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Thread: The Twins and Their Supposed "Outfield Depth"

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    The Twins and Their Supposed "Outfield Depth"

    I just read Souhan's recent article, in which he suggests trading Span due to outfield depth. I thought about the fact that it is pretty widely accepted in a lot of places that the Twins have outfield depth, but do they really?

    I'm not sure what this means exactly in terms of how far beyond 2012 we're looking, but I guess the conclusion I came to is that we have a lot of young outfielders, but true outfield depth, imo, would be a situation where we have multiple outfielders that are fighting for playing time because they are high quality players. They certainly don't have that now, and I also don't see it in the next couple of years.

    Left field is the only solid spot for the next couple of years, with Willingham there and then Span in center (assuming he's not traded). After that, this team really doesn't currently have a legitimate RF and has a couple of #4 outfielders on the bench. I think that Revere could be starting for this team, but I'm not convinced he's a starting caliber outfielder yet. In the minors, people like to talk about Benson and Hicks as the promising future out there, but they are both currently at AA and they're looking anything but promising right now. Maybe Parmelee has had some promising stretches, but nothing convincing yet that he's an everyday player (it was nice to see him play well in AAA again and will be interesting to see what he does as he arrives back here).

    For comparison, take a look at Michael Cuddyer's minor league numbers and compare them to any of our current prospects. Cuddyer is a solid, maybe slightly above average, starter in the majors. Only one season in the minors did he post an OPS below .800, his first season in AA as a 20 year-old. For his remaining 3 years in the minors he proceeded to crush minor league pitching at the AA and AAA level.

    Setting aside whether we should trade Span (I think that's a different, though related debate), I know we like to look to the future thinking we have OF depth and then slot guys like Revere, Benson, and Hicks into the big league lineups a couple years down the road. However, I really think that we're overrating how much depth we have in the minors in the outfield, at least right now and for the immediate future.
    Last edited by Alex; 06-08-2012 at 10:19 AM.

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    Cuddyer wasn't an OF in the minors, he didn't become a regular OF until I think his 2nd or third year at the bigs.

    Also, we may not have star caliber players, but we do have a lot of OF'ers who could fill in and/or platoon. Tosoni, Mastroianni, Thomas, Dinkleman, Plouffe, Parmelee, Carson, and Benson are all capable of playing at least a few games in OF at the bigs. They may not be superstars, but they could keep the spot warm this year, and this offseason there are quite a few potential OF free agents.

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    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
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    I wrote about that earlier this week, saying that it was a myth that the Twins had a lot of OF depth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spideyo View Post
    Cuddyer wasn't an OF in the minors, he didn't become a regular OF until I think his 2nd or third year at the bigs.

    Also, we may not have star caliber players, but we do have a lot of OF'ers who could fill in and/or platoon. Tosoni, Mastroianni, Thomas, Dinkleman, Plouffe, Parmelee, Carson, and Benson are all capable of playing at least a few games in OF at the bigs. They may not be superstars, but they could keep the spot warm this year, and this offseason there are quite a few potential OF free agents.
    The list of players you mention just proved Alex's point. Half of the guys on that list are on their way out of baseball, or should be soon.
    Each one of those guys, except Benson(hopefully), is a dime a dozen with practically no upside.

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    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Depth they have, more prospects who are ready for the majors they do not have at the moment. "Trading Span because of OF depth" is a dumb, stupid, idiotic idea (but what do you expect from Souhan?). Trading Span because starting pitching is needed is another idea not dumb (though I disagree with it).

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    Quote Originally Posted by shanewahl View Post
    Depth they have, more prospects who are ready for the majors they do not have at the moment. "Trading Span because of OF depth" is a dumb, stupid, idiotic idea (but what do you expect from Souhan?). Trading Span because starting pitching is needed is another idea not dumb (though I disagree with it).
    Well, I wasn't trying to be critical of Souhan in particular because I think it's a relatively accepted idea in the mainstream.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    I wrote about that earlier this week, saying that it was a myth that the Twins had a lot of OF depth.
    Doh! Sorry I missed this one Seth. Normally I try to keep track and even did a little search of the forums for a similar topic as I hadn't been around much this week.

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    Senior Member All-Star Shane Wahl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    Doh! Sorry I missed this one Seth. Normally I try to keep track and even did a little search of the forums for a similar topic as I hadn't been around much this week.
    Your take was still a little different than Seth's so it is perfectly fine. And it gave me a chance to rip on Souhan some more, so that's a plus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shanewahl View Post
    Your take was still a little different than Seth's so it is perfectly fine. And it gave me a chance to rip on Souhan some more, so that's a plus.
    You need more/new reasons??? That doesn't seem likely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CDog View Post
    You need more/new reasons??? That doesn't seem likely.
    It might be envy. I envy people who have such jobs, saying things that are not very intelligent.

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    Maybe "depth" in the sense that there are more players at roughly the same level of effectiveness than there are at-bats to go around. They can't be all that deep if they only have two major-league ready starting Outfielders. It reminds me of when they had Bobby Kielty and Dustan Mohr sort-of platooning. That's not so much depth as it is not having anyone good enough to be the go-to starter. Lew Ford, Michael Restovich and Michael Ryan were all AAAA guys that weren't getting it done. So the Twins traded for Shannon Stewart and then they had *some* depth in that they could have Lew Ford come in when one of the Soul Patrol needed a day off.

    The current team is similar in the outfield to 2002/2003 but tilted more to Offense over Defense starting. Revere has been pretty good this second time around, he might end up being the guy to take that 3rd spot. It seems like he's going to be given the chance to do it.

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    I am just embarrassed for all of you that read Souhan, much less try to put some credence to whatever spilled out of his fingers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fire Dan Gladden View Post
    I am just embarrassed for all of you that read Souhan, much less try to put some credence to whatever spilled out of his fingers.
    Tip of the cap to you...

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    Quote Originally Posted by I Love Dan Gladden View Post
    I am just embarrassed for all of you that read Souhan, much less try to put some credence to whatever spilled out of his fingers.
    Completely agree. Souhan is an embarrasement.

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    Twins Moderator All-Star twinsnorth49's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fire Dan Gladden View Post
    I am just embarrassed for all of you that read Souhan, much less try to put some credence to whatever spilled out of his fingers.
    Quote Originally Posted by DJSim22 View Post
    Completely agree. Souhan is an embarrasement.
    I long ago decided the only way to rid myself of Souhan loathing was to stop reading him, so I did. I am cleansed.

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    If you consider some platooning situation of Plouffe, Parmelee, Doumit, and Mauer in RF a feasible solution, and you consider Revere to be an everyday starting CF, then we have INCREDIBLE depth for a bench-warming 4th OF who only plays about three innings a week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seth Stohs View Post
    I wrote about that earlier this week, saying that it was a myth that the Twins had a lot of OF depth.
    Where do you think he stole the idea from?

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    Quote Originally Posted by twinsnorth49 View Post
    I long ago decided the only way to rid myself of Souhan loathing was to stop reading him, so I did. I am cleansed.
    I've been on the same treatment program for quite a long while...yet the loathing continues. Alas. Perhaps I need to go to some sort of "alternative medicine" type thing.

  19. #19
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    The Twins don't have a lot of outfield depth.

    The difference between Span and Revere is not insignificant, but if you can improve your rotation enough to compensate for that difference plus some, I'd absolutely trade Span. It would have to be the right pitcher, though. A young guy with credentials that will be under team control for a few years.

  20. #20
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    Does the general consensus (with which I concur) about the Twins NOT having depth in the OF disclose future intentions of the club? They drafted Buxton and Walker with top picks this week and they have Arcia, Rosario and possibly Sano ready to become ML outfielders as early as 2015 (earlier?). Are they thinking about the post-Willingham and Span lineup and will cast off most of the rest of this list to prepare for an OF anchored by Revere in center and some combination of the aforementioned youngsters. Not saying it is the right or wrong thinking, just wondering if that is what the Twins are thinking. This would mean a rebuilding process with some growing pains, perhaps precluding a winner until 2016 or later.

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