Minnesota Twins News & Rumors Forum
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 23

Thread: Eduardo Escobar Blog Entry

  1. #1
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
    Posts
    3,579
    Like
    199
    Liked 534 Times in 347 Posts
    Blog Entries
    32

    Eduardo Escobar Blog Entry

    I wanted to start a discussion on the status of Escobar as an everyday player. I decided to contrast and compare him with previous Twins' utility infielders. Due to the length of that comparison, I posted the entry as a blog entry http://twinsdaily.com/entry.php/5400...ity-Infielders

    I hope this starts some conversation about the future roles on the Twins of Eduardo Escobar.

  2. These 3 users like stringer bell's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    jorgenswest (06-22-2014), snepp (06-22-2014), USAFChief (06-22-2014)

  3. #2
    Senior Member Triple-A goulik's Avatar
    Posts
    295
    Like
    44
    Liked 15 Times in 11 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    Nice write up. As a Utility guy, Punto has always been my favorite for the leadership he brought. Escobars personality rivals Punto and I think he has that same potential. His stats this year are starter worthy though so we will see what he is Long term

  4. #3
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
    Posts
    746
    Like
    28
    Liked 60 Times in 48 Posts
    Blog Entries
    9
    I think Escobar is still developing and transitioning from being a utility player to being an everyday one. He is now the everyday SS. The only reason he is playing third is because Plouffe is hurt and Santana doesn't have experience there.

    On a fun note there was an article about the top 10 utility players of all time in terms of playing time Reboulet was number 1, Newman made the top 10 and so did Hocking. Punto was a starter so he wasn't in the running. I think its funny that the Twins value middle IF back up consistency so much more than all of the other teams.

  5. #4
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
    Posts
    540
    Like
    59
    Liked 87 Times in 54 Posts
    What about Matt Tolbert - 4 years, 103 2B, 64 3B, 51 SS, .230 BA, 3 HR, 17 SB, .607 OPS, 65 OPS+ (between Punto and Carroll).

    Best utility guy ever for the Twinks was Cesar Tovar IMHO, but he started quite a bit - CF, 2B and 3B. And of course the game where he played all 9 positions (and struck out Reggie Jackson!)
    Last edited by ScottyB; 06-22-2014 at 09:02 AM.

  6. #5
    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
    Posts
    6,509
    Twitter
    @sethtweets
    Like
    68
    Liked 379 Times in 200 Posts
    Blog Entries
    515
    In a utility infielder, I definitely believe in defense-first. Punto was perfectly cast as a utility infielder because he was so good at all three infield positions. That's been the mold that the team has looked for, as you pointed out, since Newman.

    Escobar was always considered a utility guy, likely because he came up with the White Sox as a utility guy. Even though he was like 21 or 22. This is really the first time he's been given a chance to be an everyday player, and he's performed well. The question is whether or not he can continue to hit, and post a .750+ OPS. I don't think we know that answer yet. At worse, he's a terrific utility infielder.

  7. #6
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
    Posts
    3,579
    Like
    199
    Liked 534 Times in 347 Posts
    Blog Entries
    32
    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyB View Post
    What about Matt Tolbert - 4 years, 103 2B, 64 3B, 51 SS, .230 BA, 3 HR, 17 SB, .607 OPS, 65 OPS+ (between Punto and Carroll).

    Best utility guy ever for the Twinks was Cesar Tovar IMHO, but he started quite a bit - CF, 2B and 3B. And of course the game where he played all 9 positions (and struck out Reggie Jackson!)
    Oops, forgot about Tolbert. I guess I didn't remember him playing short enough to be a three-position guy. I think of Tovar as an unassigned regular. For several years, he was in the lineup every day, including one year when he played 164 games. The nine positions thing was a stunt, but he played a lot of games at second, third, short and the outfield. I have been hoping the Twins would develop a super-utility guy like Tony Phillips was for the A's and the Tigers, a true starter who could move all over the diamond

  8. #7
    Senior Member Triple-A Paul Pleiss's Avatar
    Posts
    438
    Twitter
    @baseballpirate
    Like
    116
    Liked 97 Times in 66 Posts
    Blog Entries
    76
    I think it's easy to imagine Escobar sticking around for a few years. With Sano's expected arrival next season sometime, it will be interesting to see what the Twins do with Plouffe. Does he become a bench bat, 3B, corner OF guy? I think Danny Santana will be a key player to watch when thinking about the long term viability of a guy like Escobar. At this point, he's played well enough defensively, has positional versatility and has been hitting great. If he keeps hitting, the Twins will keep playing him everyday. If not, I think he still has value as a utility guy. Maybe could even handle some OF duties with some work int he off-season or spring training. Ben Zobrist type?

  9. #8
    Senior Member All-Star Sconnie's Avatar
    Posts
    1,099
    Like
    615
    Liked 397 Times in 262 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    The phrase "utility infielder" in context with the Minnesota Twins brings shudders up my spine. In other organizations it wouldn't any more than "fourth outfielder", except Gardy loves to play the fourth outfielder Ala Nick Punto every day.

    I don't have a problem with Escobar playing every day. As SS goes, he's the best combination of hitting and fielding since Hardy, but he's no where near the hitter that Hardy is. If Santana can prove himself to be THE Shortstop, it would be awesome to have Escobar as the utility infielder, provided the manager plays him as such. Additionally Esco can play a descent 3base and 2base without his hitting suffering too badly, I think he's a very good candidate.

    if Santana can't prove himself to be THE SS, Esco is a fine stopgap.

  10. #9
    Owner MVP Seth Stohs's Avatar
    Posts
    6,509
    Twitter
    @sethtweets
    Like
    68
    Liked 379 Times in 200 Posts
    Blog Entries
    515
    Quote Originally Posted by Sconnie View Post
    The phrase "utility infielder" in context with the Minnesota Twins brings shudders up my spine. In other organizations it wouldn't any more than "fourth outfielder", except Gardy loves to play the fourth outfielder Ala Nick Punto every day.
    This isn't actually true, though backups do need to play to keep fresh and starters do need days off. Escobar wouldn't be playing as much this year if Florimon hadn't been so terrible. Dozier and Plouffe play most every day, and Florimon would have played 4 of 5, or 4 of 6 if he were doing much of anything this year.

  11. These 2 users like Seth Stohs's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    DocBauer (06-23-2014), Sconnie (06-26-2014)

  12. #10
    Please ban me! All-Star stringer bell's Avatar
    Posts
    3,579
    Like
    199
    Liked 534 Times in 347 Posts
    Blog Entries
    32
    Agree Seth. The meme that Punto was played because Gardy loved his game was flawed because most of the time Punto played, he was the best the club had to offer, sadly.

  13. This user likes stringer bell's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Sconnie (06-26-2014)

  14. #11
    Member Single-A
    Posts
    50
    Like
    0
    Liked 4 Times in 2 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Escobar has been one of my favorite players this season. All he does is hit and play great defense. How many doubles does he have now? If I were selecting a mid-season Twins MVP, I might be tempted to go with Dozier, but I am more tempted to go with either Escobar or Suzuki. Dozier plays great defense, hits homers, and hustles. Escobar plays defense very well, hustles, battles his tail off, to use one of Gardy's favorite expressions, and he has been Mr. Clutch so often with the bat. Suzuki has been out of this world with the bat, great working with the pitching staff (has caught four games in a row), and also hustles. His one area of weakness is gunning down base stealers, but, hey, he's doing everything else so well that the base stealing issue is really no issue to this point.

    The good news is that there are so many possible mid-season MVPs to this point.

  15. #12
    Senior Member All-Star Thrylos's Avatar
    Posts
    4,172
    Twitter
    @thrylos98
    Like
    36
    Liked 446 Times in 273 Posts
    Blog Entries
    200
    Quote Originally Posted by ScottyB View Post
    Best utility guy ever for the Twinks was Cesar Tovar IMHO, but he started quite a bit - CF, 2B and 3B. And of course the game where he played all 9 positions (and struck out Reggie Jackson!)
    I'd take Bill Larkin and Randy Bush over Tovar any time. They got the rings to prove it too
    -----
    Blogging Twins since 2007 at The Tenth Inning Stretch
    http://tenthinningstretch.blogspot.com/
    twitter: @thrylos98

  16. #13
    Twins Moderator MVP USAFChief's Avatar
    Posts
    6,606
    Like
    3,678
    Liked 3,166 Times in 1,355 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrylos View Post
    I'd take Bill Larkin and Randy Bush over Tovar any time. They got the rings to prove it too
    Bill Larkin?
    Every post is not every other post. - a wise man

  17. This user likes USAFChief's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Hosken Bombo Disco (06-22-2014)

  18. #14
    Senior Member All-Star Bark's Lounge's Avatar
    Posts
    1,642
    Like
    312
    Liked 504 Times in 195 Posts
    Blog Entries
    34
    I am happy to see what Escobar has done thus far into the season. The guy is no pip squeak, he may not be the tallest guy or have a lot of girth, but he is built pretty sturdy, has some meat one his bones.

    The thunder in his bat is real and he has some speed, he can stick at SS and has a cannon of an arm.

    Right now, it is all about whether his bat is smoke and mirrors, of which I don't believe to be the case. If he can keep his average over .260, I believe you will get the necessary outcome you want from your starting SS.

  19. These 2 users like Bark's Lounge's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    Oldgoat_MN (06-23-2014), Paul Pleiss (06-22-2014)

  20. #15
    Senior Member All-Star Hosken Bombo Disco's Avatar
    Posts
    1,042
    Like
    1,637
    Liked 489 Times in 285 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrylos View Post
    I'd take Bill Larkin and Randy Bush over Tovar any time. They got the rings to prove it too
    Larkin and Bush were good, but were primarily OF/DH types, similar to Bill Parmelee's role today.

  21. This user likes Hosken Bombo Disco's post and wants to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    USAFChief (06-22-2014)

  22. #16
    Senior Member All-Star Bark's Lounge's Avatar
    Posts
    1,642
    Like
    312
    Liked 504 Times in 195 Posts
    Blog Entries
    34
    Quote Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post
    Bill Larkin?
    He can't mean Barry Larkin... Right?

  23. #17
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer Kirby_Waved_At_Me's Avatar
    Posts
    588
    Like
    61
    Liked 166 Times in 87 Posts
    "Mean" Gene Larkin.

  24. #18
    Senior Member Big-Leaguer
    Posts
    540
    Like
    59
    Liked 87 Times in 54 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrylos View Post
    I'd take Bill Larkin and Randy Bush over Tovar any time. They got the rings to prove it too
    They were bench guys 1B; corner OF; DH; PH, not utility guys, and my statement stands.

    Tovar: 8 years (as a Twin); 76 games SS; 178 - 3B; 185 - 2B; 281 - LF; 370 - CF; 127 - RF
    WAR 21.7; SB's - 35 - 1968, 45 - 1969, 30 - 1970; BA - .281; OPB - .335; OPS - .703; OPS+ - 100; Led League in Games Played 1967 - 164, Plate Appearances 1967 - 726, AB's 1967 - 649, Hits 1971 - 204, Doubles 1970 - 36, Triples 1970 - 13; 5 times in the top 25 in League MVP voting.

    He was an everyday player, but you could plug him in anywhere and count on good to excellent defense and ability to hit. He wasn't a power guy, but he was a spark plug.

    That my friend is the definition of utility. On my all-time Twins team, he is definitely at the head of the class as my utility player.

    By the way in 7 and 12 years as Twins, Larkin and Bush each had a total WAR of 1.6 each. I'll take Tovar over Larkin and Bush any time (even with their rings).

  25. These 2 users like ScottyB's post and want to buy him/her a steak dinner:

    messed up (06-23-2014), USAFChief (06-23-2014)

  26. #19
    Senior Member All-Star JB_Iowa's Avatar
    Posts
    3,325
    Like
    1,303
    Liked 1,284 Times in 742 Posts
    Derek Wetmore had a nice little human interest story on Escobar. Thought I'd post it here:

    http://www.1500espn.com/sportswire/O...he_wave_062314

  27. #20
    Senior Member Triple-A DocBauer's Avatar
    Posts
    454
    Like
    215
    Liked 173 Times in 98 Posts
    Blog Entries
    10
    Escobar was unfairly tagged with the monicker "utility player" because he was brought up too quickly by the Sox, and sat on the bench and was used as a fill in. When the Twins acquired him, I believe, they saw potential as a SS, but he hadn't show much with the bat to that point, and last year we had Florimon.

    This season, obviously, preparation, talent and opportunity have manifested itself in to an everyday, quality ball player. He has shown the ability to hit, produce some pop and the speed to make it count, and I don't think it's a fluke. Now, a .290 hitter? I'm doubting it. Just as I doubt Santana is truly a .320 hitter. I mean, how many are there in baseball? But even with regression, I think both these guys can hit. I believe Santa, with better speed, is probably a candidate for the better career hitting numbers overall.

    What impresses me most about each of them, frankly, is the approach each has at the plate. Neither looks intimidated or overmatched. When they make outs, even strike out, they don't look silly or seem as though they don't belong. Santana in particular impresses me considering his youth, his lack of AAA experience, and a reputation of being impatient. And yet, he's actually walking a bit. And maybe it's just when I watch/listen but he seems to always take a lot of pitches, and does a nice job fouling off offerings, making the pitcher work. And when both these guys get their extra base hits, they don't seem to be the bloop or badly played variety, but rather solid line drives to a gap or down the line.

    And when it comes to utility types, don't forget about Nunez. Minors and majors he's shown the ability to hit, posses a little power and some speed. He might not posses the best glove of the three, but he's at least capable.

    Now, now maybe next season, maybe this season, everything comes crashing down. But I doubt it. Not with talent possessed, and what we've seen so far. How awesome to have Dozier at 2B, two potential quality SS's who can hit and contribute, and a true solid utility guy in Nunez?! Just a couple seasons ago we were borderline desperate for anyone to fill in our middle infield. And this doesn't include Polanco, possibly Rosario, and Gordon farther down the line.

    Going forward, I really like Escobar, and have enjoyed him finally getting his shot. Assuming CF is at least temporarily settled next season, I guess he and Santana fight it out for the starting SS job. I'm not sure we lose there. Ultimately, Santana is probably the more dynamic athlete with the greater potential. But whichever plays the best overall will be the starter, and the other will assume a "utility" role. And that's not a bad thing. As stated, from Newman to Reboulet and Hocking to Pinto, the Twins have enjoyed valuable contributions over the past years from players in that role. And over such a long season, and 6 games a week, this is a very important part of your ball club.

    I know we've all been sick of an OF at times this season that has consisted of middle infielders filling 2 or even all 3 spots at times. And I pray better health and roster building precludes this from happening again. However, at times, all of these guys been out there. All three of these guys have some athletic ability and baseball acumen. And to create maximum roster flexibility and efficiency, whoever doesn't start, I'd like to see drill more on the OF in order to provide OF play as an option on their "utility" resume.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
©2014 TwinsCentric, LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Interested in advertising with Twins Daily? Click here.