else Tonkin is already up.


Guerrier, Hoffman, Guerra, Thompson. There are some solid bullpen options in AAA now.

I also think that Deduno is just fine in the role he's in. Aside from his first outing, he's been very solid.

#4 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 10:34 PM

That'd be a real shot in the arm if May suddenly figured it out and stopped walking people.

#5 Parker Hageman

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 11:02 PM

[COLOR=#3E3E3E]That'd be a real shot in the arm if May suddenly figured it out and stopped walking people.[/COLOR]


Just two in his first 9.2 innings. Big step for May.

#6 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 11:12 PM

Just two in his first 9.2 innings. Big step for May.


Yep, and after a cursory glance, it appears that he's missin' lots and lots of bats.

#7 clutterheart

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 11:27 PM

Just two in his first 9.2 innings. Big step for May.


Right, he is a fly ball pitcher with a propensity for the HR balls. Keeping guys off base is needed. I would like to his his Batting Ave Against go down, its not terrible now, but not great

#8 Buck Nasty

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 04:40 AM

[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Aside fromMeyer – I don’t think they are any better than a year ago. Here are their career minor #’s: (Age)ERA/WHIP/K9[/COLOR][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]May (24): 4.07/1.36/10.73[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Johnson(29): 4.38/1.46/6.36[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Darnell(25): 4.04/1.35/6.22[/COLOR][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Versus[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hendricks(25): 2.94/1.09/7.54[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hernandez(25): 4.00/1.34/6.86[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Albers (28): 2.86/1.18/7.45[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000] [/COLOR][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3][COLOR=#000000][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]I'd say Johnson/Darnell are a push to Hernandez/Albers. Let's be honest - none of those guys are anything to get too excited about. May vs. Hendricks....May certainly has a better arm, but Hendricks had better overall results in the minors and a quicker track to the majors. Remember, Hendricks was a top ten (team) prospect in 2011 and 2012 and then "poof" he was considered a bust at age 24 (same age as May is now). [/FONT][/COLOR]

#9 kblack1011

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 05:41 AM

[FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Aside fromMeyer – I don’t think they are any better than a year ago. Here are their career minor #’s: (Age)ERA/WHIP/K9[/COLOR][/FONT]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]May (24): 4.07/1.36/10.73[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Johnson(29): 4.38/1.46/6.36[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Darnell(25): 4.04/1.35/6.22[/COLOR][/FONT]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Versus[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hendricks(25): 2.94/1.09/7.54[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hernandez(25): 4.00/1.34/6.86[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Albers (28): 2.86/1.18/7.45[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]I'd say Johnson/Darnell are a push to Hernandez/Albers. Let's be honest - none of those guys are anything to get too excited about. May vs. Hendricks....May certainly has a better arm, but Hendricks had better overall results in the minors and a quicker track to the majors. Remember, Hendricks was a top ten (team) prospect in 2011 and 2012 and then "poof" he was considered a bust at age 24 (same age as May is now). [/FONT][/COLOR]


Good reminder of what a crapshoot prospects are, but I think these prospects are rated higher overall then Hendricks and the Twins minor league talent is higher than when Hendricks was in the system. So a top ten prospect 3-4 years ago probably is more like a low 20 in the current system.

#10 Thrylos

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 05:46 AM

Guerrier, Hoffman, Guerra, Thompson. There are some solid bullpen options in AAA now.

I also think that Deduno is just fine in the role he's in. Aside from his first outing, he's been very solid.


I would add Yohan Pino's name to the list. He was very impressive Saturday night.
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#11 mike wants wins

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:19 AM

I'd guess Tonkin is somehow mysteriously in AAA at some point again, so he's a contingency for when their other RP fail.....I agree, the SP depth is 100x better right now. Still not sold on May, but still hopeful.

#12 Brandon

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:42 AM

Guerrier, Hoffman, Guerra, Thompson. There are some solid bullpen options in AAA now.

I also think that Deduno is just fine in the role he's in. Aside from his first outing, he's been very solid.


I agree Deduno is fine where he is at in the pen. I think he is still a good starter too and an option to be a 6th or 7th starter. So if he goes to the rotation and Burton continues to be ineffective then another bullpen arm is needed which was all I was trying to communicate with a scenario and see who everyone thought would be a contender to move up.

#13 Brandon

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:44 AM

[FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Aside fromMeyer – I don’t think they are any better than a year ago. Here are their career minor #’s: (Age)ERA/WHIP/K9[/COLOR][/FONT]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]May (24): 4.07/1.36/10.73[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Johnson(29): 4.38/1.46/6.36[/FONT][/COLOR]
[FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Darnell(25): 4.04/1.35/6.22[/COLOR][/FONT]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Versus[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hendricks(25): 2.94/1.09/7.54[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Hernandez(25): 4.00/1.34/6.86[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]Albers (28): 2.86/1.18/7.45[/FONT][/COLOR]

[COLOR=#000000][FONT=Calibri]I'd say Johnson/Darnell are a push to Hernandez/Albers. Let's be honest - none of those guys are anything to get too excited about. May vs. Hendricks....May certainly has a better arm, but Hendricks had better overall results in the minors and a quicker track to the majors. Remember, Hendricks was a top ten (team) prospect in 2011 and 2012 and then "poof" he was considered a bust at age 24 (same age as May is now). [/FONT][/COLOR]


We have 8 potential starters before a drop off of potential. That's pretty impressive. The 8 are the 5 starting now plus Deduno, Meyer, and May.

#14 Marta Shearing

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 07:49 AM

I'd give Pelfrey one more start to see if he can pitch 6 innings. If he fails, swap him with Sam. You perform or you lose your job. Im sick of the long leashes Twins players get. Trade Correia ASAP.

Would love to see Meyer by June, and Trevor May soon after. The Pelfrey signing is mystifying.

#15 Sconnie

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 08:28 AM

We have 8 potential starters before a drop off of potential. That's pretty impressive. The 8 are the 5 starting now plus Deduno, Meyer, and May.

Compared with 3 at the break of ST last year, I'd say the Twins are looking better at pitching this year... Does it make you wonder how the starting rotation conversation went last Spring Training?

Gardy: well we went out and got the Vanimal and Corrieasy, they should be pretty good, we still have Diamondsy, he should be pretty good. I'm hopeful Pelf can come back from Tommy John. Who else do you have in the rotation for me Terry?
TR: Well we have these 5 guys that are AAA filler, take your pick.
Gardy: I guess since Deduno manages to miss a steel barn with magenetic baseballs, we'll roll with DeVriesy and Hendricksy, who throw watermelons down the middle of the strike zone. I don't want that Deduno kid unless I'm desperate. Besides, what could go wrong?

#16 tobi0040

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 08:46 AM

We have 8 potential starters before a drop off of potential. That's pretty impressive. The 8 are the 5 starting now plus Deduno, Meyer, and May.


We certainly have more depth, and that is a good thing. Last year Deduno would not have been in the pen. But I am more excited about the quality, not the quantity.

Nolasco, Hughes, and Gibson are good pitchers and in my eyes none is a #5 starter. And of course you have Meyer who is more talented then them all. He is hands down the best pitching prospect we have brought up since 2006. Then before that 2003.

#17 Sconnie

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 08:49 AM

I'd give Pelfrey one more start to see if he can pitch 6 innings. If he fails, swap him with Sam. You perform or you lose your job. Im sick of the long leashes Twins players get. Trade Correia ASAP.

Would love to see Meyer by June, and Trevor May soon after. The Pelfrey signing is mystifying.

Last year, there wasn't a choice on the long leashes in the rotation. You take your lumps when you have zero MLB caliber pitching. After watching the horrid pitching last year, I have no problem holding on to the three best pitchers from last years rotation, even if they are less than ideal. The Pelfrey signing made perfect sense, he was the best second half pitcher on the team. Granted, terrible rotation, but the devil you know is better than the devil you don't. The last thing TR wanted to do, was roll into ST with no depth again. So far Correia had been less than stellar, but effective. I have no problem with Pelf or Correia yet. I agree that I would like to see Meyer and May in the rotation, possibly this season, when they are ready. Correia and Pelfrey are relatively cheap and effective insurance that gives the team the luxury of allowing Meyer and May to mature before coming up.

#18 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:04 PM

On a team that has been finishing 30 games below .500, here we have a pitcher who has been winning half his starts and is fun as heck to watch while doing it! So I guess I see why Deduno was cast into the bullpen because of the signings, though I don't agree. I'd like to see him get first crack, followed by May, followed by whoever / hoping it doesn't come to that.

#19 tobi0040

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:18 PM

On a team that has been finishing 30 games below .500, here we have a pitcher who has been winning half his starts and is fun as heck to watch while doing it! So I guess I see why Deduno was cast into the bullpen because of the signings, though I don't agree. I'd like to see him get first crack, followed by May, followed by whoever / hoping it doesn't come to that.



In my humble opinion, when the super 2 deadline passes in June, Meyer should be up here and bump the most inneffective between Pelfrey and KC. If they are both pitching well, trade one.

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#20 Lefty

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:28 PM

On a team that has been finishing 30 games below .500, here we have a pitcher who has been winning half his starts and is fun as heck to watch while doing it! So I guess I see why Deduno was cast into the bullpen because of the signings, though I don't agree. I'd like to see him get first crack, followed by May, followed by whoever / hoping it doesn't come to that.



I agree with you Hosken. Why has Deduno not been given more chances to start? He has won games and seems to have legit stuff. Maybe Gardy and Andy don't think that he pitches to contact well enough?!? I was high on Pelfrey to start out the season thinking he's two years removed from TJ, but I'm one or two more train-wreck starts away from hopping off that train. I'm okay with Correia, Gibson, Hughes, and Nolasco at this point, but lets get Deduno a start and see what he can do. I'd love to see Meyer/May up at some point too, but lets see who else gets derailed first.

#21 Lefty

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:43 PM

We have 8 potential starters before a drop off of potential. That's pretty impressive. The 8 are the 5 starting now plus Deduno, Meyer, and May.



I guess I just can't get that excited. Drop off of potential? I don't find it impressive to have a starting rotation of #5 starters and 3 guys in the minors who for some reason haven't beat them out yet. The Twins have to find a new way to evaluate pitching talent, whether through the draft, trades, or free agency. We haven't produced a pitcher for a loooooong time. Gibson is getting there, and I hope he stays on an upward path.

Average pitching depth is not impressive. Two or three studs at the top of the rotation are. ACES win games in the playoffs boys, not sub-par pitching depth.

#22 jimbo92107

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:48 PM

Right, he is a fly ball pitcher with a propensity for the HR balls. Keeping guys off base is needed. I would like to his his Batting Ave Against go down, its not terrible now, but not great


Fly ball pitcher. Good grief, why does a major league baseball team want a pitcher whose stuff winds up going over people's heads? Is there no way Tevor May can throw a pitch that results in a grounder? Or do they plan to use him in short relief after several innings of Gibson's sinkers, hoping for a bunch of pop-ups?

#23 jimbo92107

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 12:51 PM

That does make me feel better about the rotation this year. If Deduno moves to the rotation and Burton is either hurt or in a prolonged slump, who gets the next call to the pen? There's Guerrier and Pressly and who else Tonkin is already up.


How fleeting is fame. Has everybody forgotten about Ryan "Elvis" Pressly? Last year they were talking about him like a Trevor May type developmental prospect. Great stuff, lacks polish. Seems to me Pressly should be on the list of possibles, at least as likely as Trevor May.

#24 jimbo92107

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 01:01 PM

We have 8 potential starters before a drop off of potential. That's pretty impressive. The 8 are the 5 starting now plus Deduno, Meyer, and May.


Of the three you listed, May is the most likely to implode, given his prior reputation for shaky control. Deduno isn't a precision pitcher either, but he misses bats better than any other Twins starter, and he manages to work around his walks.

Luckily there's no reason right now to make any changes. The starters are showing signs of life. Gibson looks like a young horse, Correia looked good in his latest, Pelfrey is gradually finding himself, Nolasco is a bulldog, and Hughes needs to mix it up a little better. I'd still consider swapping one of these guys, maybe Hughes, with Deduno, just so the staff doesn't look too similar.

#25 S.

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 02:18 PM

Pelfrey is gradually finding himself.

If by finding himself, you mean finding his way to a demotion, than yes, he is doing a pretty good job.

#26 drivlikejehu

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 02:41 PM

The Twins have one of the worst rotations in MLB. The notion there is "depth" makes no sense at all. Pretty much every team has "depth" in terms of AAAA players, and even if they didn't the waiver wire offers up that level of talent regularly.

In Rochester the Twins have Meyer, who didn't throw many innings last year and is deserving of some caution, and May, a gopher-prone pitcher with subpar command who was mediocre for 2 years in AA. Johnson and Darnell could maybe pitch some middle relief, but don't provide real rotation depth.

#27 Mr. Ed

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 02:51 PM

How much longer before Diamond is cut loose? Getting bombed again today in Rochester, 5 runs/10 hits before he got an out in the 4th inning.

#28 Mr. Ed

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 02:52 PM

7 runs 11 hits in 4 innings. blech.

#29 longstrangetrip

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 03:09 PM

It seems to me that Phil Hughes is given way too much slack in this forum and others that I follow, and should be on a shorter leash than Pelfrey and Correia. He hasn't won a game since last July, was terrible the last half of 2013 (6.65 ERA), and has come out of the box this year with 3 bad starts. Last year the Vanimal was given 10 starts before being demoted...way too many in my opinion, but necessary due to our poor depth. With Deduno miscast in the bullpen, Hughes should be given no more than 6 starts this year to figure it out. If he is still struggling after that, he needs a ticket to Rochester to try to regain form.

#30 Mr. Ed

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Posted 16 April 2014 - 03:17 PM

Hughes is too awesome. Take away his bad innings and he's the stud the Twins want. Unfortunately, he has too many bad innings.