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Thread: Skipping High-A: Buxton?

  1. #21
    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Like I said, let him get to Ft. Myers and see how that goes. If he's Trout-like, he'll hit like he in Cedar Rapids. IF he's like 99% of really good prospects, he'll need a little bit of time to adjust. I'd love to see him get to AA for a couple of weeks in August. I just try not to get ahead of myself. Harper and Trout and Machado are incredibly rare. I hope Buxton fits into that category! But, I expect him to struggle at some point.

  2. #22
    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    And, there's nothing wrong with him spending one more week in Cedar Rapids. One week makes pretty much zero difference. However, those guys have been together for 2 1/2 months, and they're on the cusp of winning the first half title. It's a speck on the radar in the big picture of Buxton's career. It likely means omething to him and his teammates though.

  3. #23
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    It would make even less sense to promote Buxton with only a couple of games left in the Miracle's first half, where they've already clinched. What, just so he can sit around for the days over the FSL's AllStar break? The Kernels have six games left and a razor thin lead for their first half Division title. It's not going to retard Buxton's progress by having him stick around 1 week and maybe even let him have the reward of playing in the MWL AllStar game (which honor he certainly earned).

    People act like a week or two at one level or another is going to keep the guy from wearing a Twins uniform for a decade.

    His play, once he's in the FSL, will dictate his advancement. Frankly, whether he plays a couple of weeks in NB at the end of the year or simply starts there next April, he's going to get to Minnesota (or not) based on what he does next year, not this year.

    Covering the Cedar Rapids Kernels for
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    Is their precedence for skipping High-A in this organization, or any other? The idea of getting Sano, Rosario, and Buxton around each other seems particularly palatable to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by SD Buhr View Post

    His play, once he's in the FSL, will dictate his advancement. Frankly, whether he plays a couple of weeks in NB at the end of the year or simply starts there next April, he's going to get to Minnesota (or not) based on what he does next year, not this year.


    Bryce Harper went directly from A to AA in-season. His OPS dropped from .973 in A ball, to .724 in AA- his HR power disappearing altogether---The following year, 2012, he played 21 games in AAA, batting .243/.325/.365/.690, none of which of these developments dissuaded the Nats from installing Harper at age 19 into the starting ML lineup- mostly in CF.
    Last edited by jokin; 06-11-2013 at 02:54 PM.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD Buhr View Post
    It would make even less sense to promote Buxton with only a couple of games left in the Miracle's first half, where they've already clinched. What, just so he can sit around for the days over the FSL's AllStar break? The Kernels have six games left and a razor thin lead for their first half Division title. It's not going to retard Buxton's progress by having him stick around 1 week and maybe even let him have the reward of playing in the MWL AllStar game (which honor he certainly earned).

    People act like a week or two at one level or another is going to keep the guy from wearing a Twins uniform for a decade.

    His play, once he's in the FSL, will dictate his advancement. Frankly, whether he plays a couple of weeks in NB at the end of the year or simply starts there next April, he's going to get to Minnesota (or not) based on what he does next year, not this year.
    In fairness, it is only a week or two now....3 weeks ago, it was a month. And we don't know if he goes up after the break, we are guessing. And, that has nothing to do with his ability, so he's not progressing based on his talent, but on a low-A title that has no impact on him or the Twins long term.

    All we want is for him to move up when he's ready, and not wait for artificial reasons.
    Lighten up Francis....

  6. #26
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    Bryce Harper also played a year of juco ball before he was drafted which, while not exactly the SEC, was a higher level of competition than rural high school ball in Georgia.

    They may be "artificial" reasons to you, mike. But it's not artificial at all in the real world of affiliated minor league baseball. If you think affiliate relations aren't important, you really weren't paying attention last summer/fall when the affiliation merry-go-round was happening, especially in the MWL.

    Minor league teams can't afford to lose money at the gate the way MLB teams can. There's no multi-billion dollar broadcast rights cash to fall back on. If a MLB team completely ignores the needs of their affiliates, they end up having their players play in Burlington and Beloit instead of Cedar Rapids and Quad Cities (you can ask the Angels about that, trust me). If you think that doesn't matter to organizations, you haven't been to each of those facilities or talked to the people who've had to call those clubhouses their "home."

    The Twins have to provide Jake Mauer with 25 able bodies to field a team, too. That's obviously not as easy as it might sound, given the stretches he's had to cobble together a team with a roster 2-3 guys short of a full roster already this season.

    The Twins have a way they do these things and it's unlikely they're going to change now. They made a big deal last year about how they kept Sano at low-A for a full season. To have moved Buxton up after just 3-4 weeks because he was off to a fast start, that would have caused an immediate chill in what has otherwise been a very warm start to the Twins/CR Ownership relationship. And there's no assurance it would have been the best move for Buxton, either.

    I think anyone who thinks Buxton, Walker, Hicks, Harrison, Williams, Melotakis, Gruver and everyone else who's posted a decent first half are all about to move to Ft Myers together is probably going to be disappointed. I'm guessing it will be no more than 3 guys and I won't be at all surprised if Buxton goes alone (remember, they've already promoted three pitchers).

    Covering the Cedar Rapids Kernels for
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  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    In fairness, it is only a week or two now....3 weeks ago, it was a month. And we don't know if he goes up after the break, we are guessing. And, that has nothing to do with his ability, so he's not progressing based on his talent, but on a low-A title that has no impact on him or the Twins long term.

    All we want is for him to move up when he's ready, and not wait for artificial reasons.
    Gibson, Sano, Buxton, same old, same old. The All-Star game gambit is only the latest artificiality.

  8. #28
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    Affiliate relations are important, but are you saying only promoting 1 player would hurt those? And should they keep him in FTM for playoffs, to help them? Then next year, should NBs happiness take precedent over MN? Sometimes, you do things differently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    Gibson, Sano, Buxton, same old, same old. The All-Star game gambit is only the latest artificiality.
    Maybe I'm getting baited in here, but what's your point? Is it your point that you generally think the Twins are too conservative, or is it your point that you believe Buxton is a Trout/Harper/Machado? They moved him up two levels last year, and it looks like the same for this year. Seems pretty bullish to me.

  10. #30
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    "Take precedent over MN?" No.

    But do the Twins strike you as an organization that reacts to things on a week-to-week basis? Seems to me, they set up a plan for their players and pretty much stick to those plans.

    Should they keep Buxton in FtM for the playoffs? Maybe. A lot of factors go in to that decision. Certainly more than just "what is Buxton's OPS the last couple weeks?" That's my point. Affiliate relations are not THE MOST important thing, but they are important. To expect otherwise is not realistic.

    Covering the Cedar Rapids Kernels for
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  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by LimestoneBaggy View Post
    Maybe I'm getting baited in here, but what's your point? Is it your point that you generally think the Twins are too conservative, or is it your point that you believe Buxton is a Trout/Harper/Machado? They moved him up two levels last year, and it looks like the same for this year. Seems pretty bullish to me.
    See my post above, re: Bryce Harper. Also see my thread about Buxton and the Trout Timeline. I am convinced that Buck is the real deal, by the stat test, in-person eyewitness test and by the scout/pundit evaluation test. To continue with the Twins traditional conservative approach and constant excuse-making on the slow-play gambit, is, in this case, and also with Sano, patently absurd.

  12. #32
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    And I think sometimes, you need to change your plan. Well, actually, since I do strategic planning for a living, I know you need to change plans often.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike wants wins View Post
    Affiliate relations are important, but are you saying only promoting 1 player would hurt those? And should they keep him in FTM for playoffs, to help them? Then next year, should NBs happiness take precedent over MN? Sometimes, you do things differently.
    In this case, and the Sano case, the situation demands that you do things differently. They aren't kicking the door in to be promoted, yesterday, rather, they are both employing the nuclear option to door removal. Other organizations get this, why not here?

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I doubt the Twins want to put Buxton and Sano on the same arbitration schedule. With the recent promotions, Sano, Rosario and Meyer could be timing things a little awkwardly for the Twins as it is.
    The only way thats a problem is if they both are what we hope they might be. I expect Sano will be more like the Twins version of David Ortiz then the Red Sox version, and Buxton will probably be more like Torii Hunter then Ken Griffey Jr. We're still very early in development and so far they really haven't done much that Todd Walker or David McCarty didn't do. If they both pan out Target Field will sell out and when they finally make the big bucks we will be on a new TV deal (please bring back the Victory sports concept!!!). Superstars get paid the rest of the roster gets traded or let go to make it work.

  15. #35
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    I would argue that for the Twins to promote a high school position player mid-season (twice, actually... last year and this year) constitutes an adjustment in their normal plans for that kind of player.

    Covering the Cedar Rapids Kernels for
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  16. #36
    Twins Moderator MVP Riverbrian's Avatar
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    I hope the Twins Front Office promotes Byron Buxton and Miguel Sano with absolute perfect timing. Just like Goldilocks... Not too Soon... Not too slow but just right. And keep the flipping bears away at the same time.
    A Skeleton walks into a bar and says... "Give me a beer... And a mop".

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokin View Post
    See my post above, re: Bryce Harper. Also see my thread about Buxton and the Trout Timeline. I am convinced that Buck is the real deal, by the stat test, in-person eyewitness test and by the scout/pundit evaluation test. To continue with the Twins traditional conservative approach and constant excuse-making on the slow-play gambit, is, in this case, and also with Sano, patently absurd.
    I don't see the approach the Twins have taken with Buxton as overly conservative at this point. Frankly, I want to see him tear up each level for a time prior to a promotion (I'm okay with a two levels a year). Sano's maximum value is at third, and he needed to work on his defense and swinging strike rate. He's shown he's better at both now; promote him. Buxton showed he mastered the level; promote him. Why is earning the promotion at each level and protecting the investment patently absurd?

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverbrian View Post
    I hope the Twins Front Office promotes Byron Buxton and Miguel Sano with absolute perfect timing. Just like Goldilocks... Not too Soon... Not too slow but just right. And keep the flipping bears away at the same time.
    Slow clap for awesomeness.

  19. #39
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    He should move to AA when he is ready. That doesn't mean he has to be ready to dominate. Learning how to deal with struggle is an important part of development. There really should be no other factor. Is he ready?

    Meanwhile looking at offense and defense, he is probably the best option to throw out in CF on the big league club tonight.

  20. #40
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    When you think about it, if he takes the field for the Miracle before the anniversary of the first game he played for the GCL Twins after signing last summer, he will have officially played at FOUR levels of minor league ball in his first full year as a professional (both rookie levels, A, A+) as a teenager. Hard to call that being overly conservative in my book.

    Covering the Cedar Rapids Kernels for
    MetroSportsReport.comwhile my alter-ego, Jim Crikket, opines about the Twins and Kernels at Knuckleballsblog.com.

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