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Thread: Article: Tigers Garcia gives hope for Twins Arcia

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Article: Tigers Garcia gives hope for Twins Arcia


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    Just one more reason I have been believing in having one of Hicks, Arcia start in Minnesota next year. It may help them to start in Rochester, but the Twins need to bring in pitching and I do not think that TR will be able to sign or afford more than one FA pitcher, so trading Span and Parmalee for some major league ready arms to a cost concious team (Tampa, Seattle, Oakland, Miami) will be the best way to go.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Mr. Ed's Avatar
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    Also one more reason Arcia/Hicks should have played in MN in September. Especially after Willingham got dinged.

    Of course, the manager would still have preferred a month of his "starters" vs contenders instead. Had to have that big push to avoid 100 losses.

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    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Ed View Post
    Also one more reason Arcia/Hicks should have played in MN in September. Especially after Willingham got dinged.

    Of course, the manager would still have preferred a month of his "starters" vs contenders instead. Had to have that big push to avoid 100 losses.
    Willingham played his last game on September 24th. Arcia hadn't played baseball for three weeks at that point and may have been at home when it happened. There was no reason to call him back for ~10 days of baseball.

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    Senior Member All-Star Winston Smith's Avatar
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    When do Hicks and Arcia have to be put on the 40 man?

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    No way the Twins bring up AA or A players to the playoffs. This post will just generate all kind of posts about the Twins and their conservative style, deserved or not. They would rather sign and play awful relief pitchers than use their own minor leaguers, we saw that all last year.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Mr. Ed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Ed View Post
    Also one more reason Arcia/Hicks should have played in MN in September. Especially after Willingham got dinged.

    Of course, the manager would still have preferred a month of his "starters" vs contenders instead. Had to have that big push to avoid 100 losses.
    Willingham played his last game on September 24th. Arcia hadn't played baseball for three weeks at that point and may have been at home when it happened. There was no reason to call him back for ~10 days of baseball.
    Right. However, I really believe that both of them should have gotten some action in, as soon as AA was over.
    Given the alleged "surplus" the Twins have, need to know what players they can trade off sooner rather than later.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Mr. Ed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    When do Hicks and Arcia have to be put on the 40 man?
    Arcia is already on the 40 man.

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    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Ed View Post
    Right. However, I really believe that both of them should have gotten some action in, as soon as AA was over.
    Given the alleged "surplus" the Twins have, need to know what players they can trade off sooner rather than later.
    I would have liked to see Arcia and Hicks as well but I won't complain too much that they didn't get ~25 ABs apiece in September. There is plenty of time for them to show their talents in ST and the minors early next year. Not a lot was to be gained by bringing them into a crowded outfield situation while the downside is that a crowded outfield situation would have cramped Parmelee's playing time even more. Considering that Parmelee is at the point where more time in the minors will do him little good, I preferred seeing him over Hicks or Arcia. The Twins have plenty of time to gauge what they have in Hicks/Arcia while Parmelee needs playing time right now to see if he's a Major League player.

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    Great article. Arcia's stats are far superior to Garcia with more power. The future is verybright for Arcia
    BTW can we please stop the notion that he can come up and be handed a starting job before we even get to spring? We have no idea how he will fare against MLB pitching.


    No need to rush him

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    Senior Member All-Star Winston Smith's Avatar
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    If Arcia is on the 40 man why was Carson playing in Sept and not Arcia? Carson is a 30 yr old and not our future. Even if only 20 ab's (Carson had 45 in Sept/Oct) he gets the taste of great food, good travel and nice hotels would give him a little boost going into the winter to really "get after it" next year.
    45 wasted ab's on a career minor league player that has no long term future with the team just doesn't make any sense, imo.
    This comment brought to you from the Rosedale Mall studio by Hamm's Beer, brewed in the land of sky blue waters.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Mr. Ed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    If Arcia is on the 40 man why was Carson playing in Sept and not Arcia? Carson is a 30 yr old and not our future. Even if only 20 ab's (Carson had 45 in Sept/Oct) he gets the taste of great food, good travel and nice hotels would give him a little boost going into the winter to really "get after it" next year.
    45 wasted ab's on a career minor league player that has no long term future with the team just doesn't make any sense, imo.
    Agree completely. I don't mind Matt Carson, but is he really needed, beside to keep Rochester market happy?

    No need to rush him. Eh, I'll disagree. Why so cautious? Find out what a guy can do this fall, rather than start the year with "he'll be in the minors because he has no experience".

    Sano/Kepler/Rosario will probably still be in the minors in 4 years if they stay with the overly cautious plan.

    It's ok to have a few guys younger than 25 play every day in the bigs. It's been done a time or two.
    And yes, I know those 3 will be younger than 25 in 4 years. It's a sarcastic remark for an organization that needs new blood in the higher levels sooner rather than later.

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    The article should tell Twins fans that the mild success of Avisail Garcia should give them hope for what Arcia and Hicks could be. By prospect rankings, Hicks and Arcia rank higher than Garcia. The situations. There was no reason for the Twins to bring up Hicks or Arcia for September. None.

    The Twins didn't need to evaluate Arcia or Hicks yet in September. They did need to see Parmelee and some of those infielders.

    Arcia and Hicks are already playing in Venezuela. What they do there for 2-3 months will likely mean much more than those 25 at bats they might have seen in September. They'll likely both be Top 100 prospects, go to spring training, get sent down to the minors early in camp, go to Rochester, play there 2-3 months and HOPEFULLY show that they're ready.

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    And had they been promoted more aggressively, they could have been in AAA ball already, and we would not hear how they have no experience over AA and are not yet ready. I warned you the thread would develop into this topic.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Mr. Ed's Avatar
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    They'll likely both be Top 100 prospects, go to spring training, get sent down to the minors early in camp, go to Rochester, play there 2-3 months and HOPEFULLY show that they're ready.

    Hope.
    Hope.
    Hope.

    That should be the Twins Motto.

    The Twins HOPE that things work out. If not, by golly, let's see what we can blame it on.
    Injuries to __________(choose an area)
    Guys without enough experience
    Guys they HOPE would work out that didn't.

    Bleh. They HOPE a lot of things come together each year. Why not have some sure things.

    Oh, that's right, the old regime traded a number of those away. Why? Conflicts in personalities, needs in other areas, etc, etc.
    Traded too much away.

    Suffer now and get the kids ready. This team needs to clear a lot of driftwood away.

  16. #16
    It would be very percolating to trade away Span, Willingham and Parmalee and let Arcia, Hicks and Revere roam the TF outfield.

    Would be able to bring in some very valuable pitchers if the Twins were willing to deal those 3 players. At the end of the day, the Twins need to realize we can't win with our current pitchers and moves NEED to be made to improve this team's win/loss total. It would be nice if we could possible trade Span/Morneau for some pitching prospects and keep Parmalee at 1B and Willingham at LF/DH but I'm just not sure we will be able to get enough in return for just those 2.

  17. #17
    Yes, Twins have few tradeable assets right now. Span/Revere as CF lead-off men and Parmalee. Morneau will bring little (big contract, concussion history, last year of contract).

    So bring Rosario, Arcia, Hicks, and Sano to ML spring training, give them at-bats vs top pitching and see what they show. Send them to Rochester for seasoning unless they prove stars at training camp. Bring them up as they are ready--but give them time in show in 2013 to learn trade and maybe we can contend in 2014. Assuming Span or Revere is traded this winter--come July 2013 we will know whether to trade Willingham, Span or Revere, Plouffe, etc. to get some pitching here--assuming the 4 kids will play in 2014.

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    Mr Ed, would those 20-25 at bats given any more hope (or less) than them not playing? I mean, Parmelee was great last September. Benson was pretty solid in September. And they got 80 at bats...

    I guess I just look at the Royals and say... was rushing prospects the right thing to do? Hosmer, Moustakus, Hochevar, Giovetella, Dyson, Cain, all those starting pitchers... is it worth rushing?

    By the way, Wil Myers was the Minor league player of the year and split time between AA and AAA, and the Royals didn't call him up. Does that make him less of a prospect or hurt his future? Not at all. Oh, and don't forget that he spent all of 2011 in AA and started 2012 there too!! Yikes!!

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    The station by station approach that the Twins use hurts them in two ways:

    1. It reduces the trade value of their minor league players. Not that the Twins would ever consider making a trade that would trade a high level minor league players, but several years ago when they had playoff level teams they could have looked to make a deal of minor league players for established veteran players. Because we hold our players back, we don't get much "age premium" in valuation. To see how this works, look at the Santana trade with the Mets. The minor league players we got from the Mets were vastly overrated, and the reason why was that players like Delois Guerra were pitching at levels 1-3 higher than they would have been in the Twins organization. "His stats aren't spectacular, but he is a 18 year old pitching in A+ ball"...................

    2. The station by station approach shortens the development window of the players. IF a star minor league prospect gets to the major leagues at 24 years of age (lets say Chris Parmalee) their career windows are much shortened. IF they struggle at first (lets say Chris Parmalee) sending them down is a valid option, but that takes more time off the clock. Suddenly, the player is 26-27 years old with limited major league experience, and the clock has run out. If you get the player up when they are 21-22 years old they still have time to work the major league kinks out.

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    Senior Member All-Star YourHouseIsMyHouse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Ed View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    When do Hicks and Arcia have to be put on the 40 man?
    Arcia is already on the 40 man.
    Hicks has to before November 20th. Otherwise he's up for selection in the rule V draft.

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