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Thread: Article: I'll Say It

  1. #21
    I have been wondering this for a while, realistically speaking... what can we expect from Chris Parmelee defensively? How will this bode for the overall team defense? Willingham on one side and a first baseman on the other side?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAM DC Twins Fans View Post
    Well, I wont go as far as shooting myself...but I agree Clete Thomas has NO PLACE on a MLB roster--neither does Butera. If Hicks doesnt start in CF and goes to minors--keep Benson as 4th OF until Hicks/Arcia is ready. As for Butera, we can do better,

    I keep hoping for a spring trade to get CF--maybe trade Morneau now and move Parmalee to 1B.

    I do think Twins will win between 75 and 79 games and finish above last in AL Central.
    i also believe Twins finish last in the Central Division but Houston Astros finish with worst record in the American league.. If most of Seth predictions come true Twins finish around 63-99...going to be a dreadful season but interested to see some of the young guys come up

  3. #23
    Twins Contributor All-Star Jeremy Nygaard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mave View Post
    I have been wondering this for a while, realistically speaking... what can we expect from Chris Parmelee defensively? How will this bode for the overall team defense? Willingham on one side and a first baseman on the other side?
    The last time he appeared in BA's Prospect Handbook, here was the summary of his outfield defense:

    With a thick, unathletic body and below-average arm, Parmelee has moved down the defensive spectrum to first base, with occasional stops on the outfield corners.
    So not good...

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremy Nygaard View Post
    The last time he appeared in BA's Prospect Handbook, here was the summary of his outfield defense:

    So not good...
    Yeah, we have two-DH's in the outfield. Can't wait for Arcia's arrival. But we gotta get something good in trade for Morneau first...

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnfanforlife View Post
    Yeah, we have two-DH's in the outfield. Can't wait for Arcia's arrival. But we gotta get something good in trade for Morneau first...
    ...no reason to rush this trade. Maybe you trade Willingham too, and make a solid return for our rebuilding club?

  6. #26
    Twins Moderator All-Star diehardtwinsfan's Avatar
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    I'm strangely very bullish on Deduno. I think he cuts his walk rate to 3BB/9... and if he does...

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnfanforlife View Post
    ...no reason to rush this trade. Maybe you trade Willingham too, and make a solid return for our rebuilding club?
    Willingham has far more value to the Twins in his natural position--DH. I have read at least hundred posts about: Trade Willingham (or Trade Morneau) and it's clear that the Twins FO has also considered those very same options--and rejected the results. Keep Willingham, re-sign him short-term, and provide a bona fide powerhitting run producer from the DH slot. The youth will takeover the OF providing the defense, speed, arms, and (hopefully) enough offense to make things interesting. Mauer catches, Doumit backs him up, (Buh-bye to Drew) because with Josh as full-time DH (spelled by Mauer and Doumit) there is no need for a third catcher. There will be a credible offense--likely well above average if the reports of the young OFs is close to accurate, a big increase in OF defense, and enough power-hitting to push the fast guys around the bases.
    Read the thread on "Bad teams Rebuilding" there is a big need for a few proven veterans--especially with one at DH so he doesn't hurt his team in the field.

  8. #28
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    *The Twins will be sellers at the deadline. Justin Morneau, Josh Willingham and Mike Pelfrey will bid farewell before the end of July.

    I see none of the above. I may be new to the site, but old to posting. I can see no possible reason to trade Morneau. No way possible to get any kind of nearly equal return at all. And trading Willingham isn't going to happen. Both will have big years.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by diehardtwinsfan View Post
    I'm strangely very bullish on Deduno. I think he cuts his walk rate to 3BB/9... and if he does...
    I totally agree, diehard!

  10. #30
    Senior Member Triple-A raindog's Avatar
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    If Morneau has a big year, he will absolutely have value.

    I really hope you are right about Arcia. I can't stomach watching Parmalee in RF for too long.

  11. #31
    Twins News Team All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kwak View Post
    . Keep Willingham,
    I agree. Unless the Twins are blown away by offers for him, keep him. Willingham is likely worth more to the Twins over the next several years than any player they could fetch for him. He's fairly inexpensive, and still has two years on his contract. Morneau is the more palatable trade candidate from the Twins perspective, though I'm not sure what kind of value we can get for him. If Morneau produces this year, I wouldn't mind an extension either.

    I think we should temper our trade expectations for both these guys. Neither of them are necessarily blocking anyone coming up, and they'll help us compete in 2014 and beyond probably more than anything we'll get in return.

    Arcia/Hicks/Parm in the OF, and Morneau/Hammer at 1B/DH for the next several years sounds pretty good to me.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    I think we should temper our trade expectations for both these guys. Neither of them are necessarily blocking anyone coming up, and they'll help us compete in 2014 and beyond probably more than anything we'll get in return.
    It's highly unlikely Willingham is going to be a continuing positive force on the roster beyond 2014. His cost will more than likely increase if he continues to hit this well or his injury riddled past will come back to haunt him as his body ages. Morneau you could be right about, but his concussion history is always a ticking time-bomb that the club is going to have to consider before guaranteeing him anything.

  13. #33
    Twins News Team All-Star PseudoSABR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLeviathan View Post
    It's highly unlikely Willingham is going to be a continuing positive force on the roster beyond 2014. His cost will more than likely increase if he continues to hit this well or his injury riddled past will come back to haunt him as his body ages. Morneau you could be right about, but his concussion history is always a ticking time-bomb that the club is going to have to consider before guaranteeing him anything.
    I think it's likely that Willingham will be a positive force beyond 2014; maybe not to the same degree he was last year or will be this year. But I don't think he'll suddenly have negative value. Of course, I wouldn't think about extending until his contract expires, or he shows continued dominance. That said, Willingham's first full season was as 27 year old, and while he's had injuries he's collected at least 400 PAs every season since then.

    In both cases, the contract matters. I'd go short term deals with vesting thresholds for PAs.

    I just don't want the Twins to sell short on players now because they are losing, when those same players can help bridge the gap to the next core. We might be overpaying to keep them around, but we could also be looking at gaping holes at DH and 1B (esp. if Parm sticks in the OF or busts) as soon as next year. I also don't see them spending similar money on FAs; they are far more likely to spend on their own, imo.

  14. #34
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    The Twins will have plenty of cap space when it comes time to negotiate a new contract for Willingham. As a DH, he's not hurting the team defensively and other teams can more easily evaluate his worth to them for purposes of a trade.

  15. #35
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
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    A pretty good column. I think a lot of the predictions are spot on. Time will tell.

  16. #36
    Twins News Team All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PseudoSABR View Post
    I think it's likely that Willingham will be a positive force beyond 2014; maybe not to the same degree he was last year or will be this year. But I don't think he'll suddenly have negative value. Of course, I wouldn't think about extending until his contract expires, or he shows continued dominance. That said, Willingham's first full season was as 27 year old, and while he's had injuries he's collected at least 400 PAs every season since then.
    Here's the problem I see with that. First - he has had injuries, lots of them, even during his prime. He's coming up to that age threshold when professional players start to break down physically. If he's continuing to be a very productive offensive player, at that age, it's unlikely he's going to want to go year by year. And it's very unlikely he will continue to be "affordable". It's nothing personal with Willingham, I like him as a player a lot, but you're giving up a lot of potential value now (while he IS affordable and productive) in order to keep him around several seasons from now when the odds are far less likely he will be. Given that corner outfield/DH is the most easily replaced positions on the field I think you capitalize on high value now if the market presents that.

    I agree with not selling short, I wouldn't just dump him to dump him. But I think there is reason to believe that he would have trade value for exactly the same reasons you believe he has value to the Twins.

  17. #37
    Twins Moderator All-Star diehardtwinsfan's Avatar
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    I suspect both Willingham and Morneau will be hot commodities at the deadline, and I hope that the Twins pick up a solid middle infielder and another good pitcher as centerpieces for each of them. I also kind of hope that Morneau would resign next offseason and do a DH/1B rotation with Parmalee...

  18. #38
    Real.

  19. #39
    Twins Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mave View Post
    I have been wondering this for a while, realistically speaking... what can we expect from Chris Parmelee defensively?
    You will see the beat writer pull out his thesaurus to look up synonyms for "adequate".

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    Unless there is a player added during spring training , it seems to me that Joe Benson makes the team as the 4th outfielder as long as he is healthy.
    If it comes down to Clete or Benson why not take a chance on a guy who may have more upside?
    Joe already is on the outside looking in as far as Prospects are concerned, so lets give him a chance and see what he does with it?
    Very valid point. Makes sense.

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