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Thread: Which scrap heap players should the Twins target in free agency?

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Which scrap heap players should the Twins target in free agency?

    We have talked alot about the Twins taking a run at some of the top FA pitchers on the market, Greinke, Sanchez, Jackson etc. But this thread is to talk about some of the guys the Twins should try to bring in on small 1 or 2 year deals. I think the Twins will sign one big free agent, and then will have to supplement the team with some shrewd moves if they want to compete. Ideally they will get more "Burtons" then "Marquis" this time around.

    Let's say for the sake of this thread all players mentioned will be paid less then 5 mil a year:

    Scott Baker: One of the most obvious choices, has said all things being equal he would like to be back in Minnesota. Offer: 1 year 3 mil (+4 mil in IP incentives)

    Jorge De La Rosa: Another guy coming off some injury issues. Never has had great numbers, but has the talent to be decent if it all comes together. Offer: ST Invite.

    Erik Bedard: Had a nice start, but has been pretty brutal as of late. Worth a flier perhaps as a veteran #5. Offer: 1 year, 2 mil.

    Freddy Garcia: Getting up their in age, but has actually been pretty effective as a SP in the AL East. Offer: 1 year, 3.5 mil

    Carl Pavano: Days are probably numbered in Minnesota, but if he can come back healthy could be worth a ST invite. Offer: ST invite.

    Matt Capps: (Ducks for cover) Yes, we all dislike Capps because we traded Ramos for him, then continued to over pay for him. But in his time with the Twins he actually hasn't been that bad. Offer: ST Invite or 1 year, 1.5 mil deal.

    Joba Chamberlin: One of my favorites on this list: (Note would have to be non tendered by the Yankees, which is likely) Still throws hard, can be a nice reliever and needs a change of scenery. Offer: 1 year, 1.5 mil deal or 2 year 3 mil.

    Jon Rauch: Still pitching well. Offer: 1 year 3 mil

    Latroy Hawkins: Bring back the Hawk! Old as hell but still effective. Offer: 1 year 3 mil.



    Stephen Drew: Should be had for a cheap 1 year deal as he will try to recoup some value. Perhaps a decent plan "B" they are sure Dozier is the answer at SS (or if they move Dozier to 2B) Offer: 1 year 3.5 mil

    Marco Scutaro: Would be a bit redudant with Carroll on the roster. But if Carroll is moved, he could be a nice stop gap for the INF. Offer: 1 year 4 mil

    Mark DeRosa: Offer: Spring training invite

    Torii Hunter: Has indicated he would want to come back to Minnesota. Again he could fill in for a year if one of Span/Willingham is traded. Offer: 1 year 5 mil



    Super longshot:
    Melky Cabera: If the Twins trade one of Span/Willingham there is a short term spot open in the OF. Cabrera would probably be a reach, BUT he most likely will have to sign a one year deal to prove he wasn't just an PED type player. Offer: 1 year 6 mil (incentives up to 7 mil)
    Last edited by SpiritofVodkaDave; 08-27-2012 at 10:22 AM.

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    Senior Member All-Star
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    Save your money and keep what you got.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Top Gun View Post
    Save your money and keep what you got.
    If the Twins have a 95 mil budget for 2013 they should spend 95 mil. If they have a 90 mil budget they should spend 90 mil.

    There is no point to not spend that money for 2013, and all these players would be 1 year type contracts, and at the end of the day it can be argued there is no such thing as a "bad" one year deal.

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    The Twins re-treads do nothing to change the tone of the organization and clubhouse. If you aren't going to do it with your coaching staff, you damn well better do it with the personnel on the field.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Brad Swanson's Avatar
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    I think signing a bunch of one-year deals is a great strategy. If the player hits and that makes the team better, great! If the player hits and the team is still bad, they have added a trade chip. If everything fails (a la Marquis), it is just a money hit and it is over in a year.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jctwins View Post
    The Twins re-treads do nothing to change the tone of the organization and clubhouse. If you aren't going to do it with your coaching staff, you damn well better do it with the personnel on the field.
    The only real "re-treads" I would prefer would be Baker and potentially Hunter.

    I don't see any harm in giving Pavano a shot in spring training.

  7. #7
    Ive said in a couple threads that i think Mn will go after SP Jeremy Guthrie. Fits the Twins MO on pitchers.... will be cheap, pitched more than 200IP for several yrs, had a solid era in hitters haven of Balt, but throws hard (still 94mph ave)

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brad Swanson View Post
    I think signing a bunch of one-year deals is a great strategy. If the player hits and that makes the team better, great! If the player hits and the team is still bad, they have added a trade chip. If everything fails (a la Marquis), it is just a money hit and it is over in a year.
    Yup, also Doumit was one of these type of players as well, and things have worked out great so far!

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    I don't have a problem with some pitching 1 year, incentive loaded contracts because they are little risk. But I hate making little impact signings that don't really help much and are just blocking others in the organization that may (or may not) have a future. Look at Jamey Carroll, why did the Twins sign him? He is a .240 hitter with decent defense (little range), and no power. Why not take that money and go spend it on a pticher somewhere.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greengoblinrulz View Post
    Ive said in a couple threads that i think Mn will go after SP Jeremy Guthrie. Fits the Twins MO on pitchers.... will be cheap, pitched more than 200IP for several yrs, had a solid era in hitters haven of Balt, but throws hard (still 94mph ave)
    I missed Guthrie, but you are right. I would include him on the list as well.

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    Super Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=SpiritofVodkaDave;49885]
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Gun View Post
    there is no such thing as a "bad" one year deal.
    Not as disastrous as being saddled with a bad player under an untradeable contract, I agree.

    But as an "opportunity cost", the one year deals can still be bad if the thinking is that a few low-cost contracts (Marquis, Burroughs) are better than what you already have in the system or can be obtained on the waiver wire, rather than combining those funds to get somebody who's actually good. It wasn't particularly a problem for the 2012 Twins, and it's mostly second-guessing for me to point at the Marquis signing now; I'm just pointing out the downside when paying old talent at what seems like a bargain price.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeboo_22 View Post
    I don't have a problem with some pitching 1 year, incentive loaded contracts because they are little risk. But I hate making little impact signings that don't really help much and are just blocking others in the organization that may (or may not) have a future. Look at Jamey Carroll, why did the Twins sign him? He is a .240 hitter with decent defense (little range), and no power. Why not take that money and go spend it on a pticher somewhere.
    Say what you want about Carroll, but he has been by far the most consistent and best option the Twins have had at MI this season. You can certainly live with a .331 OBP out of your #9 hitter.

    He isn't blocking anyone, Dozier was able to get plenty of starts and proved he wasn't ready yet.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ashburyjohn View Post

    Not as disastrous as being saddled with a bad player under an untradeable contract, I agree.

    But as an "opportunity cost", the one year deals can still be bad if the thinking is that a few low-cost contracts (Marquis, Burroughs) are better than what you already have in the system or can be obtained on the waiver wire, rather than combining those funds to get somebody who's actually good. It wasn't particularly a problem for the 2012 Twins, and it's mostly second-guessing for me to point at the Marquis signing now; I'm just pointing out the downside when paying old talent at what seems like a bargain price.
    I'm not advocating going out and signing 4 of those guys to be part of the rotation, but let's be honest. Heading into 2013 are there really a lot of players who would be blocked? Gibson/Hendriks/Diamond will all get plenty of shots to be in the rotation regardless of who/how many they sign. I guess it could be argued that a veteran pitcher could potentially block the DeVries, Walters or DeDunos of the team, but I would argue they aren't talented enough to actually be "blocked"

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    Senior Member All-Star Winston Smith's Avatar
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    Blanton, Correia, Guthrie and Saunders all fit our price range and would likely be better than what we have. McCarthy would be ok but seems hurt a lot. Marcum and Jackson are likely out of our price range. No Pavano and other 35+ types very rare they work out usually just wasting money. Baker I think has had his fill of the Twins medical team.
    I don't really see any middle infielders that would help.
    Two that could help the attitude would be Youkilis for 3b moving Plouffe to second and Hunter in right field. Of course that means Span + is traded for Shields or equal.

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    I've asked this question before, but don't think I ever found an answer, and part of your list made me wonder about it again. It seems like in situations where and option is declined by the team, the player "never" signs back with that team for a lesser amount. I can see Baker being a different circumstance given the injury, but Capps I thought also had an option for next year. Do players often/ever sign back with a team that doesn't pick up their option?

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDog View Post
    I've asked this question before, but don't think I ever found an answer, and part of your list made me wonder about it again. It seems like in situations where and option is declined by the team, the player "never" signs back with that team for a lesser amount. I can see Baker being a different circumstance given the injury, but Capps I thought also had an option for next year. Do players often/ever sign back with a team that doesn't pick up their option?
    Yeah that is a good point about Capps. I'm sure it has happened in the past, the teams/players understand its a business. It's not like the Twins are being "cheap" by declining Capps option, it is their right to do so and hardly think he would argue with it.

    Also with Capps, its not like there will be some huge market for him anyways, he seemed to like Minnesota enough and may be willing to stick around for a million bucks or so.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by greengoblinrulz View Post
    Ive said in a couple threads that i think Mn will go after SP Jeremy Guthrie. Fits the Twins MO on pitchers.... will be cheap, pitched more than 200IP for several yrs, had a solid era in hitters haven of Balt, but throws hard (still 94mph ave)
    I missed Guthrie, but you are right. I would include him on the list as well.
    I was going to mention Guthrie as well, but there's no way he'd make less than $5M, as per the OP's salary condition.
    "Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand."

  18. #18
    Marco Scutaro: Would be a bit redudant with Carroll on the roster. But if Carroll is moved, he could be a nice stop gap for the INF. Offer: 1 year 4 mil
    Along these same lines, Jeff Keppinger, and he would come cheaper.
    "Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand."

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Boom Boom's Avatar
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    Scott Baker, Matt Capps, and Alexi Casilla.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpiritofVodkaDave View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by joeboo_22 View Post
    I don't have a problem with some pitching 1 year, incentive loaded contracts because they are little risk. But I hate making little impact signings that don't really help much and are just blocking others in the organization that may (or may not) have a future. Look at Jamey Carroll, why did the Twins sign him? He is a .240 hitter with decent defense (little range), and no power. Why not take that money and go spend it on a pticher somewhere.
    Say what you want about Carroll, but he has been by far the most consistent and best option the Twins have had at MI this season. You can certainly live with a .331 OBP out of your #9 hitter.

    He isn't blocking anyone, Dozier was able to get plenty of starts and proved he wasn't ready yet.
    And I get that, and he is doing his job. But he is the type of signing you make to take a close to winning the division to winning the division. Not the type of guy to anchor second or short on a last place team. He is costing what 6-7 million for 2 years of doing what he does on a last place team. I looked at Burroughs (less money) as the same type, I know there isn't much in the terms of the system but why not just put Casilla there and have him do that for the 1 million he makes a year, and see if he is worth 1 million next year. Save that money and get a bullpen arm, or put it towards a starter.

    Its not that Carroll is good, or doing his job. Its that I'm going to go out on a limb and say his WAR isn't that great and there are others for less that could do the same job. At some point the Twins need to figure out who is going to be in the middle infield. Whether that is moving Mastronni or trying to convert Revere (will never happen though it should be looked at), or just putting Dozier, Florimon there and seeing what happens or whatever. Its the point that Carroll isn't in the future while at the same point there isn't a prospect at that position even remotely close in the system so its not like he is holding down the fort until someone arrives in 2 years.

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