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Thread: Liam Hendriks

  1. #21
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    It takes great patience to develop young players. Numerous good pitchers struggled early in the majors. The solution is to let them struggle in the majors once they have shown reasonable success on the way up. Hendriks is not going to learn how to get major league hitters out in AAA.

    The Twins can afford to be patient.

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Let's say that the signings are over!

    Diamond
    Worley
    Correia (I guess)
    Hendriks
    Blackburn/Pelfrey/Deduno/DeVries/Walters

    The fifth starter here is A: holding down the fort for Gibson to join the rotation if the Twins are smart and really limit his AAA innings until June, and B: serving as a replacement in case Correia or Hendriks falters. Correia WILL falter, unfortunately.

    This is bad and is only moderately better than last year's April starters. This is terrifying.

  3. #23
    In several Hendriks starts, I noticed he'd miss on a 3rd out strike on a questionable call and it would extend the inning 5-10-20 pitches. Other starts, Id notice a bad defensive play that wasnt ruled an errror but should have been made. As he gets more expereience & gets those close calls from umpires, he'll keep his pitch counts lower & use his control as his out pitch. I just thought he's had some bad luck along the way so far.
    I think he's got a bit above average stuff but struggled mightily with confidence. He showed his stuff matching up with Felix & shutting down DET. I also think he struggled with the mindgames of getting his first win.
    We shall see, but he's my 'under the radar' pick this season to break out.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by nicksaviking View Post
    I find it more likely Hendriks is a useful pitcher in 2013 than I do Correia or Pelfry. Though his intro into the AL was rough last year, his limited experience is still more than those two combined, and while he will not be a big strikeout pitcher, he will still miss a hell of a lot more bats than those two.
    Pelfrey and Correua have probably pitched more inning against the AL than Hendricks. Probably more in AL parks too.

  5. #25
    Head Moderator MVP glunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Niedermann View Post
    I just don't see it. He has no out pitch. Doesn't overpower anybody. I never see him transitioning into anything more then a AAAA pitcher at best. We have plenty of those types already. I'd take my chances with PJ Walters or Sam Deduno before I'd pencil this guy into the rotation.
    I saw him pitch in Anaheim last year and his lack of an out pitch was a major problem. I wish that he could develop one.

    In contrast, almost everything that Deduno throws seems like it could be an out pitch, if only he would not walk so many people.

    As for Walters, it seems to me that he just needs to elevate everything that he does, assuming that he is capable of that.

  6. #26
    Does anyone think that hendriks turned the corner in the last month? Statistically he lead the starters in ERA over the las month which included the Yankees outing. However, go back and watch that game pitch by pitch. Four poor pitches in the same spot with the same result which I am sure he won't do again. I thought he started to trust his stuff and was prepared to go inside and out to both left and right hand hitters which he wasn't doing consistently in his earlier appearances. His confidence I felt was growing. I like a number of other views think he has an upside but the proof will be if he can continue to improve and become consistent. Anyone know how his rehab is going?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Agreed. I'm not a big Hendriks fan but there's a chance he turns into Scott Diamond with a few more Ks (not many, just a few more).

    Correia and Pelfrey, not so much.
    Just remember the day Liam Squared off against King Felix....Im hoping and praying Hendriks is this years Diamond
    the Twins need a break sometimes right?

  8. #28
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    Hopefully the Twins sign 1 more pitcher this offseason and have lots of competition for the rotation spots with Pelfry, Correia competing with Gibson, Hendricks, Dedunno, and Devries and I guess Blakburn for the last 2 spots. It would be nice if Blackburn came back with a new pitch to go with his sinker and started getting people out.

    Since this is about Hendricks I will go on record that I believe he has the potential to be good but he has to earn the right to pitch in the rotation and if he can continue to show improvment with his opportunuties and consistantly get hitters out then yeah he could be a starter up here. but so far he has not been someone to count on till a couple of last september starts. I wouldn't want to bank on that for 2013. with several starts and a good season in AAA maybe. with the starters we are brining in so far. Pelfry and Gibson comming off of injuries and Correia with the potential to not be good should give Hendrick opportunites to come up and pitch. so maybe 2014 will be a better year to count on him.
    Last edited by Brandon; 12-17-2012 at 09:07 AM.

  9. #29
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    I am not a believer in Henricks. Hard to tell on minor league stats, because you can avoid the 2 - 3 good hitters each club has in major situtations. Many major league clubs have 7-9 hitters that can hurt you. Hope he works out, but worried if he is a depended upon option. Note: Terry Ryan must agree as he is signing many pitchers to compete with Henricks for a spot in the bottom of the rotation.

  10. #30
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    Just remember the day Liam Squared off against King Felix....Im hoping and praying Hendriks is this years Diamond
    the Twins need a break sometimes right?
    Given what JR has rounded up for a rotation in 2013, the Twins will need a productive Hendriks and Gibson sooner rather than later.

    This is how I view the rotation right now:

    1. Worley (great pick-up, should be a #3-ish guy)
    2. Diamond (a #3-ish guy that is probably due for regression)
    3. Pelfrey (not a bad pick-up but a little baffling in the wake of passing on Baker)
    4. Correia (I'm just going to skip watching these games)
    5. Scrub/Hendriks/Gibson (sigh... Hendriks and Gibson will have to pitch their way beyond the #5 spot early in the season or we're looking at another 90+ loss season)

  11. #31
    niedermann..........finally someone sees it like i do....i have watched hendricks several times & i just dont see it either, as you said no out pitch, not overpowering, curve & change average at best & alot of those strike calls that go your way in AAA dont in the bigs...he is maybe a #5 in the NL or most likely a long man in the pen, no way he is the #5 in minnesota starting the season...as far as him or walters , you can compare there numbers all you want but put hendricks in the PCL for a while & watch those #s balloon.. if its a competition for the #5 spot between hendricks, walters, blackburn,deduno, devries then i think walters & blackburn are the favorites with blackburn having the edge because of the contract & he has been good before...walters was very good before his injury, if he is healthy & gets enough innings in ST it should be a very good competition.

  12. #32
    Senior Member All-Star 70charger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Physics Guy View Post
    I'm with you on hoping Hendriks is destined for better days. I believe I looked a few weeks back and saw similar numbers to Liam from Frankie V and Milton when they first came up. I just wish Gardy would give him the time that Kelly gave the other two. I'd say he has nothing to lose as most don't expect much from the Twins this year, but another bad season costs Gardy his job. I hope Liam gets out of the gates quickly this year.
    I think you're right about the Frank Viola comp. His first two MLB seasons, he was something like 5.5 ERA/1.5 WHIP, and then 5.5 ERA/1.6 WHIP. In Liam Hendriks first MLB season (not quite a full season, but ~20 starts), he was at 5.5 ERA/1.55 WHIP.

    And I hope he gets out of the gate quickly too. The last thing we need is for him not to earn a chance. I think he could become a nice, cost-controlled #3 pitcher.

  13. #33
    Senior Member Triple-A Dilligaf69's Avatar
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    He will certainly get the chance...would not suprise me at all if he was one of the five SP's out of ST.

  14. #34
    Senior Member Triple-A Dilligaf69's Avatar
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    Twins definitely need to add one more SP.... and Hope one of Hendriks/PJ/Cole give them something... Pelfry can contribute by May and Gibson is in the bigs by June.

  15. #35
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    His age is really interesting to me and I think it is overlooked how young he is. He spent his Age 23 season in AAA/Majors and was dominant in AAA plus his second half in the majors wasn't that bad. He had a 4.4 ERA and mediocre peripherals but he dropped his hits per nine and his WHIP significantly while his K and BB rates remained stable. He showed improvement and that's what counts.

    For comparison our two new shiny pitching prospects May and Meyer will both be 23 and likely spend the bulk of their years in AA this year. While yes they have nicer scouting reports and peripheral numbers they will be a full level to two levels below where Hendriks was at the same age. In addition Hendriks is an international prospect which, correct me if I'm wrong, they generally take longer to develop as well? If that's true it shows how well he's doing despite his age. I'm a believer in him as a nice 3-4 pitcher for years to come. Not likely to be a star but should be a solid contributor to the rotation. I'm excited about having him, Worley, and Diamond to be the guts of this rotation. Now just hoping 2 of Gibson,May, and Meyer can turn into 1-2 type talent.

  16. #36
    Senior Member All-Star Badsmerf's Avatar
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    Surprising the amount of Hendriks haters here. All of the comparisons are really not fair to Liam. Slowey was a big fly ball pitcher, almost twice as many as Liam. That makes a big difference. Liam will succeed, and I think things will start to click for him next year. He may not have a clear out pitch yet, but he's young and his curve has promise. He had this whole off-season to work of some of the issues he ran into last year and I expect it to show. He is the type of pitcher Rick Anderson can really help IMO. He'll go north with the Twins and I think he'll stick this time. Him and Plouffe are the players I really expect to give a boost to the Twins this year.
    Do or do not. There is no try.

  17. #37
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    If the twins are smart Hendricks will break camp with the big league club. He has far more upside that any other option (besides Gibson) and he has nothing left to prove in the minors

  18. #38
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badsmerf View Post
    Surprising the amount of Hendriks haters here. All of the comparisons are really not fair to Liam. Slowey was a big fly ball pitcher, almost twice as many as Liam. That makes a big difference. Liam will succeed, and I think things will start to click for him next year. He may not have a clear out pitch yet, but he's young and his curve has promise. He had this whole off-season to work of some of the issues he ran into last year and I expect it to show. He is the type of pitcher Rick Anderson can really help IMO. He'll go north with the Twins and I think he'll stick this time. Him and Plouffe are the players I really expect to give a boost to the Twins this year.
    Agreed. I think Hendriks has a floor of a #5 and a ceiling of a solid #3. I'm not as high on him as some but I'm definitely not a hater. He's exactly the type of guy Anderson can work with and turn into a serviceable guy.

  19. #39
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Instant gratification culture infects baseball prospect evaluation . . .

  20. #40
    brock, i am definately not a hater, but sell me on hendricks, what i have seen is a hi 80s Fb with little movement, location average, curve below avg, chnage avg, slider below avg...the only thing i think he can improve on is his location & that will help tremendously & he had off season elbow surgery so he will not have a normal off season to work on things.. all the other pitchers that have been mentioned have atleast 1 plus pitch, blackburn , great sinker when he is right, deduno, nasty movement on all his pitches but can he fix it ??,gibson + FB with sink, walters + change , was rated the best in the cards org for yrs & he showed it when healthy last year..just my opinion you have to have atleast 1 plus pitch to be a consistent starter in the bigs & i simply dont see it with hendricks, hope i am wrong but i just dont think so..

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