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Thread: Article: Cubs Signings Spell Trouble for Twins

  1. #21
    Senior Member Triple-A
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    mike wants wins - Today, 09:29 AM



    I disagree the market is already set too high. They can sign a 12 million guy, a 6million guy, and deal Span and a prospect for a legit prospect, and stay in their self imposed, too low, budget.
    Largely, I agree with this. I doubt if what the Cubs paid Feldman and Baker should have much effect on the Twins. If we go by what the Twins paid their starters last year, it is easy to suggest that there should be $20 million to perhaps as much as $30 million available for pitching this year. I would think that there should be room for multiple year contracts as well.

    I have no idea exactly how Ryan will do it, but it would be nice to see 3 or 4 pitchers acquired. Keep in mind that if Span, Willingham or Morneau is traded, it also sheds salary, possibly freeing up more for pitching.

    I do think that there should be room for a $12 million per year contract. It should be possible to spent around that much more for 2 or 3 more pitchers. Ryan maybe be able to acquire what he wants for less than that. He may spend a little more depending on what contract goes away in a trade. But, assuming that is what he has to work with, I don't think the Baker/Feldman contracts should have a huge impact on what Ryan can do.

  2. #22
    Senior Member All-Star
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    Does no one else find it disturbing that we are mostly in agreement that the Twins need to trade for starting pitching because free agency will eat up too much of the payroll? I mean, KC is even taking on large and terrible contracts.

    We're basing our free agent predictions on the HOPE that the Twins payroll will be the same as last year while the other clubs, except for the crooks in Miami, look to be increasing payroll. San Diego is really the front funner for Dan Haren? Milwaukee, Baltimore and Seattle are taking a serious look at Josh Hamilton? It can't be long before the average MLB payroll is +$100 million and the Twins are once again at the back of the pack.

    Edit: I realized it is early and we really have nothing to base a Twins 2013 payroll on other than assumption so I withdraw my complaint pending a payroll analysis among the other 29 teams come April.
    Last edited by nicksaviking; 11-28-2012 at 03:23 PM. Reason: Unprovoked ranting

  3. #23
    Senior Member All-Star TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    People keep tossing around 12M. Right now Andy Pettite is signing a 1 year 12M deal. If you think you're getting a starting pitcher with injury problems for less than 4M - check what Ryan Madson got today.

    Time to adjust your expectations people.

  4. #24
    Also, quit beating up on dumpster diving. It's not the way to fill all your needs, but Scott Diamond was a failed-but-kept Rule V. His record was nothing special but he turned out to be pretty good. Marquis sucked here, but his kid was seriously sick with something and he was hugely distracted. Later that summer he was what Ryan was hoping for when the deal was struck. Fledman constitues dumpter diving, frankly.

    The team needs a #1 and #2 plus more, so in addition to a big trade or FA signing, and beyond a third or fourth look at Duensing and his pals, they need to keep dumpster diving to fill this roster.

  5. #25
    Senior Member All-Star LaBombo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cris E View Post
    Also, quit beating up on dumpster diving. It's not the way to fill all your needs, but Scott Diamond was a failed-but-kept Rule V. His record was nothing special but he turned out to be pretty good. Marquis sucked here, but his kid was seriously sick with something and he was hugely distracted. Later that summer he was what Ryan was hoping for when the deal was struck. Fledman constitues dumpter diving, frankly.
    .
    Marquis has been a bad pitcher for years, and he was a bad pitcher for San Diego, about equal to Deduno and worse than Devries. Given the Twins' stadium windfall and the resulting increase in available payroll, it seems entirely reasonable that people are getting tired of hearing about the kind of replacement-level punching bags the Twins are considering for next season.

  6. #26
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    I'm not sure which bothers me worse...that 3 years into a new stadium that the Twins "needed" to stay competitive (and which has been filled to virtual capacity) they are already making financial excuses, chopping payroll, and contributing nothing to stadium costs...or that many fans seem incredibly eager to embrace this course of action.

    One more time: if they choose to do so, the Twins can handle a MLB payroll in the $125M range now, and more in the future, without losing any money. That they don't is because they CHOOSE not to, not because they CAN'T.

    They can make a reasonable attempt to fix the 2013 team without damaging their chances in 2015. In fact, signing some decent pitching to multi year contracts has at least as good, and probably better chance of helping the 2015 pitching staff than does "trading off Span, Morneau etc for a few good pitching prospects" and hoping. They traded Santana for "a few good prospects." How'd that work out?
    I agree completely. Especially given the drop in payroll going forward anyway. and the possibility of trading these players if need be for legit prospects (spending money on players does not mean that they cannot trade those players!).

  7. #27
    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    I think what is going on is that there are teams willing to spend money now in order to get their organization in order and that there are going to be free agents signing for only marginal increases from last year's contracts. That said, throwing $16 million for two years of Marcum seems like an obvious good move and would seem to get him immediately . . . so I am not going to blame other teams for Twins' inaction here.

  8. #28
    I think the market and the market will force the Twins to blow up the team and start from scratch.

    By that I mean teams are signing players to outlandish contracts while it is very evident we're headed into another recession. When revenue starts dropping, how do these teams expect to cover expenses?

    From a financial standpoint, I fully expect the Twins to move as much of their high priced talent as they can, for as many players as they can get, in order to better position themselves for the future.

    Being a Twins fan for the next few years probably won't be any fun. Very likely, Diamond will turn into the Brad Radke of this decade.

  9. #29
    Senior Member All-Star Jim Crikket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blake View Post
    I think the market and the market will force the Twins to blow up the team and start from scratch.

    By that I mean teams are signing players to outlandish contracts while it is very evident we're headed into another recession. When revenue starts dropping, how do these teams expect to cover expenses?

    From a financial standpoint, I fully expect the Twins to move as much of their high priced talent as they can, for as many players as they can get, in order to better position themselves for the future.

    Being a Twins fan for the next few years probably won't be any fun. Very likely, Diamond will turn into the Brad Radke of this decade.
    Apparently the people running sports cable networks don't expect the recession you're predicting, at least in terms of it affecting interest in Major League Baseball.

    An additional $25 million in available revenues starting in 2014, without any expenses tied to it, will undoubtedly cause average salaries to go up considerably. That being the case, it shouldn't be surprising that so many teams are looking to lock in good players to multi-year contracts at today's salary levels, even if that's a bit more than it was last year. The Twins should be doing the same thing. Come 2014 and 2015, pitchers comparable to what Sanchez and Jackson are today are likely to be considerably more expensive. As contrary to conventional wisdom as it may seem, a 4-5 year contract for a good, if not great, starting pitcher may make a lot of sense this year.
    I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at Knuckleballsblog.com while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for MetroSportsReport.com.

    ~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~

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