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Thread: Dear Trevor Plouffe

  1. #21
    Senior Member Triple-A Thegrin's Avatar
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    When Plouffe comes to bat, do you hope? do you pay close attention ? I don't. Paying close attention means to be usually disappointed. If he does something good, fine, but I don't expect it or anticipate it or hope for it. He is ranked 30th of all the 3rd basemen in the Yahoo Fantasy Baseball Leagues. He is a place holder until Sano gets here. Plouffe is a player I would rather not think about.

  2. #22
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHtwins View Post
    There are still at least 10 spots maybe 15 on the roster that are in worse shape than starting 3rd baseman.

    What about Plouffe just pisses everyone off?

    I still dont get it. So he is in the bottom 1/4 of 3rd baseman even...so what, the starting staff is much worse, the only position above that threshold is Catcher, SS and 2B. There are 4 relievers above replacement level. Like I said there are much bigger fish to fry yet Plouffe just gets cooked here almost daily.
    Some others handled this, but to put it succinctly - he represents lost opportunity. He was one of the guys we had to hope took a step forward and he didn't. That's going to make his failures hurt a bit more.

  3. #23
    Even if this supposed lack of hustle exists (which I dont really buy btw) so what? This is a team that started the false hustle of Nick Punto for huge swaths of time and endured Danny Valencia. Id say Plouffe is a refreshing change. He actually looks like a major league capable hitter in the box most of the time.

    As far as unrewarded promise...thats largely a load of BS too. He was never a very highly touted prospect while coming up. He was a high draft pick yes....but a pick that was questionable and widely criticized. He turned out better than I thought he would 4 years ago.

    So he sucks...but his level of suckitude isnt even in the top half of general roster suckiness.

    I'm more pissed about the multimillion dollar back-up catcher that cant catch and hasnt hit either and the multi-million dollar outfielder that is hitting .210 and cant really field either.

  4. #24
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHtwins View Post
    He actually looks like a major league capable hitter in the box most of the time.
    Actually, "most" of the time he doesn't. He just goes on some really good short stretches to keep himself alive as a starter. There simply isn't a statistic in existence that verifies this claim. (Unless you revise it to say - "he actually looks like a major league capable hitter when he's in the box against lefties")

    He was a high draft pick yes....but a pick that was questionable and widely criticized. He turned out better than I thought he would 4 years ago.
    He was a first round pick. If your first round pick doesn't have promise - it was a bad pick. But his promise also stems from his herculian stretch last year too. So yes, there was reason to hope he could become a viable part of the team as a starter. He has completely obliterated that notion this year.

    Your entire premise is flawed. Just because there is a lot going wrong doesn't minimize that he's one of the parts going wrong. No one is claiming Plouffe sunk the 2013 season. No one is making him the "Most Wanted" criminal for dashing our hopes. No one is saying our Albert Pujols in the making went David McCarthy.

    People are just irked that this guy that tantalized them with hope now infuriates them with every inept play and at-bat. It's perfectly justifiable.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    gainst lefties")





    Your entire premise is flawed. Just because there is a lot going wrong doesn't minimize that he's one of the parts going wrong. No one is claiming Plouffe sunk the 2013 season. No one is making him the "Most Wanted" criminal for dashing our hopes. No one is saying our Albert Pujols in the making went David McCarthy.
    Problem is....he is exactly that to a lot of people here. There are at least a half a dozen or more threads directly related to Plouffe. He just gets savaged all the time here. It makes no sense.

    No matter how many paragraphs you write....there is absolutely no objective reason for all the angst.

    Like so many threads and discussions here...its a lost cause because too many people write about feelings not actual results. Something about Plouffe besides his results pisses people off and I just flat dont get it. I' say similar things on JJ Hardy as well. There was a lot of inbred angst about his supposed lack of caring whilst he was here as well.

    Plouffe aint the problem, has never really been the problem, has performed pretty much exactly how you would expect a limited talent toolsy high school shortstop would if not perhaps better. He was never a particularly great prospect. He graduated the Appy with a .719 OPS and that was his high point until repeating AA. He wasnt on any BA list coming up. If you took a poll of people who actually know what their talking about 5 years ago and you'd have a hard time finding a majority that would have thought he would contribute at all.

  6. #26
    Senior Member All-Star
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    All of this is the randomness of small sample size. It takes nearly a full season for OPS to stabilize. The wider variation that Plouffe has shown in monthly splits isn't meaningful. He isn't as good as his best monthly split or as poor as his worst.

    Taking as whole you get a guy who hits a little above the median team production for 3Bs while fielding poorly. At his age, both can get a little better and rank in the middle of third basemen.

  7. #27
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BHtwins View Post
    Problem is....he is exactly that to a lot of people here. There are at least a half a dozen or more threads directly related to Plouffe. He just gets savaged all the time here. It makes no sense.
    There are many more threads about Pelfrey, Correia, and others. A half dozen threads about one of the team's biggest disappointments does not speak to your point. In fact, it speaks contrary to it. I'm surprised there isn't more frustration with his erratic waste of a season.

    As to what I quoted - there is no "objective" reason for anyone to feel anything about Plouffe. You included. There is no magic formula that objectively proves an opinion and that insinuation, I think, is part of why you are (as you said) confused by this.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by big dog View Post
    Nope, back at ya.

    Plouffe's "good 3 months" were quite a bit less than that, at least if you look at games played. He played 3 weeks in May, 2 weeks in June, and 2 weeks so far in Sept. So I'll take April, July, and August. That's 13 weeks. 7 good weeks out of 20 is pretty close to 1 out of 3, whether the unit is months or weeks.

    When he's hot, he's hot. And when he's not...
    April .217/.304/.377/.681
    July .189/.223/.300/.523
    August .196/.264/.330/.594

    July and August are not a slump. They are a disaster.
    69 ABs in April, 65 in May before he went to the DL and 53 in June, so actually your comparison of month to month is somewhat faulty. And I would be the first to state that Plouffe is wildly erratic at the plate- which is why I pointed out his hot/cold history in 2013, which mirrors his past career performance, which also makes it highly problematic that he will be around for long, possibly moved in the offseason to avoid arbitration.

    Yes, Plouffe had an awful July, but consider these numbers for July:

    Plouffe: .189/.223/.300

    Manny Machado: .196/.226/.314 (ranked #4 in WAR @ 3B)
    Evan Longoria: .194/.288/.347 (ranked #3 in WAR @ 3B)

    or August:

    Plouffe: .196/.264/.330

    Kyle Seager: .194/.303/.340 (ranked #7 in WAR @ 3B)
    Todd Frazier: .180/.247/.337 (ranked #8 in WAR @ 3B)

    The above 4 counter-examples show that even the best in the game have disastrous months. Plouffe isn't one of the best in the game and close monitoring and intervention is necessary to both maximize his value and prevent him from hurting the team when he's clearly struggling. I suggested previously what a more creative team might do with him, accentuate what he is very good at (kills lefties/can possibly move into a super-utility role), and minimize and tweak in the areas where he has a history of struggling mightily- ie, tough RHPs and prolonged slumps being two of his major weaknesses (Danny Valencia has earned himself strong consideration for continuing his specialist role with the Orioles in 2014, what with his .1063 OPS against lefties this year, for his career, Valencia's slash against lefties is strikingly similar to Plouffe's, with a .517 SLG and .884 OPS, compared to Plouffe: .505 SLG and .856 OPS).
    Last edited by jokin; 09-17-2013 at 01:14 AM.

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