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Thread: Game Thread: Twins v Yankees, 7/6 @ 1:10pm CT

  1. #101
    Senior Member All-Star James's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark's Lounge View Post
    What is it - 1980's day on TD? Lots of talk about cocaine.
    You can come up with statistics to prove anything. Forty percent of all people know that.

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  3. #102
    Twins Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glunn View Post
    If you could be the owner of the Twins for one day, and could fire the GM, would you do it? If so, who would you try to hire as the new GM?
    I wouldn't fire him. But I think it may prove to be a moot question by season's end, as Ryan's health situation may make it wiser to let him move to a consulting/subordinate role anyway. The question then is whether to promote from within, and from what I've seen of Antony I would guess that his strengths play better in a subordinate role as well. Somebody's 45-year-old assistant GM is probably the way to go, and I don't know which of the other teams' candidates to recommend.

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  5. #103
    Head Moderator MVP glunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    I would fire him. My primary basis for doing so would be the stagnant nature of the front office staff and the field staff over the past few years. Other than the 3 token coaching terminations, we haven't seen anything that would lead us to believe that there was any change in the "business as usual" nature of the FO decisions. Yes, they spent a little more in free agency this year but they certainly didn't spend near their limit.

    I felt -- and continue to feel -- that Gardenhire needed to be gone before this season. As I've mentioned before, I think he may well be a good manager elsewhere. There is just too much same old, same old to keep him (and Rick Anderson) with the Twins. And I think someone from outside the organization should have been hired for the manager's job. Perhaps the move would be more symbolic than effectual but at some point, I think you need to show that you are serious about changing the culture.

    I'm lousy at questions of who to hire plus as we are seeing elsewhere, there are the questions of who would take the GM job. But again, I would be looking for someone from outside the organization and I would empower that person to make whatever changes need to be made including replacing whatever front office and field staff needs to be replaced.

    That type of change isn't easy and sounds pretty hard-hearted. And the decision to do so would be difficult when you look at the prospects that the Twins have coming up. But I'm reminded again that prospects are just that -- prospects. We haven't seen them prove anything yet and there are a lot of decisions that need to be made about how to make some of those prospects flourish in the majors.

    I've been ready for a change for some time.
    I feel basically the same way. I would also be looking very closely at the A's FO to try to identify someone who could help the Twins be more like the A's.

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  7. #104
    Twins Moderator All-Star ChiTownTwinsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glunn View Post
    If you could be the owner of the Twins for one day, and could fire the GM, would you do it? If so, who would you try to hire as the new GM?
    Yes. I've been saying this for a while now. If you want meaningful change, from the FO to the field, that starts at the top, with the GM. Nothing else in the Twins changes in a meaningful way without that. It's time to bring in someone from the outside to steer a new and different course. As for who that should be? I have no idea. And one day isn't long enough to conduct a meaningful search.

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  9. #105
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
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    I was at the game yesterday afternoon. What a great day for baseball. The weather was perfect. The ending was a little wild
    I couldn't be a player because of bad eyesight, so I decided to be an umpire instead.

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  11. #106
    Twins Moderator All-Star ChiTownTwinsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glunn View Post
    I feel basically the same way. I would also be looking very closely at the A's FO to try to identify someone who could help the Twins be more like the A's.
    I disagree with this. Not the change part ... but looking for someone to make us into another A's or another Rays or another Cardinals. I want someone to come in with fresh eyes, discern what is truly good and not, and create what works for the Twins; yes, using what has been successful for them in the past, but taking that to create a new direction and create a new 'Twins way' that works.

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  13. #107
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiTownTwinsFan View Post
    I disagree with this. Not the change part ... but looking for someone to make us into another A's or another Rays or another Cardinals. I want someone to come in with fresh eyes, discern what is truly good and not, and create what works for the Twins; yes, using what has been successful for them in the past, but taking that to create a new direction and create a new 'Twins way' that works.
    Well, I liked Glunn's post anyway but your approach is actually the one I favor.

    There must be things that the Twins do/have done that work and are worth keeping. And there are undoubtedly some personnel who should be kept.

    But ultimately, I want someone who can chart a new course for the organization combining the best of what has worked while adding some of the best of "what's new" that may work elsewhere.

    I like that the organization has a long-term view and I wouldn't expect quick miracles but when I think of long-term view, I'm looking more at 10-12 years rather than the 20+ we're at now.

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  15. #108
    Senior Member All-Star Hosken Bombo Disco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glunn View Post
    If you could be the owner of the Twins for one day, and could fire the GM, would you do it? If so, who would you try to hire as the new GM?
    Gardenhire and Ryan ought to have the decency to offer their resignations. I wouldn't accept Ryan's but would also hire on some acceptable assistant GMs who might be considered as a successor.

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  17. #109
    Twins Moderator All-Star ChiTownTwinsFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    Well, I liked Glunn's post anyway but your approach is actually the one I favor.

    There must be things that the Twins do/have done that work and are worth keeping. And there are undoubtedly some personnel who should be kept.

    But ultimately, I want someone who can chart a new course for the organization combining the best of what has worked while adding some of the best of "what's new" that may work elsewhere.

    I like that the organization has a long-term view and I wouldn't expect quick miracles but when I think of long-term view, I'm looking more at 10-12 years rather than the 20+ we're at now.
    I think they should make us co-GM's

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  19. #110
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    BUXTON WATCH: He's 0-1

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  21. #111
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiTownTwinsFan View Post
    I think they should make us co-GM's
    You might be fine. I'd be a disaster.

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  23. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB_Iowa View Post
    I would fire him. My primary basis for doing so would be the stagnant nature of the front office staff and the field staff over the past few years. Other than the 3 token coaching terminations, we haven't seen anything that would lead us to believe that there was any change in the "business as usual" nature of the FO decisions. Yes, they spent a little more in free agency this year but they certainly didn't spend near their limit.

    I felt -- and continue to feel -- that Gardenhire needed to be gone before this season. As I've mentioned before, I think he may well be a good manager elsewhere. There is just too much same old, same old to keep him (and Rick Anderson) with the Twins. And I think someone from outside the organization should have been hired for the manager's job. Perhaps the move would be more symbolic than effectual but at some point, I think you need to show that you are serious about changing the culture.

    I'm lousy at questions of who to hire plus as we are seeing elsewhere, there are the questions of who would take the GM job. But again, I would be looking for someone from outside the organization and I would empower that person to make whatever changes need to be made including replacing whatever front office and field staff needs to be replaced.

    That type of change isn't easy and sounds pretty hard-hearted. And the decision to do so would be difficult when you look at the prospects that the Twins have coming up. But I'm reminded again that prospects are just that -- prospects. We haven't seen them prove anything yet and there are a lot of decisions that need to be made about how to make some of those prospects flourish in the majors.

    I've been ready for a change for some time.
    A thoughtful, heartfelt analysis.

    My 2 cents: I know it wasn't the same owner, but I remember Billy Martin getting fired after one season, and won the division. So change came quickly then. Just not now.

  24. #113
    Twins Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaykay View Post
    BUXTON WATCH: He's 0-1
    Trade him. Add Duensing to sweeten the deal, of course.

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  26. #114
    Head Moderator MVP glunn's Avatar
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    Arcia needs another HBP here.

  27. #115
    Senior Member All-Star Bark's Lounge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiTownTwinsFan View Post
    I disagree with this. Not the change part ... but looking for someone to make us into another A's or another Rays or another Cardinals. I want someone to come in with fresh eyes, discern what is truly good and not, and create what works for the Twins; yes, using what has been successful for them in the past, but taking that to create a new direction and create a new 'Twins way' that works.
    If this were based on the subject of original music, writing or art, I would totally agree with you on this one Chi - mimicking the work of others is sacrilegious... in the arts.

    With baseball, I don't necessarily think originality is necessary, especially with the direction this game is moving in. In a baseball situation, I think copying some philosophies of other teams is a good thing, you can pick and choose from the philosophies as you please. I also do not think that being a baseball GM comes without the chance to be creative or having an outside the box approach.

    In my opinion the Cardinals run their ship the right way. They are built for success now, and for the future. By whatever means they analyze and scout the players they draft or sign. It is working, and working well. I would target their personnel department for GM change.

    As for Billy Beane's Athletics, they have mortgaged their future for the present, and they have been pretty crafty in doing so. They have gotten a bit lucky - at least a little bit. If they win a World Series this year or next, it will most probably been worth it and Billy Beane will be hailed as a genious. In two years time they will be cellar dwellers.

  28. #116
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    Even with Arcia looking at strike three, I'm diggin' this shagadelic comeback. Yeah, baby!

  29. #117
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    BUXTON WATCH: He just made an "unbelievable" diving catch at the track to save two runs.

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  31. #118
    Twins Moderator MVP ashburyjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark's Lounge View Post
    In my opinion the Cardinals run their ship the right way. They are built for success now, and for the future. By whatever means they analyze and scout the players they draft or sign. It is working, and working well. I would target their personnel department for GM change.
    It's also possible to find a young and dynamic candidate stuck in an organization that fails to impress. That might be more interesting to me than taking someone steeped in a tradition that already is fully exploited.

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  33. #119
    Head Moderator MVP glunn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark's Lounge View Post
    If this were based on the subject of original music, writing or art, I would totally agree with you on this one Chi - mimicking the work of others is sacrilegious... in the arts.

    With baseball, I don't necessarily think originality is necessary, especially with the direction this game is moving in. In a baseball situation, I think copying some philosophies of other teams is a good thing, you can pick and choose from the philosophies as you please. I also do not think that being a baseball GM comes without the chance to be creative or having an outside the box approach.

    In my opinion the Cardinals run their ship the right way. They are built for success now, and for the future. By whatever means they analyze and scout the players they draft or sign. It is working, and working well. I would target their personnel department for GM change.

    As for Billy Beane's Athletics, they have mortgaged their future for the present, and they have been pretty crafty in doing so. They have gotten a bit lucky - at least a little bit. If they win a World Series this year or next, it will most probably been worth it and Billy Beane will be hailed as a genious. In two years time they will be cellar dwellers.
    This makes sense to me. I would like to see different ideas that have been successful somewhere else. The Cardinals seem to have some strategies that have produced consistent success. Why not copy something that works, while making small changes that are intended to make it even better?

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  35. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by glunn View Post
    Arcia needs another HBP here.
    He should be in AAA honing this skill.

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