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View Poll Results: End of the night: fourth or fifth place?

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  • Fourth

    3 42.86%
  • Fifth

    4 57.14%
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Thread: Twins vs Indians, 09-19-2012, 6:10pm

  1. #21
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    Wow, that was an awful call.



    Good for Mauer though.
    "Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
    - Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

  2. #22
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Another single for Mauer, another run for the Twins, and getting close to locking down Hendriks' first win...

    Good night overall.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Triple-A kydoty's Avatar
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    Gardy will be ejected in about 10 seconds if they call him out.

    "Mediocre breaking balls are a gift from God." - Kirby Puckett

  4. #24
    This has been a fun game to listen to with Hendricks in line for his first "big league" win, Willingham padding his resume with a 4 for 4 night (so far), Carroll almost hit his 2nd homer in 4 years.

    I have a question though. For those who listen on Gameday, does it seem like Chris Atterbury (who is doing the broadcast with Cory Provos tonight) always has his microphone gain set way too high so it distorts.

  5. #25
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Jesus, Miggy with another homer. Sitting at 1-2 for the night with 2 BB. He's on fire. I'd be shocked if he loses the MVP at this point. Trout is fading fast and Miggy has turned into a monster.

  6. #26
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Cabrera's post All-Star numbers:

    July: 1.086 OPS
    August: 1.092 OPS
    September: 1.223 OPS

    Christ, those numbers are Bonds-ian.

  7. #27
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Did they take away Mauer's hit and the run? What the hell is going on here?

  8. #28
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brock Beauchamp View Post
    Did they take away Mauer's hit and the run?
    Yes.
    "Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
    - Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

  9. #29
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    I wouldn't have blamed Hendriks for walking out of the stadium and hopping on a plane back to Australia if Robertson gave away that lead.

  10. #30
    I know "wins" is an overrated stat, but I'm happy for Liam...

  11. #31
    Head Moderator MVP glunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mhanson93 View Post
    i know "wins" is an overrated stat, but i'm happy for liam...
    amen!

  12. #32
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbknudson View Post

    And give up the excellent turkey sandwiches they sell at the park? Those things are good!
    Where do you find them? I've not had one yet.

  13. #33
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    Mike Trout is my MVP. Say what you want about the triple crown stats, but Trout's been so much more valuable on the basepaths and with the glove that if you look past homers and RBIs, it's not even really that close. Cabrera might have taken one for the team in moving to third, but by most metrics (and by the eye test) he's the worst (or second-worst) third baseman in the league defensively, so he isn't offering value there. And he's not burning up the basepaths either, nor can you give either credit for 'carrying the team to the postseason' or being 'all alone' on a good team...

  14. #34
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Top Gun View Post
    Mike Trout is my MVP. Say what you want about the triple crown stats, but Trout's been so much more valuable on the basepaths and with the glove that if you look past homers and RBIs, it's not even really that close. Cabrera might have taken one for the team in moving to third, but by most metrics (and by the eye test) he's the worst (or second-worst) third baseman in the league defensively, so he isn't offering value there. And he's not burning up the basepaths either, nor can you give either credit for 'carrying the team to the postseason' or being 'all alone' on a good team...
    MVP voting is one of the few areas where I feel it's fair to use RBIs and Runs. The MVP balloting is about results and while RBIs are team-influenced, they are also firmly based on results. Cabrera drove in that run and helped his team win. That cannot be debated. Trout scored that run and helped his team win. That cannot be debated. How it came about is kind of irrelevant. RBIs and Runs are nearly useless when trying to predict a player's future performance but in results-based voting such as the MVP or HoF, they should be used to judge how a player performed.

    And Cabrera has a whopping 53 more RBI than Trout. He's also leading in OPS, BA, OBP, HR, and most offensive metrics. Trout has him in defense and base running. Overall, I think it's close but given how voters historically lean in their voting, I think it's Cabrera's award to lose.

    Plus, voters should notice that Cabrera is putting up an OPS over 1.200 in September while Trout is scuffling with a .778 mark. That matters. Both of their teams were contenders going into the month and one guy has stepped up while the other faltered.

  15. #35
    Speediest Moderator All-Star snepp's Avatar
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    You do realize that's a verbatim copy/paste from a Rotoworld blog, yes?
    "Maybe you could go grab a bat and ball… and learn something. Maybe you will get it."
    - Strib commenter educating the elitists on the value of RBI's

  16. #36
    Senior Member All-Star IdahoPilgrim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sbknudson View Post

    And give up the excellent turkey sandwiches they sell at the park? Those things are good!
    Where do you find them? I've not had one yet.
    There are two stands - one on the main level, one on the top level. Both are behind home plate.

  17. #37
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snepp View Post
    You do realize that's a verbatim copy/paste from a Rotoworld blog, yes?
    No, I did not realize that.

  18. #38
    Senior Member All-Star Willihammer's Avatar
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    Fangraphs basically destroyed the RBI/MVP argument for Cabrera earlier this week. For starters, if you're going to just measure side by side Trouts rbi totals and Cabrera's then you also have to measure Cabrera's 28 GIDPs to Trouts (7). They are both products of hitting when runners are on base. Sort of goes with being a leadoff hitter compared to a 3 hole hitter.

    Then there is the part about what each hitters does after getting on base. Conveniently, they get on base at virtually the same clip, but Trout makes way more of the opportunities. Money quote:

    The fact that Trout has 18 additional runs scored despite playing in those 21 fewer games shows the magnitude of the difference that baserunning can make, and it’s of course silly to only consider runs created with the bat and ignore those with the legs. Trout has scored 45% of the times he’s been on base — easily the highest of any regular in the AL — compared to a league average of just 31% and Cabrera’s 28% total. Yes, some of that is having Albert Pujols hit behind him, but of course Prince Fielder hits behind Cabrera, mitigating the argument that run scored percentage is solely a function of the guy hitting behind you.

  19. #39
    Owner MVP Brock Beauchamp's Avatar
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    If you're going to count RBI, you have to count Runs. I mentioned earlier that Trout definitely has the advantage in runs scored. Is the entire package of Trout enough to overcome Cabrera's RBI and offensive totals? Well, I think that depends on what you're looking at. If you asked me whether I'd want Trout or Cabrera on my team in 2012, I'd choose Trout every time. He's the more rounded and capable player.

    On the other hand, "MVP" is a nebulous term. Cabrera is a run-producing monster who is leading or near the top of every offensive category in the AL. He's also "turning it on" exactly when his team needs him the most, posting an OPS of 1.126 in the second half. As with most MVP arguments, it comes down to what you think is most valuable.

    I won't shed any tears if Trout wins the award. I'd probably give it to Miggy if I had a vote but I tend to sway more toward the player who is helping keep his team in contention down the stretch, not the guy who is scuffling a bit as the Angels teeter on the edge of falling out of the Wild Card race. Either way, it's an interesting debate.

    PS. It's crazy that Trout has scored 45% of the time he has reached base. That's insane.

  20. #40
    Senior Member All-Star Willihammer's Avatar
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    As the great TK once said, "remember guys, the first inning counts!"

    Same goes the season.

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