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Thread: Market for Liriano and Willingham increases with trades/extensions

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Market for Liriano and Willingham increases with trades/extensions

    So, just in case you didn't know, the market for Span, Willingham (not that he is officially on the market) and Liriano increased last night/early this morning, with the 6-year, $144 million deal given to Cole Hamels and the trade of Hanley Ramirez and Randy Choate of the Marlins to the Dodgers for Nathan Eovaldi and a minor leaguer.

    This means that there is one less proven big league pitcher on the market, and Liriano is starting to look really good to GM's desperate for pitching and can no longer trade for Hamels.

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    Senior Member All-Star SpiritofVodkaDave's Avatar
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    The Marlin's have thrown a wrench into all of this with them becoming fire sellers once again, Liriano still rates behind: Grienke, Garza, Johnson and Dempster on the "trading" scale I imagine.

    However there certainly are less "rentals" avail now as well I imagine.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    I think the Dodgers are in exclusive negotiations for Dempster, and I am expecting them to get a deal done for him sometime this week, so I was kind of leaving him out of my mental list of available starters. I haven't really heard anything about anyone asking about Garza, like anything at all, so I have been leaning towards the assumption that the Cubs are not going to trade him. I would say that Liriano, Greinke, Shields and Johnson are probably the best pitchers I know of that are still on the market, and it seems like the Rays might trade Shields soon, so the market for Liriano might grow even larger.

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    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
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    The H-Ram trade does nothing to the Span value, if anything it may affect Willingham a bit. The Hamels extension and the Wandy Rodriguez trade really has Liriano cornering the market of LHSPs
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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thrylos98 View Post
    The H-Ram trade does nothing to the Span value, if anything it may affect Willingham a bit. The Hamels extension and the Wandy Rodriguez trade really has Liriano cornering the market of LHSPs
    Really, how many other LHP's are on the market that have better stuff than Liriano? Also, there are at most maybe three or four veteran RHP's that are better than Liriano, and that number has been shrinking almost daily in the last week.

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    Twins Moderator All-Star diehardtwinsfan's Avatar
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    well, there's more buyers than sellers, so every time a player dropps off the market, the supply of available pieces drops more than the remaining demand... In simple economics, that means a higher price for those desparate to buy. I personally kind of hope that TR is talking with the Dodgers about a similar deal for Liriano.

    I'm not quite sure Garza goes because the Cubs will ask a kings ransom for him, same with Willingham.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by diehardtwinsfan View Post
    well, there's more buyers than sellers, so every time a player dropps off the market, the supply of available pieces drops more than the remaining demand... In simple economics, that means a higher price for those desparate to buy. I personally kind of hope that TR is talking with the Dodgers about a similar deal for Liriano.

    I'm not quite sure Garza goes because the Cubs will ask a kings ransom for him, same with Willingham.
    Have the Dodgers even expressed interest in Liriano? Also, just in hypothetical, who would the Twins receive in return for Liriano? Also, what are you thinking the Twins get in order to give up Willingham?

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    Senior Member All-Star Winston Smith's Avatar
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    I think the Liriano market is going to be really soft. Think about it, every team that needs pitching has watched him for years and they all know he is anything but reliable. Now you are in the race do you really want to bet your chances on a guy that may be a dud. You trade for him and he gives you 2-3 starts like his last or early this season and you are out of it. I think the only place he goes is a really desperate team after everything else is done. Span might go to the Reds or Nats but I don't think he'll bring much back as much as we hope. Willingham is the best chance to really add some talent but wouldn't some fans revolt meaning more empty seats and more empty seats meaning lower payroll next year? This team really is a mess.
    Sorry I'm getting a little depressed after all this losing.
    Please something good happen!!

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    I think Span or Willingham is a better fit for the Dodgers. They could use both a good leadoff hitter and a power bat. Any trade with them would have to include Zach Lee.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    I think the Liriano market is going to be really soft. Think about it, every team that needs pitching has watched him for years and they all know he is anything but reliable. Now you are in the race do you really want to bet your chances on a guy that may be a dud. You trade for him and he gives you 2-3 starts like his last or early this season and you are out of it. I think the only place he goes is a really desperate team after everything else is done. Span might go to the Reds or Nats but I don't think he'll bring much back as much as we hope. Willingham is the best chance to really add some talent but wouldn't some fans revolt meaning more empty seats and more empty seats meaning lower payroll next year? This team really is a mess.
    Sorry I'm getting a little depressed after all this losing.
    Please something good happen!!
    All this is why I am glad we have Terry Ryan as GM again instead of Bill Smith. Ryan was known for making really good deals when he was with the Twins the first time around, and very few deals that Smith made we would approve of. Ryan was (and hopefully still is) really good at judging the market for players, and knowing that (in my personal opinion) that he should deal Liriano ASAP for the best deal possible, because when you get better pitchers like Shields and Greinke and whoever else is still on the market off the market, people are less likely to go and sell high on Liriano.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    I think Span or Willingham is a better fit for the Dodgers. They could use both a good leadoff hitter and a power bat. Any trade with them would have to include Zach Lee.
    if span is traded , i hope its to cincy... hamilton would look good at 2b

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gunnarthor View Post
    I think Span or Willingham is a better fit for the Dodgers. They could use both a good leadoff hitter and a power bat. Any trade with them would have to include Zach Lee.
    I partially agree with you. I think any deal for Willingham would include Lee, IF said deal was with the Dodgers, but we probably won't get that much for Span. Plus, they aren't going to trade 2/3 of their starting outfield to the same team, no matter how much is offered.

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    Quote Originally Posted by J-Dog Dungan View Post
    All this is why I am glad we have Terry Ryan as GM again instead of Bill Smith. Ryan was known for making really good deals when he was with the Twins the first time around, and very few deals that Smith made we would approve of. Ryan was (and hopefully still is) really good at judging the market for players, and knowing that (in my personal opinion) that he should deal Liriano ASAP for the best deal possible, because when you get better pitchers like Shields and Greinke and whoever else is still on the market off the market, people are less likely to go and sell high on Liriano.
    what deals? are you speaking of the a.j. deal? terry ryan wanted boof bonser, not liriano...he said boof was the key player in the trade ,with out boof , ryan doesnt make the deal....
    terry ryans time has passed him by. time for new blood from david st . pete down to vavra,anderson,ulger and liddle (and of course the ring master of the @ss clown posse ron "the waddler"gardenhire..)

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    what deals? are you speaking of the a.j. deal? terry ryan wanted boof bonser, not liriano...he said boof was the key player in the trade ,with out boof , ryan doesnt make the deal....
    terry ryans time has passed him by. time for new blood from david st . pete down to vavra,anderson,ulger and liddle (and of course the ring master of the @ss clown posse ron "the waddler"gardenhire..)
    Ah, but they also got Joe Nathan in that deal, who ended up being the Twins' all-time saves leader before he left. Other deals he made include the one to get rid of Knoblauch, picked up Johan Santana in the Rule V draft, drafted Joe Mauer, Justin Morneau, Cuddy, Hunter, Span, Perkins, signed Jacque Jones, Doug Mientkiewicz, Cory Koskie, Josh Willingham, Jared Burton, and Matt Capps just to name a few guys who really helped the Twins out in the last decade because of Terry Ryan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    what deals? are you speaking of the a.j. deal? terry ryan wanted boof bonser, not liriano...he said boof was the key player in the trade ,with out boof , ryan doesnt make the deal....
    That's not quite right. Boof and Nathan were the initial keys to the trade but SF had to kick in Liriano to outbid Seattle. And Boof was a fine prospect, at one time being ranked BA #29 prospect. If SF had declined to put in any of those three guys, Ryan wouldn't have made the trade.

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    Senior Member Triple-A
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    Braves have given up on Dempster. Would they offer Delgado or Jurrjens type back for Liriano. They still have Teheran waiting in the wings, and I know we can't get him, but maybe one of the others.

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    Senior Member Double-A PMKI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnydakota View Post
    if span is traded , i hope its to cincy... hamilton would look good at 2b
    If we somehow manage to get Billy Hamilton I just don't know how to explain how happy I would be!

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    Getting anything close to Delgado for two months of Liriano would be a steal for the Twins. Looking at his game log, he has very few good games and many poor outings against the better teams. That hot/cold type of performance is not one teams want to take into the playoffs.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TKGuy View Post
    Braves have given up on Dempster. Would they offer Delgado or Jurrjens type back for Liriano. They still have Teheran waiting in the wings, and I know we can't get him, but maybe one of the others.
    With Jurrjens recent struggles (like, even more than Liriano) I am not sure the Twins should even want him.

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    Senior Member Big-Leaguer J-Dog Dungan's Avatar
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    I am now getting conflicting reports on MLBTR on whether or not the Cubs will trade Dempster. One bullet says they want to keep him and make him a qualifying offer so they get draft pick comp. if he walks, and another says that they Dodgers are working hard to swing a trade with the Cubs for him. Also, the Braves are officially out of the Dempster sweepstakes, according to MLBTR.

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